Schutt XV chest protector

[JaxRolo]

What I am always curious about is if something is really THAT good, why don't more people use them?? 

 

Because they are ugly and inferior.

[Kevin_K]

 

What I am always curious about is if something is really THAT good, why don't more people use them?? 

 

Because they are ugly and inferior.

 

@JaxRolo....If that held true in all cases, many of us would never get any assignments. Right?

[blp79]

I just ordered the schutt xv from ump attire and received it today.I have used the Wilson charcoal for 7 seasons and I am curious how it will compare.First thing I noticed is how light it is.It has a low profile look and looks to be very breathable.so far the only complaint I have is the strapping system.They are very thin and seem cheap.I am ready to get behind the dish and test it out.

[kstrunk]

I got mine today as well. Stoked. Fits VERY well, super light, and sleek. Hoping the protection is there, 'cause I like it! 

 

I happen to like the harness, as it's more than just straps. but the torso strap might be a bit thin, though I don't have much to compare it to. 

 

Don't see how it's not a steal, at the $66 I paid for it! 

[Majordave]

Do what I did. Go to a high school practice and let pitchers throw baseballs at you in bullpen. Hahaha. I really did that 11years ago. Stupid yes, but I learned that the Diamond iX3 CP was NOT going to do the job for me before it was too late.

[conbo61]

Do what I did. Go to a high school practice and let pitchers throw baseballs at you in bullpen. Hahaha. I really did that 11years ago. Stupid yes, but I learned that the Diamond iX3 CP was NOT going to do the job for me before it was too late.

How many pitches did it take before you realized it wouldn't work?

[Majordave]

First damn pitch. The kid throwing wound up playing for Coastal Carolina. I felt every pitch.

[conbo61]

First damn pitch. The kid throwing wound up playing for Coastal Carolina. I felt every pitch.

"Every"? As in more than one after being convinced on the first? SMH...

[Majordave]

Yep. I was new. And stupid. Did I mention I was stupid? And I had been many of these kids' summer legion coach and/or football assistant coach and was some of their teacher. I was also trying to get used to locking in and staying in. I had yet to work a single game as a certified umpire. And, I was stupid.

[kylejt]

How to test a chest protector:

 

Get a baseball

 

Go to your local Goodwill, and buy a cheap golf club. Get a driver, with a graphite shaft, if you can pony up the $7.

 

Saw off the cub head.

 

Drill a hole in the baseball, a little bigger than the end of the shaft, going a little more than 1/2 through.

 

Fill the hole with Gorilla glue, and stick in the shaft.

 

Wait a day for it to dry.

 

Then, get a friend to wail on you with that rig, and test your c/p's protection. Straight blows to the chest, and collarbone.

 

You can go a season, and not take a square shot to your c/p. Plus, no two blows are the same. You may think your set-up is the best around, but do you really know? That's how I test all my rigs, and how I failed the Davishield after two blows to my ribs. That's also why I choose to wear either the Platinum or the All Star, as they have superior collar bone protection.

[MadMax]

@kylejt's post inspires my rationale as to why I dislike Wilson so much, and will never purchase, let alone wear, a Wilson-made CP.

You can go a season, and not take a square shot to your CP. Plus, no two blows are the same. You may think your set-up is the best around, but do you really know? That's how I test all my rigs, and how I failed the Davishield after two blows to my ribs. That's also why I choose to wear either the Platinum or the All Star, as they have superior collar bone protection.

If the West Vest Platinum is so superior, then why keep making the Gold??

I'm not disputing Kyle's opinion or evaluation — I'm challenging this large, exclusive manufacturer that supposedly has our safety and protection in mind, as to why they are not progressing, and are (apparently) reluctant to improve upon what must be, by logic, a flawed system.

For the matter of this discourse, we'll focus on competitive-level baseball only. How many models of CP does Force3 offer? One, in the Unequal. Is it perfect? No. How many models of CP does Schutt offer? With the debut of the XV, one. Is it perfect? No. How many models of CP does All-Star offer? Two, one hardshell and one softshell (would we really choose it if we had options?). Is it perfect? No, but from the read of it, it's close to ideal. How many does Diamond offer? Two. Champion? Two. Honig's? One. Rawlings? They won't even put a contender out there. Are any of these perfect? Hardly.

