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Guest gks

Bats

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Guest gks

A team had illegal bats.  They were removed.  They were left with only -3.  (we are Jr's and can use -8 if they are legal).  They asked if they could use our smaller bats.  This is playoffs.  Am I required to let them use our bats??

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was this LL?

 

required, no, however, good sportsmanship says you should IMO

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Guest gks

Yes,  Jr Little league Play offs.  (13, 14 yr olds)  Against a coach who is very difficult and doesn't show good sportsmanship and argued about his illegal bats.  He should have known they were illegal.  

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5 minutes ago, Guest gks said:

Yes,  Jr Little league Play offs.  (13, 14 yr olds)  Against a coach who is very difficult and doesn't show good sportsmanship and argued about his illegal bats.  He should have known they were illegal.  

he should have I'd agree.  The question is, what example do you want to set for the kids?

 

since when are drop 8s allowed in LL JR?  I thought only BBCOR was drop 3s

 

I was a LL JR coach a couple of years back so I understand your view.  for the future, I don't know who recognized the illegal bats, however, if it was your team, you may want to keep that in your pocket for once there's an AB, if used in the game, you can get a cheap out. 

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Dumb question but how did they get this far without someone noticing the illegal bats?

Ok, as per above you are not required to let them use your bats but it would be good sportsmanship to do so.

That said, this is the playoffs and it's your job to do what you can to help your team win, so saying No might be the right thing to do.

Your call.

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9 minutes ago, stkjock said:

he should have I'd agree.  The question is, what example do you want to set for the kids?

 

since when are drop 8s allowed in LL JR?  I thought only BBCOR was drop 3s

 

I was a LL JR coach a couple of years back so I understand your view.  for the future, I don't know who recognized the illegal bats, however, if it was your team, you may want to keep that in your pocket for once there's an AB, if used in the game, you can get a cheap out. 

USA bats have no drop limitation and are approved for Minors thru Intermediate. LL also allows BBCOR for Intermediate and Junior and requires BBCOR for Seniors. 

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Just considering how expensive some bats can be, I would, as a parent who purchased said bats, not be thrilled to have my kids coach allow the other team to use my son's bat. 

If only LL baseball would distribute to all of the managers, coaches and umpires some form of document which would codify their rules in one easy to access resource. They could bound such book in an easy to see color scheme, like Green, and hand it out to leagues and other participants so that we can all know the rules and be on the same page.

Oh, wait...

Too bad for the other coach who allowed his players to use illegal bats all season. Sorry they only will be swinging bats they are not use to... However, keep in mind the old adage "if you're not cheating, you're not trying', so maybe this was the other coach just doing his normal thing and trying to get advantages he was not entitled to.

Too bad the illegal bats were discovered prior to the game. as the penalty in Allstars is quite severe for use of illegal bats. Sounds like it would have been fun for this coach to get caught using these not eligible bats.

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7 minutes ago, Mudisfun said:

Too bad the illegal bats were discovered prior to the game. as the penalty in Allstars is quite severe for use of illegal bats. Sounds like it would have been fun for this coach to get caught using these not eligible bats.

:D I lived through that happening.  LL Majors back in 2015, kid comes to the plate with a big barrel bat, one of my players says something, I told the manager to call time.  We questioned the bat, Bristol gets called (local guys didn't know what to do) kid ejected, head coach ejected, coach (iirc) has to sit next game as well.  then I'm first base coach and the opposing team had the 1st base line... boy did I get an earful from the parents/fans....  

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2 hours ago, Lou B said:

Dumb question but how did they get this far without someone noticing the illegal bats?

Ok, as per above you are not required to let them use your bats but it would be good sportsmanship to do so.

That said, this is the playoffs and it's your job to do what you can to help your team win, so saying No might be the right thing to do.

Your call.

We had this happen and the team just sent a parent to Academy. 

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29 minutes ago, Mudisfun said:

Just considering how expensive some bats can be, I would, as a parent who purchased said bats, not be thrilled to have my kids coach allow the other team to use my son's bat. ...

This ^^^

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Having worked in a league that checks bats before every game and then seeing the number of illegal bats set out for inspection in the district tournament, I was amazed that some leagues just let this go for the entire season.

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Not doing the pre-game equipment check/letting illegal bats go "could" be a big problem.

Kid uses an illegal bat and hits a screamer off the pitcher and he's seriously injured.  I wouldn't want to be on the wrong end of that lawsuit.  Safety rules are there for a reason.

Pre-game equipment checks are required in Little League.

