Shin-guard upgrades

[BLWizzRanger]

OK, for the last two weeks, I have taken two 80+ fastballs directly off of my left shin (upper and lower part of the shin).  Two nice bruises.  There was no dispersion with my All-Star LP11-Rs. I felt everything.  I have used these for four years and have never felt anything.  So I am a little surprised.

Anyways, after reviewing previous threads on shin-guards, I am getting a feel that Douglas or Force3s are the favorites or highest recommended ones on here?  Am I reading these right?

If all things are equal, I like the idea of an all-USA manufactured guard, so I am leaning toward the Douglas's.  But, is there any other reasons to lean another way?

[grayhawk]

Never used the Douglas shins, but the F3s are stellar. I've taken many shots off of them and never felt any pain. I suspect they are a bit lighter (and less expensive) than the Douglas shins as well.

[tpatience]

Douglas shins are bullet proof. I’ve used them all 4 years of my pro career and haven’t felt a thing. Highly recommended and worth the extra money 

[Baseballer]

I use Douglas. Force 3 is nice but I like having thigh protection above the knee. 

[Umpiresrock74]

Force 3 is crap, I am retrofitting a pair of force 3 for a guy because of continuous injuries to his knee. This is the so called Kevlar they use in them. You see that little yellowish color sliver? that’s the Kevlar. It’s just a marketing scam. It does nothing. 

[834k3r]

11 hours ago, grayhawk said:

Never used the Douglas shins, but the F3s are stellar. I've taken many shots off of them and never felt any pain. I suspect they are a bit lighter (and less expensive) than the Douglas shins as well.

+1

Paired with the UL Flex harness, I'll feel the pressure from the hit, but no pain at all. It between pitches and in between innings I don't even feel them, and I don't notice them when running down the line on a rotation or watching for RLI.

[MadMax]

13 hours ago, BLWizzRanger said:

Anyways, after reviewing previous threads on shin-guards, I am getting a feel that Douglas or Force3s are the favorites or highest recommended ones on here?

They are. But then, do consider, the All-Star Cobalt shinguards are very good, too, as are the forthcoming Gerry Davis Sports shinguards (model # pending). Heck, the DaviShins were good shinguards, as are the Champro replications of them. 

I know exactly why you used All-Star LP11's... I used to have a set myself, for my first 3 years of umpiring. I got them because they were ridiculously lower profile than the bulky shin pillows that Rawlings and Wilson both made/make. 
Then I got Force3 Ultimates, and I've not trusted anything else. Fit & forget. 

The only thing to Douglas' detriment is their (continued, stubborn) use of Qualux, which is the loathsome open cell upholstery foam that (continues to) plague(s) umpire gear. Otherwise, the benefits & features are top-notch – USA Made, hard-plate ankle buttresses, OtK (over the knee) protective flap... and bombproof construction. However, they're not for everyone. I'm a hardened HoK stance-guy, and the OtK flap (or flaps, as per some Wilsons and Diamond units) irritates me, and is pointless (especially since we have ThighPro now!). The ankle buttresses don't quite fit cleanly with mid-to-3/4 cut plate shoes. And... the squeaking. Oh LORD, the SQUEAKING! Those wretched hard metal clips. If I was to own a set of Douglas shinguards, I would cut all the metal D-rings off (leaving the bare loop of webbing), and remove all those stupid metal clips... and use G-hooks! 

By comparison, the Force3 Ultimates are tremendously good. So they don't float Micheal's boat . They're the ideal balance of protection and (low) profile. Instead of a hard-plate ankle buttress, they use "soft plate" buttresses. I find these interface... kinder(?)... than hard plate on all types of plate shoes. Yeah, they use Kevlar... but Force3 throws Kevlar in everything they make (I eyeball their gear bags sometimes, wondering). In this case, it performs exactly as its intended, and the shin liner and the sizing foam cushions are decidedly separate. This is a beneficial feature. Lastly, they use plastic side release buckles, which never* fail or come unhooked (like those stupid clips), and do not squeak. 
However, with that said, I'm eyeballing my older pair of Force3's, and are seriously considering taking all the SR buckles off and trialing a set of G-hooks. 

I love the G-hooks that much. 

Change yer life, man. 

I do have to say, though, the Great Call shinguards are rather nice, as are the forthcoming GDSports shins. I've got a set of shinguards on my "mad lab bench" that will address a lot of flaws and shortfalls of shinguards, but I can't ask you to hold your breath... I'm terribly overloaded these days. 

* – And before @The Man in Blue jumps on me, yes yes, we remember that you had a SR buckle break on a freak glancing shot from a passing baseball. SR buckles can be replaced... they make SR buckles with removable pins; simply break/cut away the old plastic buckle (leave the webbing loop alone!), and affix the pin thru the loop into the replacement SR buckle. 
However... with how giddy I am over G-hooks, I'd advise... G-hooks. 

[grayhawk]

I had to look up G hooks.

[ArchAngel72]

Loved the F3's so much never took anything near 80 but possibly 60's and I never ever felt a thing other than the sound of a good solid whack and then all the fans going OOOOOOOOHHHH  

Bah did not hurt my wife hits harder.

 

[MadMax]

16 minutes ago, grayhawk said:

I had to look up G hooks.

Nonsense! 

