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Latos Balk - On or Off the Rubber (& Joe West Music Cameo)

Lindsay

By Lindsay
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Lindsay

Lindsay

Posted
Posted (edited)

Latos thinks he's off the rubber so he can feign to first as a balk is called. After Mattingly requests a discussion, balk. http://m.mlb.com/video/v427297983/chclad-russell-crosses-the-dish-on-latos-balk (no embed link yet)

Also...all I can hear at 1:30 is the organ version of Joe West's "Blue Cowboy" music CD. Whoever the Dodgers organist for this homestand is must be pretty cool ^_^

Edited by Gil: Owner - UEFL
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Jimurray
Jimurray

Looks like a jab step to me. I don't care where the foot lands in relation to front or back. I don't have a legal dissengage. 

KLAH316
KLAH316

"IF" he legally disengaged, then he is considered a fielder and can do whatever a fielder can do.... Yes, he can fake a throw to first then.

Richvee
Richvee

Seriously? In real time you can't tell he jabbed stepped and started a throwing motion to 1st before the pivot foot ever hits the ground? Or are you just trolling for a reaction?  This is a balk all d

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Dbellyflop

Dbellyflop

Posted
Posted

it must be a balk if the announcers agree with the call.......

basejester

basejester

Posted
Posted

Let's suppose he's a centimeter off the pitcher's plate.  (I'm not convinced that he is off, but there's nothing to talk about if he's literally on the rubber.)

I believe we still have to balk this.  The pitchers get the benefit of the rubber neighborhood play on the jump turn.  He's not engaged when he's in the air or if he lands a centimeter in front of the rubber.  We treat the pitcher as engaged through that whole process.

The rubber is a tool for the pitcher to use to communicate his status.

 

 

 

noumpere

noumpere

Posted
Posted

I don't think it's a "was he on or off" argument as much as it is a "did he step back or not" argument.  But, I only watched the first 15 seconds or so one time.

 

And, I think he started his move to first before he stepped off -- but I also think I've seen similar moves not balked.  Frankly, I'd like to see more of them called for this.

  • Like 1
ricka56

ricka56

Posted
Posted

And, I think he started his move to first before he stepped off -- but I also think I've seen similar moves not balked. 

balk.thumb.png.164a3a9e0238706345725155b
He has definitely made a move towards 1B. Pivot foot is up in the still...not yet planted behind rubber.
And I don't think his pivot foot completely cleared the rubber on the disengage attempt (toes didn't clear).
balk_2.thumb.png.2062bade8117ee31936a5d9
Technically a balk (no throw) for either reason...real time, a good enough disengagement for me.

 

KLAH316

KLAH316

Posted
Posted (edited)

If he had a legal disengage, then the fake to first is ok?

"IF" he legally disengaged, then he is considered a fielder and can do whatever a fielder can do.... Yes, he can fake a throw to first then.

Edited by KLAH316
  • Like 2
ricka56

ricka56

Posted
Posted

This is an elephant balk.  Grandma in the stands knows this is a balk.

Grandma thinks a disengagement is when her grandson and his fiancé break up.  

  • Like 1
Richvee

Richvee

Posted
Posted

balk.thumb.png.164a3a9e0238706345725155b
He has definitely made a move towards 1B. Pivot foot is up in the still...not yet planted behind rubber.
And I don't think his pivot foot completely cleared the rubber on the disengage attempt (toes didn't clear).
balk_2.thumb.png.2062bade8117ee31936a5d9
Technically a balk (no throw) for either reason...real time, a good enough disengagement for me.

 

Seriously? In real time you can't tell he jabbed stepped and started a throwing motion to 1st before the pivot foot ever hits the ground? Or are you just trolling for a reaction?  This is a balk all day at every level.

  • Like 2
ricka56

ricka56

Posted
Posted

Seriously? In real time you can't tell he jabbed stepped and started a throwing motion to 1st before the pivot foot ever hits the ground? Or are you just trolling for a reaction?  This is a balk all day at every level.

Seriously, do you really need a pivot foot to touch behind the rubber before starting to throw ? Does F1 really have to slow his move down for you ? If he "jabs" a step behind the rubber it is a legal disengagement.

And as another poster pointed out, this move is not balked because the speed of the game is such that they don't call it RB tight. I think if it wasn't for the sloppy footwork (didn't clear the rubber), no balk would have been called.

 

Richvee

Richvee

Posted
Posted

Seriously, do you really need a pivot foot to touch behind the rubber before starting to throw ? Does F1 really have to slow his move down for you ? If he "jabs" a step behind the rubber it is a legal disengagement.

And as another poster pointed out, this move is not balked because the speed of the game is such that they don't call it RB tight.

 

No, but it needs to be a lot closer than that.

Certainly not. No need to slow it down to see he was in the act of trowing long before the foot even hit the ground. 

He didn't do that here.

Sorry. To me, this isn't even close to a legal disengagement.

Jimurray

Jimurray

Posted
Posted

Seriously, do you really need a pivot foot to touch behind the rubber before starting to throw ? Does F1 really have to slow his move down for you ? If he "jabs" a step behind the rubber it is a legal disengagement.

And as another poster pointed out, this move is not balked because the speed of the game is such that they don't call it RB tight. I think if it wasn't for the sloppy footwork (didn't clear the rubber), no balk would have been called.

 

MLBUM/PBUC allow a RHP to move his pivot foot in the direction of 3B as long as he moves his non pivot foot toward 1B. That is what the pitcher did. They consider this an in contact move. Why would they specify this? If the pivot goes toward 3B and ends up in front of the rubber we know it is not a dissengage. If the pivot foot goes toward 3B and ends up in line with the rubber we know this is not a dissengage. If the pivot foot goes toward 3B and ends up behind the rubber we have MLBUM tellling us to consider this an in contact move.

  • Like 2
ricka56

ricka56

Posted
Posted

Sorry. To me, this isn't even close to a legal disengagement.

If it was so cut/dry, why did the crew have to huddle ?
And If it was so cut/dry why did they need to huddle a second time ?

The sloppy disengagement gave them reason to balk this.

Jimurray

Jimurray

Posted
Posted

If it was so cut/dry, why did the crew have to huddle ?And If it was so cut/dry why did they need to huddle a second time ?

The sloppy disengagement gave them reason to balk this.

they had to huddle twice because I wasn't on the crew. I would have splained it to them. But, let's go with a sloppy ddisengagement. It was that too.

  • Like 1
johnnyg08

johnnyg08

Posted
Posted

This stuff happens fast.  Often times, probably even w/ four guys...they had to ask one another...did he really do that?  

It's not something that happens at that level.  

I'm guessing they needed to make sure they got it right. 

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