Jump to content

What should I have done differently?


James Walker

Recommended Posts

Had the plate last night. Beginning of the game, pitchers warming up. HTAC comes up and asks where my zone is. I tell him were not discussing balls and strikes tonight ( too defensive?). No malice in either of our tones. No one heard but him and I and maybe the catcher.

Top of 3. I ball an outside pitch. I hear, guess you have to be from a certain place to get calls. I call time, remove my mask and warn. Didn't raise my voice and stayed calm.

After the 3rd. I'm up the 3rd baseline. HTAC is walking back to 1st base dugout. I see him out of the corner of my eye. I take a step back trying to give him room. He walks by and brushes me with his arm. I ignore it, not knowing if it was accidental or what. ( should I have tossed here?)

Top 4. I ball a pitch outside. HTAC says " no way that missed!". I call time, remove my mask and say " that's enough, we are not discussing balls and strikes!" I stare into the dugout for a few seconds to make it clear he's about to get a one way ticket to the parking lot.

Next pitch, same location. Ball it again. HTAC, "That's two!". Boom! He gone. I walk up the third base line. Partners take out the trash.

Two batters later, R1. I think they tried to throw at me. Catcher bailed like it was a pitch out and I get hit in the shin with a lollipop curve. I just don't know. The pitching/catching wasnt great and this particular team called a lot of pitch outs. Even the coach acted like it was supposed to be a pitch out. But I wouldn't put it past them.

I probably gave more rope than I should have. Probably should have tossed the coach when he brushed me, but the contact was minimal I would've come out looking like a redass. I still don't know about the pitcher, still 50/50 on it. And that situation was definitely HTBT, but any advice on that would be appreciated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Top of 3. I ball an outside pitch. I hear, guess you have to be from a certain place to get calls. I call time, remove my mask and warn. Didn't raise my voice and stayed calm.

Top 4. I ball a pitch outside. HTAC says " no way that missed!". I call time, remove my mask and say " that's enough, we are not discussing balls and strikes!" I stare into the dugout for a few seconds to make it clear he's about to get a one way ticket to the parking lot.

 

If you already warned, then why give the second warning?  He should have been gone after "no way that missed."

 

As far as him brushing you as he walked by - it sounds suspicious, but without being there, it's hard for me to comment.

 

And the pitch out?  Did F2 go see F1 on the mound prior to that pitch?  Did the coach go out and talk to him?  It seems unlikely that they were throwing at you if neither of those things happened.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Top of 3. I ball an outside pitch. I hear, guess you have to be from a certain place to get calls.

 

"Whoa, Whoa, Whoa and by Whoa, I mean TIME. What did you just say?" I am taking the extrordinary step of stopping the game and finding out if coach has accused me of being a cheat. Anything less than a complete retraction of this statement is an auto-EJ in my book.

  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tell him your strike zone is the same one that's in the rule book and then call that zone.  Not sure it's a great idea to toss a coach if you're not sure that he brushed you on purpose.  And, IMO, I can't see how a lollipop curve would be a pitch to throw at you in retaliation.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I do think the "we're not discussing balls and strikes" may have set the tone for the evening.  I guess that's HTBT to see the facial expression of the coach when you said it.  But I agree with Grayhawk.  A warning means nothing if they get another one.  I try very hard to toss if I warn and they don't adhere.  I may give multiple warnings in the same conversations (i.e. "coach that's enough" if he continues, "coach you need to let it go or you will be watching the rest of the game from your car").  But if I've given a formal warning regarding balls and strikes then next word and it's adios.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only thing you did wrong was getting close enough for the AC to brush you. Stay away from ACs between innings at all costs. If that's the line I usually go up, I'll go up the other one. Oh. Wait. In this case, I wouldn't have had to worry about that, because I would have tossed home after the "certain place" reference.

This one is on you my friend. Not judging. Learn from it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am lost. How is it everyone keeps getting asked what their strike zone is? It has probably been 15 years since anyone has asked me what my strike zone is. And it seems to be happening to everyone on this forum. As far as the EJ goes bam is right, get yourself as far away from the AC as you can or stay in the same place you stand every time. If he knows where you are and bumps you, with no apology? I would have dumped if I thought it was on purpose. Or I would have made a comment to him like "My bad Coach. I will be more careful next time." And yes that is baiting him. But he should have been gone the inning before for accusing you of trying to throw the game. That is challenging your integrity.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I get asked my zone all the time.

I tell the closet kid to hold his bat straight out, then point straight up, then reach behind him.