How many models of CP does Wilson offer? Four. Why? If the West Vest Gold is supposed to be _the_ ultimate and only CP we should be getting, then why have the Platinum? If the Platinum addresses shortcomings exposed by the Gold, then why still produce the Gold? Why still produce the A3217 and the Davishield? Don't give this line about "up-selling" and marketing. If you had the ideal, near-perfect model, then why would you produce anything else?

What sets me off against Wilson isn't that the CP's themselves are imperfect (as I said, nothing is perfect), but that A) Wilson hasn't done anything to improve them and B) there are a cadre of fellow umpires who arbitrarily and dogmatically endorse these CP's, going so far as to dismiss and ignore anything else!

So, I will fervently identify and support the efforts of companies like Force3, Schutt and All-Star. Game on, guys, game on.

[kylejt]

I just said those two, the Platinum and All Star, have superior collarbone protection. Other models have superior attributes.

 

The Davishield it the most comfortable rig I've worn. Fit, form and comfort. If I did softball, I'd wear it.

 

The ol' Riddell is the coolest. Strap that on in the parking lot, and you've got instant field cred.

 

Sport a Dodger blue Carlucci means you probably shook Cece's hand, and heard his stories. Cool factor +. It's the umpire's equivalent of shaking Sinatra's hand.

 

There is no "best" chest protector, IMO. Everybody is looking for something different. Me, I'm looking for the best protection, and will sacrifice bulk and heat to get it. Hell, the raft is the coolest (temp wise), and gives us the best protection. Everything is a compromise.

[MadMax]

That's why I have no issue with you or your perspective, @kylejt. You (and others) acknowledge that everything is a compromise.

[scrounge]

I didn't think the Gold lacked collarbone protection at all - quite the contrary in fact. You may say "don't give me this marketing stuff"...but that's exactly what it is. The others don't make multiple models because they don't have the market share to justify it. Wilson does have it. Some people like the fit of the Platinum, some like the Gold. Some people like gray, some like black. I thought the Gold fit me better and offered more protection, some may think it too bulky.

 

They offer both because they can. Your perfect may be my average, and vice versa.

[Hawkman]

I just said those two, the Platinum and All Star, have superior collarbone protection. Other models have superior attributes.

 

The Davishield it the most comfortable rig I've worn. Fit, form and comfort. If I did softball, I'd wear it.

 

The ol' Riddell is the coolest. Strap that on in the parking lot, and you've got instant field cred.

 

Sport a Dodger blue Carlucci means you probably shook Cece's hand, and heard his stories. Cool factor +. It's the umpire's equivalent of shaking Sinatra's hand.

 

There is no "best" chest protector, IMO. Everybody is looking for something different. Me, I'm looking for the best protection, and will sacrifice bulk and heat to get it. Hell, the raft is the coolest (temp wise), and give us the best protection. Everything is a compromise.

 

One of the most reasonable statements I've seen on an equipment forum. Everything is a compromise. Will I agree that I feel a hard shot slightly less in a Platinum than in my Honigs K-1? Yes, however what I feel in the K-1 isn't painful, it doesn't hurt or bruise, it's just a slight sting on a really hard direct shot. For me, well worth the tradeoff for a lighter, cooler and much more comfortable protector. Others may disagree which is cool, everyone is different.

 

I will say this regarding chest protectors; I've been umpiring for 15 years and have worked with a bunch of different partners over that time. I used to have a Platinum but I've never worked with one single other umpire who wore either a Platinum or a Gold. Not one. 

[midtnump]

What @kylejt and @MadMax is true and truely good wisdom, for me personally protection is key as well as body fit. We are all different, tall, short, thin, round, narrow shouldered, broad shouldered, etc. I will never discount the protective value of the Wilson line of CP's  as Kylejt has posted, it is all true. But after purchasing a Wilson Platnium as my first CP I soon found out it wasn't for me. It was too wide for my shoulder width and thickness .After adjusting and taping off the straps so they wouldn't slip, it still moved and caused me to get hit. I purchased a Douglas last year and it has a great body fit FOR ME  with excellent protection.

[kylejt]

My Platinum moved around on me, too. I was always yanking it up in between pitches. And yeah, I read about the Delta Flex harness, but I didn't really understand its value until I bought the System 7 c/p. Man, what a difference. Put that on any rig, and it completely changes how you go about your business. It's that good.

