Expanded Strike Zone for Little League

[Guest Brian Murphy]

I am a little league coach for 10-12 year olds and I have a philosophical difference with the head umpire in our league and I want to get the opinions of those on the boards here. Recently our kid umpires (our league does not use adults for this age contrary to little league rules, but that's ok) stated telling us coaches during the pre-game meeting that "their" strike zone is from the armpits to the tops of the knees and a baseball's width on the inside and outside of the plate. My objection is that they are not enforcing the strike zone according to the rules of the game and they are giving the pitcher an unfair advantage over the hitter. Our league has a sheet of "local rules" and it does NOT say there is an expanded strike zone for this age. I ask why they are not enforcing the rules of the game and I get a BS answer about encouraging kids to swing and that they don't want a "walk fest."

My argument is that

1) the strike zone is clearly defined in the rule book

2) "encouraging" kids to swing is not the umpires job, that's a coaches job to teach the kids strike zone discipline

3) we as coaches are fully capable of removing a pitcher who has walked a few batters and that's not the concern of the umpire

4) an expanded strike zone only encourages kids to swing at more bad pitches, causing mor swinging k's and backwards k's

5) and umpires job is to Officiate the game fairly according to ALL the rules, not most of them

6) umpires cannot unilaterally decide to make up their own rules

Now I am catching hell because I am questioning this "unwritten" expanded strike zone philosophy and all I am asking is for all of our umpires to call the strike zone according to the definition in the rules!! Is this an unreasonable request?

[webspinnre]

Anytime a coach asks me what "my" zone is, I tell him that the strike zone is what the rule book says it is.

[Aging_Arbiter]

Had a "wise guy" kid at LL sectional game Saturday night ask me what my strike zone was.  I then asked him "For you? or the rest of your team?"  He shut up.

[Nafxos]

The best advice I ever got early in my career: "If they're not complaining that your zone is too big, it's too small."

[Sut'n Blue]

 

 

I am a little league coach for 10-12 year olds and I have a philosophical difference with the head umpire in our league and I want to get the opinions of those on the boards here. Recently our kid umpires (our league does not use adults for this age contrary to little league rules, but that's ok) stated telling us coaches during the pre-game meeting that "their" strike zone is from the armpits to the tops of the knees and a baseball's width on the inside and outside of the plate. My objection is that they are not enforcing the strike zone according to the rules of the game and they are giving the pitcher an unfair advantage over the hitter. Our league has a sheet of "local rules" and it does NOT say there is an expanded strike zone for this age. I ask why they are not enforcing the rules of the game and I get a BS answer about encouraging kids to swing and that they don't want a "walk fest."

 

My argument is that

 

1) the strike zone is clearly defined in the rule book

2) "encouraging" kids to swing is not the umpires job, that's a coaches job to teach the kids strike zone discipline

3) we as coaches are fully capable of removing a pitcher who has walked a few batters and that's not the concern of the umpire

4) an expanded strike zone only encourages kids to swing at more bad pitches, causing mor swinging k's and backwards k's

5) and umpires job is to Officiate the game fairly according to ALL the rules, not most of them

6) umpires cannot unilaterally decide to make up their own rules

 

Now I am catching hell because I am questioning this "unwritten" expanded strike zone philosophy and all I am asking is for all of our umpires to call the strike zone according to the definition in the rules!! Is this an unreasonable request?

 

The OP is an old one but still valid.

There is many a time and place for the zone to be a little more generous than the rule book indicates. Is this always acceptable? Of course not but in most youth games a generous zone is desired by pretty much everyone so long as it is reasonable and consistent. I imagine at the LLWS and the like they're calling a rule book zone but for most youth ball the zone should be a little more generous. I had to work a local Cal Ripken championship game a few weeks back and before the game one of the coaches asked me what my zone was. My answer was a simple "the zone will be age appropriate" as I was not going to get into a discussion about shins, shoulders, ball widths, chalk lines, etc.. The coach seemed satisfied by my answer and the game went well without nary a peep about my zone - high shins to just below armpits, a couple inches in and a few or more inches out. The fans and the players enjoyed the game as the kids were swinging early and often. 

 

 

 

 

[BillKen]

The OP has an ego problem...he is what is wrong with daddy baseball.  He needs to get over himself.  It is in the best interest of the game for kids (LL age) to swing the bat and have strikes called that are hittable pitches.  But contrarily, there are plenty of umpires who need to get over themselves as well.  The game can accommodate competitive people, but think about the greatest players and umpires are the ones who also are genuinely humble.  

