
jimurrayalterego
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jimurrayalterego last won the day on January 21
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About jimurrayalterego
- Currently Viewing Topic: Double base pickoff
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TASO Brush Country
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You attribute more confidence than you should to some NCAA umpires' rules knowledge. Many are there for game management ability and pass the NCAA test with the help of their association's group test session. Not that that's a bad thing. Good umps will dig in the rulebook to refresh their knowledge of some particular question. But there are others who are happy with their test score and don't care to crack the book open ever. You might have missed this thread:
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F3 faked a throw and hid the ball. No problem. F1 faked a catch and lollygagged behind the rubber thinking that he couldn't be on or astride it. F3 then tagged the runner. Now we have a hidden ball PLAY with F1 on the dirt. That's a balk.
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You probably have the straps attached to the side bar too low. They should be just below the top bar of the vision bars. Also the top strap should be shortened to bring the lateral strap up. The harness should not be “clamping” the mask to your head. It should just be holding it in position resting on the brim of your hat. No time right now for me to attach pic.
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Good point but i think his toe was on the white base until he was pushed/tagged.
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There are some interps about calling safe when pushed off the base and also some about a normal tag pushing the runner of the base. I think I would go with this tag being applied and runner safe and then a push which i would judge as still safe.
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Local rules - Local fools
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I do not understand the purpose of your reply. @Velho already posted this rule and I paraphrased it. Are you just reiterating the rule for the idiots who don't RTWFT and post oblivious to what's already been said?
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There is no hidden ball trick in any of the Codes' rules verbiage although it is in the OBR appendix. The FED rule does not allow the pitcher to be within 5 feet of the rubber without the ball. We have to allow common sense as to when to call this a balk. The NCAA rule actually does refer to a hidden ball play attempt and balks it if the pitcher is touching the dirt. OBR balks any pitcher who stands on or astride the rubber without the ball and we use common sense there also. I won't balk a fielder for faking a throw with his pitcher violating the Code's rule if there is not a play, a tag attempt. But I think only NCAA specifies a hidden ball play where, by rule, we can say faking a throw and putting the ball in your glove is not a balk as long as there is not a play. The other codes leave it up to common sense. In the OP the pitcher was on the dirt and there was a play which satisfies "hidden-ball-play".
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I've seen numerous hidden ball attempts by F3 but no play, thus no call. I think the key is it's a play when the tag is attempted.
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If you judged thru or by I don't have F4 able to make a play in NCAA and Pro but Harry might not agree:
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3 feet would be enough for thru and by if F3 was diving for it with an outstretched glove and he missed it. But that didn't happen.
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The ball being past F3 is not what we need to judge. Was it fieldable by him and it went thru or by him? If so we need to judge if F4 had a play. Otherwise, if not thru or by, R1 is out whether F4 had a play or not. It appears U1 called R1 out for INT and did not judge thru or by.
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Wendelstedt says that Pro umps would be of that judgement but whether that would be a blanket assumption I don't know. I lost my WUM but I think @Replacematt has referenced his own and might give the exact wording and diagram.
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The OP is not Pro. We have to then assume it was not thru or by and the INT call is correct.
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Just to be clear Wendelstedt was referring to thru or by to judge if F4 had a play. If not thru or by we don't care if F4 had a play. A runner hit by an untouched batted ball is out for INT except for the thru or by case.