[midtnump]

My Platinum moved around on me, too. I was always yanking it up in between pitches. And yeah, I read about the Delta Flex harness, but I didn't really understand its value until I bought the System 7 c/p. Man, what a difference. Put that on any rig, and it completely changes how you go about your business. It's that good.

I too didn't know what I was missing with the DF until I bought it to help keep the Douglas setting high. I learned in HS football how to tape straps so they don't move hardly at all. I just simply had too much teetering front to back and side to side. After several large bruises I decided to make a change.

[MadMax]

I am now two weeks (10 games) into our season and my use of the new Schutt XV.

I love it.

Two things immediately caught my notice when I removed it from the box: First, it's light. Hella-light. We're talking J.Crew-makes-sweaters-heavier-than-this light. Second, it's got significantly more standoff (ie. thicker) padding than its AiR Flex I & II predecessors. But how's this possible, given that it's so light? The TPU/EVA foam Schutt is using is the reason. The foam is stitched into mesh-netting bricks, arranged into a vest, and then velcro'd to the plastic hard shell. These bricks look like swiss cheese, so they induce airflow. So too, the shell is perforated with generous holes for ventilation. Unlike its AiR Flex ancestors, the XV's padding vest does detach completely, so you can wash the pads independently of the shell. The foam is (at least in my estimation) the ideal thickness and resiliency, with a degree of rigidity to it – not so much that it's stiff as a board – but so too, it's nowhere near as dense and mushy like the sofa-cushion-foam that's in a Wilson West Vest.

Aside from being cast in black, the XV's shell is nearly identical to the AiR Flex. The biggest physical change are the shoulder plates. As I posted here, the shoulder pauldrons are detachable and reposition-able. The main shoulder plate, though, which does most of the clavicle protection, has been redesigned. With a new shape to it, it conforms to arch over the shoulder better (as I'll explain below, I also trained it already) and also presents a wider neck opening, making getting this unit on and off much easier and wearing it more comfortable. Schutt did, though, significantly change where the ailettes are anchored. I didn't like it, as I felt it impeded my range of motion (ie. throwing a ball to the pitcher, giving the heave-ho to a coach, etc.). I was used to the ailettes being mounted more on top, like my AiR Flex and my football shoulder pads were. So, I got some aluminum post-closures, my handy step-drill and the needle-nose pliers, and set to destroying the rivets holding the ailettes in their standard location (down by the armpit, if you can envision it), and then moving them up. I re-used the higher of the two holes to become the bottom hole of the new position, and drilled a new hole. Put the post-closures in to secure them, and voilá, I've got a really effective CP to my liking. What I suddenly noticed is how much lower on my shoulders it looks than the AiR Flex. This is a combination of the new shoulder shaping and the lower positioning of the ailettes. Seems minor, but I can now turn my head further to the side before my mask touches. Granted, it doesn't have the minimalism of the Force3 UnEqual, but it's a welcome improvement.

The pectoral guards are, as before, removable and re-positionable, and use the same TPU/EVA foam as the vest body. There are now rigid floating-rib "wing" plates to offer a bit more protection. A major bonus is the included, removable abdomen extension, made of the exact same TPU/EVA foam bricks. This adds an additional 4" of protection, vital to tall umpires or those working wee-little-ballplayer games (where the catcher may as well be lying down for all the protection he offers... or doesn't offer). Additionally, there is no hemming and hawing about sizing with this extension now included.

The harness is better than the AiR Flex; it's no Delta Flex, but it's a step in the right direction. I once again have the main yoke strap pulled as tight as it will go, but that has more to do with how aggressively I train the curving of the shoulder plates. I really lay into them, curving them as much as possible by heating them up with my heat gun (on LOW), bending them more into an arch, and then holding them while the plastic cools. I did the same thing on my AiR Flex, many more times, and I can already say with the XV, it's shaping more to my liking already. This CP embraces you, hugging you around the ribs gently and floating on your shoulders. It doesn't hang off your neck, nor does it clamp onto you in a bear hug.

Again, though, the thing that I (and Schutt, and other Schutt owners) am really hoping sells umpires on this CP is the increased and improved standoff padding. My conclusion as to why umpires were scared off the AiR Flex was because it seemed way too thin – visibly – to be able to handle upper-level speeds. Getting the calipers out, I estimated the AiR Flex's Brock Bead padding to be 10mm thick. By contrast, the XV's TPU/EVA foam is 15mm thick. Would I still use the AiR Flex for baseball? Gosh yes. It's a very good CP... but its XV progeny is noticeably better.