These little babies –
https://a.co/d/al4W5fc

... make a helluva lot more sense than T-hooks, which corrode (cuz they're cheap steel) or cut your (ever more expensive by the year/month/week/day) shirts when you get hit, or SR buckles, which are plastic and prone to breaking. The particular ones I pointed towards are aluminum, with no "moving" parts. Just slide the hook – mounted on the harness strap – thru the (leftover) loop on the CP (where the female end of the SR buckle was), and you're hooked. 

I've got photos. I just replaced my custom-fitted SR buckles last week, all set for 3 weeks in the desert. Should have put these G-hooks in a long time ago. My CP actually fits better than ever. 

[grayhawk]

22 minutes ago, MadMax said:

Nonsense! 

These little babies –
https://a.co/d/al4W5fc

... make a helluva lot more sense than T-hooks, which corrode (cuz they're cheap steel) or cut your (ever more expensive by the year/month/week/day) shirts when you get hit, or SR buckles, which are plastic and prone to breaking. The particular ones I pointed towards are aluminum, with no "moving" parts. Just slide the hook – mounted on the harness strap – thru the (leftover) loop on the CP (where the female end of the SR buckle was), and you're hooked. 

I've got photos. I just replaced my custom-fitted SR buckles last week, all set for 3 weeks in the desert. Should have put these G-hooks in a long time ago. My CP actually fits better than ever. 

I always seem to have a terrible time unhooking these, but I've never been great unhooking bras, so...

[The Man in Blue]

I won’t jump on you for that @MadMax …

I’ll jump on Force 3 because I still do not have any shinguards.  Sent them in about a month and a half ago.

Honestly forgot until you posted that, since I only wore them a handful of times and sold my F3 CP shortly after.

Just shot off another e-mail … 

[The Man in Blue]

8 hours ago, grayhawk said:

I had to look up G hooks.

It’s a myth.

[jimurrayalterego]

I don't understand this shinguard thing. Bought some Konigs K whatevers in 2006. Have taken 80 to 90 hits off them and never felt a thing. They have saved a few runs due to WP PB. 

[Aging_Arbiter]

I use and recommend the F3.  These are the best shins I've had since UmpShins.  UmpShins are no longer made (15-20 yrs ago?), but the closest thing to them are the Davis UmpShins.  Ump shins being the lightest thing I could find, but just a bit to big/bulky on the knee cap for my liking.

[834k3r]

On 10/7/2024 at 9:57 AM, MadMax said:

Gerry Davis Sports shinguards (model # pending)

[The Man in Blue]

Had a pair of DaviShins since I started (well, since I upgraded from catcher's shinguards and moved into the world of "real" umpiring).  I love the simplistic design (two straps, not a ton of "moving pieces") and the lower profile.  I figured the notch-and-tab "hooks" would be the fail-point when they finally gave out.  Roughly 15 years later and nothing has given out.  Never took any hits that concerned me.

The couple of times I wore the F3s, they were light and comfortable.  I admit I missed the feel of the simple elegance of the DaviShins, though.  The F3s were fine, but I felt more "suited up" like Iron Man than James Bond.

 

[Rock Bottom]

On 10/7/2024 at 7:45 AM, Umpiresrock74 said:

Force 3 is crap, I am retrofitting a pair of force 3 for a guy because of continuous injuries to his knee. This is the so called Kevlar they use in them. You see that little yellowish color sliver? that’s the Kevlar. It’s just a marketing scam. It does nothing.

 They are "crap" because of the questionable value of the Kevlar? Let's say you're right and it does nothing - that doesn't mean they are crap. Have you used them? I've taken 85 mph shots to them and they were perfect; many on this board with extensive experience consider them the best, or one of the best, shin guards out there. I'm all for sharing opinions, but when you make such a strong statement you should back it up with something about their performance. Even if the Kevlar is worthless for shin guards, it's not like these are overly expensive compared to other similar quality options.

[Umpiresrock74]

1 hour ago, Rock Bottom said:

 They are "crap" because of the questionable value of the Kevlar? Let's say you're right and it does nothing - that doesn't mean they are crap. Have you used them? I've taken 85 mph shots to them and they were perfect; many on this board with extensive experience consider them the best, or one of the best, shin guards out there. I'm all for sharing opinions, but when you make such a strong statement you should back it up with something about their performance. Even if the Kevlar is worthless for shin guards, it's not like these are overly expensive compared to other similar quality options.

I'm making the statement off the continuous injuries one of my customers has had because of the shin guards. Buckles breaking, the actual physical plastic breaking, and extensive bruising after taking shots off the shin guards. 

[Umpiresrock74]

Just now, Umpiresrock74 said:

I'm making the statement off the continuous injuries one of my customers has had because of the shin guards. Buckles breaking, the actual physical plastic breaking, and extensive bruising after taking shots off the shin guards. 

@Rock BottomI am also making this claim after dissecting these shin guards, how they are made, what materials they use, and such. I'm not saying I am an expert on the product; however, from what I have heard, seen, and evaluated, they aren't the best. Also note that this guy sees about mid-90s, so that could play a factor. I should have also clarified while I don't think Force 3 is the best brand out there, I wasn't directly saying everything Force 3 makes is crap; I was more saying its crap because they are so misleading on the Kevlar, yes, it has Kevlar in there, it just a tiny amount. If you have had a great experience with them, then good for you; all I was saying is I had a buddy of mine send in his shin guards (Force 3) to get retrofitted because of the continuous problems he has had with his Force 3, and after looking at them I have a good idea why. 

[The Man in Blue]

@Rock Bottom . . .