Constant pitching changes

[Aging_Arbiter]

10 hours ago, ArchAngel72 said:

 

yep LL thing.. 

8-12 So minors and majors..

I never understood it but I was told to do it.

So I do.

 

When did this become a LL thing?  Never heard of that being taught.  Outs is already covered by the umpire.  Runners on base???  That's a coaches job.

[BT_Blue]

I enjoy seeing someone do this with older kids. Or even better... full grown adults. It then falls into the "NO S!" category since most people have two eyes they can see with.

[ArchAngel72]

The then D1 UiC told me to do it. Then the next one did. and that was followed up by another Sr. Umpire.  It was then corrected by a MA Umpire as to where we should stand cause we were too close to the mound. 

Anyway "My Boss" told me to do it that way. Others in our District do it too. So I do what I'm asked. Its really no skin off my nose. gives me a second or two to work on my dad jokes.

 

[Replacematt]

14 hours ago, BT_Blue said:

I enjoy seeing someone do this with older kids. Or even better... full grown adults. It then falls into the "NO S!" category since most people have two eyes they can see with.

"I KNOW HOW MANY F*#KING TRIPS I'VE USED!!!"

[BT_Blue]

On 3/3/2021 at 1:34 PM, Matt said:

"I KNOW HOW MANY F*#KING TRIPS I'VE USED!!!"

Less that than letting a new F1 know where the runners are.

Side bar... if a coach EVER was dumb enough to say that to me. He gets no more free or helpful information from me for the rest of the game. Because he OBVIOUSLY knows everything going on.

[Replacematt]

9 hours ago, BT_Blue said:

Less that than letting a new F1 know where the runners are.

Side bar... if a coach EVER was dumb enough to say that to me. He gets no more free or helpful information from me for the rest of the game. Because he OBVIOUSLY knows everything going on.

The point was you're going to get that response if you do adult ball (and by that, I mean college and higher, not men's rec ball.)

[kylejt]

No, it's not a Little League "thing". Informing the pitcher of the outs and runners on is never taught in official LL teachings, and only done in my area by the under educated.

I do see it at local travel tourneys, where the typical umpire hasn't gone to a one week, nor has any formal training. Again, this just my observation of my area. YMMV. 

 

[Vegas_Ump]

No.  Don't look for trouble.

Mike

Las Vegas

[beerguy55]

On 3/2/2021 at 8:51 AM, JonnyCat said:

Is that a LL thing? Which levels do you do it for? I only have ever seen LL umpires do this, and they often carry it to other games (travel-ball, and even sub-varsity HS). Is it really the umpires responsibility to do this? Where did this practice come from? Is this a practice that other umpires use in games? I have never seen it taught anywhere. I've even worked with some that feel the need to broadcast the score between each half inning.

I do my best to discourage this practice. Just curious as to how you learned this and why you feel there is a need to do this. Not bashing at all, just wondering where and why this practice came about. I don't feel a need for it, but that is just my opinion.

It's definitely done in softball - I've seen it in both Canada and US under several codes, both youth and adult...I've never known why...maybe the new pitcher forgot about the baserunners while he/she was warming up???

[kylehutson]

I was working a HS JV game year-before-last with a guy that's been umpiring for over 30 (maybe even over 40) years. I was BU. Between innings he called me over and asked why I didn't apprise the pitcher of the situation after he warmed up. I answered "I'm not his coach." Next 1/2 inning another pitching change was made. He nodded his head toward me like "go ahead". I gave him the "play ball" hand-motion. He rolls his eyes and comes out from behind the plate to tell the pitcher himself.

[JonnyCat]

On 3/14/2021 at 3:05 PM, kylejt said:

No, it's not a Little League "thing". Informing the pitcher of the outs and runners on is never taught in official LL teachings, and only done in my area by the under educated.

I do see it at local travel tourneys, where the typical umpire hasn't gone to a one week, nor has any formal training. Again, this just my observation of my area. YMMV. 

 

If it's not a LL thing, then why do I see it mostly with LL umpires? I don't teach it in my LL clinics, nor does WR as far as I know. It just seems to be pervasive in LL. Don't know who is promoting it, or how it keeps getting passed down. I've seen it for years in my area.

[kylejt]

42 minutes ago, JonnyCat said:

If it's not a LL thing, then why do I see it mostly with LL umpires? I don't teach it in my LL clinics, nor does WR as far as I know. It just seems to be pervasive in LL. Don't know who is promoting it, or how it keeps getting passed down. I've seen it for years in my area.

I guess it's up to folks like you and me to try and put an end to it. I'm running a clinic for a couple of leagues next week, and put an end to any such nonsense locally. I'll do my best up here in Vista. 

 

[kylejt]

Oh, and I get that you mostly see this with LL umpires, as we're largest single group of umpires on the planet. It's just a numbers thing. 

It's probably like me seeing five day beards and scraggly goatees on the local travel tournament umpires. Not much I can, or want, to do about that, though. 

[Mudisfun]

On 3/2/2021 at 8:15 AM, ArchAngel72 said:

 

yep LL thing.. 

8-12 So minors and majors..

I never understood it but I was told to do it.

So I do.