Coaches need to trust umpires to manage the game.  Those who don't are guilty of setting a bad example for the kids.  Umpires need to trust coaches to coach and realize that nobody came to watch them umpire.  A great job means that nobody remembers you at the end of the night.

[Gfoley4]

This thread reminds me of https://vine.co/v/eudM2bA2mrr 

[webspinnre]

This thread reminds me of https://vine.co/v/eudM2bA2mrr 

Wow, that's just.... wow.

[conbo61]

This thread reminds me of https://vine.co/v/eudM2bA2mrr 

There is absolutely no excuse for that. NONE.

[KenBAZ]

Well you've really put the chum in the water. Before you get attacked for this post as I'm sure you will, I'll ask you to consider one of your beliefs underlying your frustration. You say you, "see umpires calling strikes where the inside edge of the ball is 4-6 inches off the plate". Please consider the possibility that given the laws of optics, unless you are set up right behind the plate you can't tell when a pitch is 6 inches off the plate. At best you can say, in you biased view from a bad angle it appears to you that pitches 4-6 inches off the plate are sometimes called strikes. I'll now leave you to your fate. Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

[noumpere]

Why do umpires do this? 

Because, overall, they hear more crap (and just general moaning, or "coded" comments to the players) from the dugouts and stands when they call that pitch a ball then when they call that pitch a strike.  So, they learn to call it a ball.

 

Your point that it "should" be a ball is well taken, and you certainly have a right to that opinion.  But, until "everyone" in your league / area starts wanting it called that way, you will be fighting an uphill battle.

[Mudisfun]

I'm fine with umpires being a little generous up, down, and even on the edges.  However, time and again I see umpires calling strikes where the inside edge of the ball is 4-6 inches off the plate.  It's not just that the kids are baffled and frustrated at these calls.  It's that given their small size and bats, they can't hit them.  They're just too far away.

Why do umpires do this?  Is it to help the pitchers?  No, it's to help themselves.  It gets them off the field in an hour and a half instead of two hours.  Why won't they change?  Because once someone puts on umpire garb they feel the arrogance of power and nobody's going to tell them to do a goddamn thing.

Wow. Just wow. In my real life I have 40 or so people that work for me and I seem to get through week after week without yelling, threatening or firing anyone just to stroke my ego. So your analysis of strapping on some gear just to find a power trip over some dads and 12 year olds must be spot on. Thanks for saving me the money to seek professional guidance to figure out my power trip issues. I know that I am dragged kicking and screaming to the fields a hundred times a year against my will just like my fellow officials so you must be right that we purposely call everything we can a strike to gain power, show up kids and try and shorten the game as much as possible so that our 'sentence' is over as quickly as possible. Really none of us umpire because we enjoy it and actually want to be on the field. What a tool. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ElkOil]

Well you've really put the chum in the water. Before you get attacked for this post as I'm sure you will, I'll ask you to consider one of your beliefs underlying your frustration. You say you, "see umpires calling strikes where the inside edge of the ball is 4-6 inches off the plate". Please consider the possibility that given the laws of optics, unless you are set up right behind the plate you can't tell when a pitch is 6 inches off the plate. At best you can say, in you biased view from a bad angle it appears to you that pitches 4-6 inches off the plate are sometimes called strikes. I'll now leave you to your fate. Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Eh, it's Sunday and I'm just chilling on my couch, napping, watching NASCAR and some pre-season football.  Had a great night out last night with my wife and parents when we had a wonderful dinner and took in a show.  My life is too good right now to bother taking his bait.  I'll watch with interest to see who bites.

[stkjock]

I have to say I'm glad this thread was bumped.  I think there's a ton of valuable information for the youth coach.   I never realized what a issue it was to inquire about the zone.  Appreciate the valid point of view. 

[Guest]

I'm fine with umpires being a little generous up, down, and even on the edges.  However, time and again I see umpires calling strikes where the inside edge of the ball is 4-6 inches off the plate.  It's not just that the kids are baffled and frustrated at these calls.  It's that given their small size and bats, they can't hit them.  They're just too far away.

Why do umpires do this?  Is it to help the pitchers?  No, it's to help themselves.  It gets them off the field in an hour and a half instead of two hours.  Why won't they change?  Because once someone puts on umpire garb they feel the arrogance of power and nobody's going to tell them to do a goddamn thing.