It usually ends with a chuckle from the coach (and an acknowledgement that we're not discussing that) and a wide-eye look from the kid.

And they're swinging the bats the rest of the night :)

-

On the EJ, I'm coming after the "have to be from somewhere." Don't accuse me of being a homer.

I'm also (outside of previous context) leaving "there's no way that missed" alone. It's a knee jerk reaction that shows disagreement alone, and as long as it's not paired with anything else, or happening frequently, I can brush that one off easily.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've never had a coach ask me where my zone is.  (Now it'll happen today :wacko:) If asked, I'd be tempted to just say "oh, it's over there" and point to the plate area.  If asked during the plate conference, I'll say "it's right here!"   As I've gotten older, I've tried to do a lot of my communicating with a little humor or at least in a good-natured tone with a smile on my face. 

 

Some here my remember my introduction post a while back.  I'm back after being away from umpiring for 20 years.  I find that I'm so happy to be back out there that I'm generally in a good mood, and I think I convey that to everybody, and I generally stay that way until somebody makes me change.  As Dalton said at the Double Deuce: "be nice...until it's time not to be nice"

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm asked from time to time, but only at lower levels (never had it in a HS game that I can recall). I just say (what is true), "I call a lot of strikes."

 

Youth pitchers can't aim for the umpire's zone, so I'm not sure what the point of the question is, except perhaps to learn the answer that I give them. Guys who call a lot of strikes don't usually have the walk-filled scoring fests that last 4 hours. I suspect that coaches detest those as much as the next guy.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

These fields were set up really weird. The dugouts were inside the field instead of out and the mouth was near the plate. They were maybe 20-25 feet away from me. The stands were on the opposite side of the dugout and they had the area behind the plate blocked off so the scorer and TD's (yes, plural) could watch the the game with out distraction. The "certain place" comment wasn't loud and TBH may not have been directed at me.

I get asked where my zone is fairly often, but rarely have any complaints. But I do lower level ball with a lot of clueless coaches. It was a different AC that asked before the game, and like I said, it was more conversational. But I think I will start warning when it happens from now on.

The more I think back, the more I wish I had tossed him when he brushed me. I gave him plenty of room and he still managed to run into me. After talking to other guys who had this team after the game, it's clear this dude was a DB.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I do think the "we're not discussing balls and strikes" may have set the tone for the evening.  I guess that's HTBT to see the facial expression of the coach when you said it.  But I agree with Grayhawk.  A warning means nothing if they get another one.  I try very hard to toss if I warn and they don't adhere.  I may give multiple warnings in the same conversations (i.e. "coach that's enough" if he continues, "coach you need to let it go or you will be watching the rest of the game from your car").  But if I've given a formal warning regarding balls and strikes then next word and it's adios.

THIS ...................

He's not arguing with you, he's asking a simple question.  Your answer is "reda$$", and I agree w/ Scott, ...that set most of this up.

 

That being said, ...this question I've only heard once since coming back in 2010.  I gave the coach a blank stare and he said ...."you know, you're not extreme, and he used his hands to show at the eyes, and ankles .....  I just smiled and said, ...."no, ...it's your standard strike zone" ....and he was totally happy w/ that.

 

I also agree w/ @grayhawk  ......  You already warned him, why warn again?  His insinuation of you being a homer would be automatic for me, ...and I don't eject.     And finally.... it's probably a HTBT, ...but there's no way in hell he didn't have enough room to bypass you w/out touching you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

I do think the "we're not discussing balls and strikes" may have set the tone for the evening.

THIS ...................

He's not arguing with you, he's asking a simple question.  Your answer is "reda$$", and I agree w/ Scott, ...that set most of this up.

 

That being said, ...this question I've only heard once since coming back in 2010.  I gave the coach a blank stare and he said ...."you know, you're not extreme, and he used his hands to show at the eyes, and ankles .....  I just smiled and said, ...."no, ...it's your standard strike zone" ....and he was totally happy w/ that.

 

So responding with "we're not discussing balls and strikes" is red-ass, but giving coach a blank stare isn't ? Like you said, he's asking a simple question (inappropriate as it may be), give him a simple answer. Context/manner of delivery is everything, but "coach, I don't discuss my strike zone" is a completely appropriate, and simple response to this inappropriate question...and then we're moving on.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

I do think the "we're not discussing balls and strikes" may have set the tone for the evening.

THIS ...................