I made a prediction earlier in this thread about MiLB and Collegiate umpires utilizing this CP; I sincerely hope I'm right, because while I'm sure the All-Star System 7 and the Force3 UnEqual are top-notch, this has the makings to be a contender at a killer price point.

[kstrunk]

Will use my XV for my first plate of the year on Wednesday night. I've done some 'TV Work' with it though. I love the weight of it, or lack thereof. I must be honest though, I don't fill the width of it very well in the neck, and while I have it as tight as it can get in every respect, I'm wondering if I'm vulnerable in the clavicles. I have no experience with these things, as this is only my 2nd CP, so my expectations could be too high. I also notice it moving a bit laterally. Again, not sure what's normal, or if there are ways to mitigate the movement. @MadMax, would be grateful for any advice you may have. I like this CP, and want to make it work. 

[midtnump]

@MadMax, @kstrunk, Is the Schutt harness removable to allow you to put on the Delta Flex?

[kstrunk]

@MadMax, @kstrunk, Is the Schutt harness removable to allow you to put on the Delta Flex?

Negative, looked at the immediately when I read previous posts on the DF. Doesn't look possible.

[MadMax]

@midtnump, it's not easily implemented. You would have to be completely committed to it, as it would involve cutting off the existing harness from the foam vest and attaching a D-Ring (plastic or metal) to the rear point of the shell's shoulder arch plates.

 

You know, the more I look at it, and the more I look at the AiR Flex I have as well, I _may_ just try it on the AiR Flex. On the AiR Flex, located on the rear point of the shell's shoulder arch plate is a rivet. This rivet is run through the plastic _and_ through the Brock Bead vest beneath it, preventing you from removing the Brock Bead vest from the shell for washing. On the XV, this rivet is there, but it's not pinned through both the shell and vest beneath; it's just through the plastic. That would be the ideal spot to anchor a D-ring so as to attach the Delta Flex harness.

 

Let me consider it. As I said, I'd try it on the AiR Flex as a dry-run, since I'd want to get the vest separated from the shell for washing anyway.

[MadMax]

@kstrunk, to give you a benchmark, I'm 6'2", 206 (I haven't adopted @Jocko's weight-shedding plan yet) and wear a 44R/L sportcoat. What I do with the XV (and with the AiR Flex before it) is train the shell plates, in 2 directions.

 

What I advise doing is first separate the padding vest from the shell. Remove the pectoral guards and the shoulder pauldrons (both pairs velcro'd in). Once you have them separate, take note of how the shell is constructed. Notice the vinyl stay-joints between the plates, and how reasonably flexible they are. I do not apply heat to these stay-joints, but I do train them by bending and holding them for several minutes at a time. I do apply heat (a paint stripping gun would be great, a hair-drying blower would suffice) on LOW to the main chest plate, and start to bend it, evenly and gently around the vertical axis. You don't need to apply a lot of heat. Just enough to "encourage" it. Bending it in this direction will improve its "embrace" on you, and if you felt a lateral shifting of the CP before, it should be reducing or eliminating it.

 

Next, I focus my effort right at the shoulder arch plates, and begin by applying heat and then bending them to arch even more up and over and down, conforming to the shape of the shoulder naturally. Doing this will significantly alter the initial fit. You may want to reposition the ailettes, like I describe above, but you may favor them where they are – up to you.

 

Now, here's the fun part. Go ahead and put the padding vest on. You want the neck billow to be right about where the hollow of your throat is – not up by your Adam's Apple, but neither down by the top of your sternum. If you need a hand to get the shell on, you might want to get one... But you're aiming to put the "Schutt" name center and beneath the neck billow. Everything else should start to velcro in place. If you don't feel you need the pectoral guards, then don't reattach them. Definitely, though, put the shoulder pauldrons back in, and position them so they cover the round of the outside of your shoulder properly.

 

The harness, then, gets tightened snugly.

[Hawkman]

Thanks for the feedback, I'm seriously considering picking one of these up for my next protector. My Honigs K1 is about 12 years old and I already had a Platinum I didn't much care for. The Schutt seems to be what I'm looking for.