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5 hours ago, Guest gks said:

A team had illegal bats.  They were removed.  They were left with only -3.  (we are Jr's and can use -8 if they are legal).  They asked if they could use our smaller bats.  This is playoffs.  Am I required to let them use our bats??

If you're in a league where the league provides its teams with bats, maybe - but that would beg the question to where the other team's legal bats are located.

Otherwise - Why would you be required to do so - they're YOUR bats.   And, in some cases, they might not even be YOURS...they belong to the individual kids (or their parents) - in what universe would I be required to let another kid use the bat I paid $300 for my kid to use?

Sportsmanship or not, I'm not permitting my kid's bat to be used by someone else.  They can buy it off me if they want, perhaps.  (because, my kid always has two bats)

You're not required to let the other team use your helmets, cleats, gloves or jocks either.  

 

NOTE: context is everything...if their team bus got robbed the night before I'd have a different perspective.  But showing up with illegal equipment - nfw.

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Bats!?

johnny depp fear GIF

 

Oh come on, Blue!  His parents spent a lot of money on that bat, and you are going to tell them their kid can’t use it!  This is about the kids, not you!  Nobody has said anything all year and YOU think you are some super bat-cop now!  That’s ridiculous!

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This dumbness on the part of teams is not limited to Little League.  It happened to me in Legion, too.  Five years ago, after a kid got a single in a Legion playoff game, the DHC came running out protesting that it was an illegal bat.   The state department used the BBCOR standard.  This bat did not have the BBCOR stamp on it.  OHC came out and argued and argued.  Finally I just said, “coach, no need to argue.  If I’m wrong, file a protest.  Otherwise, we’re done.”  His reply as he began to walk away was priceless, “but Blue, we only have two bats left!”

Thats right, they only had two bats that met the BBCOR standard.  Yup, I’m the dumbass!:rolleyes:

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Personally I have been checking bats and helmets for all 3 seasons I have been doing this. At the LL level its amazing the # of bats kids have for other leagues that do not conform to LL spec but they show up in the players bag cause they keep all their equipment together.  We just tell them  pre game take it out of the dugout and or give it to the tourney director to hang on to during the game.

I would say its on average 1 bat every other game during the season per game.  Last year we have only seen 1 or 2 cracked bats vs last year there were a lot of them. 

But as far as the question 

sigh As the HC of the other team tourney Not his problem.

If he’s a good sport then he will let you but don’t plan on it.

 

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Cup check anyone?

But seriously, I loved how Lawump handled this one...." If I’m wrong, file a protest." I wish more umpires and coaches would use this to resolve disputes. Somebody is going to definitely learn something out of this and know how to handle it next time.

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It amazes me that "are your players properly and legally equipped, to the best of your knowledge" is always answered yes!

 

Then, here comes an illegal bat.

Then, Catcher takes one to the step children and oh, he's not wearing a cup!

 

Coaches aren't listening at any point

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3 hours ago, udbrky said:

"are your players properly and legally equipped, to the best of your knowledge"

This might help.......

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I coached/managed youth ball (LL/travel) for 6 years, frankly, I cannot recall that question ever being asked in the 150+ games I was a part of.

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2 hours ago, stkjock said:

I coached/managed youth ball (LL/travel) for 6 years, frankly, I cannot recall that question ever being asked in the 150+ games I was a part of.

I just had a coach in Districts respond with a mumbled "uh-huh" I looked at him and and said, it's a yes or no question. If I don't hear, "yes" we don't play. 

As for bats, at the Juniors level, every player should have their own bat, it's not my decision as a coach to let somebody else use it. About half of my 13u team is swinging BBCOR. My son (13) just moved from a 32 drop 5 (USA) to a 31 inch BBCOR. But he's still hitting the ball 250-300 feet. And $300 is the midrange for anything heavier than a drop 10. I had one coach tell me that I was robbing him of distance by using a USA bat vs. a bpf 1.15, the next game he put one over the fence straight-a-way center. 330 feet. How much further does he need to hit it? Personally, I think the transition from USA to BBCOR is better. 

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At district/sectionals I was a AC and didn’t get any plate meetings.  As I said I can’t recall, doesn’t mean it was never asked, I’m getting old and all. :D 

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Team bats?.........yup I remember my playing days...coach brought the US Army issued duffle bag with the 2 team wood bats to each game.  (The big one and the little one.).....I cant say I've seen any "Team" bats in many years.............

The bats I see are high buck bats owned by the player himself.  I cant loan what I didn't supply.........

 

Just my .02

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Anybody run into the Quatro bat that sounds like it's cracked? If you didn't know about it you would pull it from the game.

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