He's not arguing with you, he's asking a simple question.  Your answer is "reda$$", and I agree w/ Scott, ...that set most of this up.

 

That being said, ...this question I've only heard once since coming back in 2010.  I gave the coach a blank stare and he said ...."you know, you're not extreme, and he used his hands to show at the eyes, and ankles .....  I just smiled and said, ...."no, ...it's your standard strike zone" ....and he was totally happy w/ that.

 

So responding with "we're not discussing balls and strikes" is red-ass, but giving coach a blank stare isn't ? Like you said, he's asking a simple question (inappropriate as it may be), give him a simple answer. Context/manner of delivery is everything, but "coach, I don't discuss my strike zone" is a completely appropriate, and simple response to this inappropriate question...and then we're moving on.

 

No, no ..... I was surprised by his question, so I hesitated and had a blank look on my face (partner told me) ....by the time I got something out of my mouth, he was re-explaining himself.  So, ..no, it wasn't redass at all.  I'm the LEAST redass guy you'll ever meet, ...ON and OFF the field :nod:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

I do think the "we're not discussing balls and strikes" may have set the tone for the evening.

THIS ...................

He's not arguing with you, he's asking a simple question.  Your answer is "reda$$", and I agree w/ Scott, ...that set most of this up.

 

That being said, ...this question I've only heard once since coming back in 2010.  I gave the coach a blank stare and he said ...."you know, you're not extreme, and he used his hands to show at the eyes, and ankles .....  I just smiled and said, ...."no, ...it's your standard strike zone" ....and he was totally happy w/ that.

 

So responding with "we're not discussing balls and strikes" is red-ass, but giving coach a blank stare isn't ? Like you said, he's asking a simple question (inappropriate as it may be), give him a simple answer. Context/manner of delivery is everything, but "coach, I don't discuss my strike zone" is a completely appropriate, and simple response to this inappropriate question...and then we're moving on.

 

 

"Coach I don't discuss my strike zone" is different than "we're not discussing balls and strikes".  "we're not discussing balls and strikes" barely even addresses the question that was asked.  Plus that exact response is what I generally use as my warning for when they do it in the game.

 

Honestly though I wouldn't use either to address a coach that asks me where my zone is before the game.  I don't have a token response, a lot depends on my mood and how I perceive the coach to be, but some of my responses have been:

 

"Same as in the rule book"

"Rule book zone adjusted based on players skill level"

"Tell them to come out swinging"

"Letters to bottom of the knee, over the plate"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 I'm the LEAST redass guy you'll ever meet, ...ON and OFF the field

 

...who thinks that my response would be red-ass.

 

Being direct, concise and to the point is never red-ass..how you say it reveals the color of one's backside.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 I'm the LEAST redass guy you'll ever meet, ...ON and OFF the field

 

...who thinks that my response would be red-ass.

 

Being direct, concise and to the point is never red-ass..how you say it reveals the color of one's backside.

 

No one....I was referring to the OP.

 

What YOU said is different than what the OP says ....and your'e right, ....HOW you say things is HUGE! It makes a big difference!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

I do think the "we're not discussing balls and strikes" may have set the tone for the evening.

THIS ...................

He's not arguing with you, he's asking a simple question.  Your answer is "reda$$", and I agree w/ Scott, ...that set most of this up.

 

That being said, ...this question I've only heard once since coming back in 2010.  I gave the coach a blank stare and he said ...."you know, you're not extreme, and he used his hands to show at the eyes, and ankles .....  I just smiled and said, ...."no, ...it's your standard strike zone" ....and he was totally happy w/ that.

 

So responding with "we're not discussing balls and strikes" is red-ass, but giving coach a blank stare isn't ? Like you said, he's asking a simple question (inappropriate as it may be), give him a simple answer. Context/manner of delivery is everything, but "coach, I don't discuss my strike zone" is a completely appropriate, and simple response to this inappropriate question...and then we're moving on.

 

 

"Coach I don't discuss my strike zone" is different than "we're not discussing balls and strikes".  "we're not discussing balls and strikes" barely even addresses the question that was asked.  Plus that exact response is what I generally use as my warning for when they do it in the game.

 

Honestly though I wouldn't use either to address a coach that asks me where my zone is before the game.  I don't have a token response, a lot depends on my mood and how I perceive the coach to be, but some of my responses have been:

 

"Same as in the rule book"

"Rule book zone adjusted based on players skill level"

"Tell them to come out swinging"

"Letters to bottom of the knee, over the plate"

 

 

"Yours, or theirs?"

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...