 

The only people I normally see do this are UN-trained LL or other youth level  umpires. Those who have gone through even just a 4 hour fast start clinic I typically don't see advising F1 of anything. 

The only time I am giving F1 any information would be if there was a pitching change mid at-bat and there was already a count on the batter. And all I am giving him is the count. He has coaches, a catcher, parents out there who can remind him that there are runners on base, etc.

 

 

[ArchAngel72]

The only people I have telling me to do it are UiC’s whom have an average of 20 years of umpiring in LL and both whom have been to multiple trainings and have both conducted trainings. So I guess its just us North Eastern Gentlemen whom care to pause a second and make sure F1 knows the current status of outs and men on base. I mean yeah it wastes a whole 30 seconds at most?

Personally I’m just gonna keep doing it cause I stopped after reading all the hub but here and my UiC asked me why I did not.   I told him you meanies said its not needed. He said stop reading forums. We do things how we do them don’t pay them any attention.

[Jimurray]

8 minutes ago, ArchAngel72 said:

The only people I have telling me to do it are UiC’s whom have an average of 20 years of umpiring in LL and both whom have been to multiple trainings and have both conducted trainings. So I guess its just us North Eastern Gentlemen whom care to pause a second and make sure F1 knows the current status of outs and men on base. I mean yeah it wastes a whole 30 seconds at most?

Personally I’m just gonna keep doing it cause I stopped after reading all the hub but here and my UiC asked me why I did not.   I told him you meanies said its not needed. He said stop reading forums. We do things how we do them don’t pay them any attention.

You and your UIC might pay attention to any other level, HS, NCAA, Pro ball, where you do not see this. Does your UIC require the BU/s or the PU to do this "briefing"? Cause the mantra is that the PU owns the pitcher. But are you asking why your UIC does not require the BU to jog out to RF  and brief the sub when they put a new sub in the middle of the inning. Should base ump go out and brief him, "cut 4" or whatever? If you can't let go of this you and your UIC are a type that wants to be noticed in the game. 

[Jimurray]

On 3/19/2021 at 6:36 PM, kylejt said:

I guess it's up to folks like you and me to try and put an end to it. I'm running a clinic for a couple of leagues next week, and put an end to any such nonsense locally. I'll do my best up here in Vista. 

 

While you are at it would you mind letting everyone know that the batter knows he gets 1B on ball 4 and 1B is to your right, no need to point there. I will take that back a little bit. If you are doing 9U and the little guy looks up at you on ball 4 you can point 1B.

[kylejt]

2 hours ago, Jimurray said:

While you are at it would you mind letting everyone know that the batter knows he gets 1B on ball 4 and 1B is to your right, no need to point there. I will take that back a little bit. If you are doing 9U and the little guy looks up at you on ball 4 you can point 1B.

I actually "caught" one of my 14 year old umpires doing that last night. When I pointed out how silly it was, he had a laugh. He said a high school umpire was doing it in one of his games, so he copied him. But now he knows better. 

One umpire at a time........................

 

[Rich Ives]

On 3/1/2021 at 5:16 PM, Aging_Arbiter said:

Another point to consider, since they CAN do this, it will catch up to them.   No pitcher may pitch 3 consecutive days. 

 

Never encountered a schedule where this would affect anything.  

[Velho]

On 5/12/2021 at 1:16 PM, Mudisfun said:

The only people I normally see do this are UN-trained LL or other youth level  umpires. Those who have gone through even just a 4 hour fast start clinic I typically don't see advising F1 of anything.

Yep. For me it was viral following the ‘experienced’ ump behavior  (they may have been all of 1 year more experienced since I started as the random coach/dad drafted to ump - that was 9 years ago 😁 ). Rationale? These are kids, helping them out, etc.

UIC made a off hand comment of “it’s not needed” at preseason meeting and I haven’t seen anyone in our league do it since (‘real ump’ or random parent).

Boss (UIC) says do it/don’t it? Follow directions. I’m still married after 20 years for a reason. I know how this works. 

[mark38090]

I was taught at my very first clinic to do if with younger kids. The reasoning he used was that it makes younger pitchers feel like you're not the enemy. I never really thought about it beyond that and I've just done it since then. I only do 9-10 and 11-12 except for the rare occasion I do 13-15 when there's a local team. 

[Replacematt]

On 5/15/2021 at 10:52 AM, Rich Ives said:

Never encountered a schedule where this would affect anything.  

Never been up north, huh...

[Rich Ives]

4 hours ago, Matt said:

Never been up north, huh...

I live in  NY state. Coached for 32 years. I have clues.

[BigBlue4u]

On 3/2/2021 at 7:20 AM, ArchAngel72 said:

"Time. another pitching change, Ok coach"  

note "book."

count warm ups

advise pitcher of men on base & outs. clean plate, Assume position...

"Play"

rinse - repeat.

 

 

[BigBlue4u]

advise pitcher of men on base & outs. clean plate, Assume position...

Wrong!  It's not your job to advise the pitcher of the situation.  That's the coach's job. Tell me what you are going to do when you advise the pitcher, then, with a runner on third, on a batted ball he makes a routine throw to first base and the runner from third scores.  He then claims you told him there were two outs.  Dirty end of the stick!