Royals-Cards: Ball hits runner

[agdz59]

Situation: bases loaded, no outs.  Ground ball to shortstop.  Ball goes underneath SS glove and hits R2.  Play stops.  After crew chief confers with defensive manager, everyone is safe and run scores.

 

Question: Was this a booted call?  Shouldn't this have been nothing and play on?

[The Man in Blue]

Yes.

[Lou B]

What do you mean by play stops?

Did the umps call "Time"?

This is a live ball, play on (unless some sort of shift was on where another infielder had a play on the ball).

[agdz59]

27 minutes ago, Lou B said:

What do you mean by play stops?

Did the umps call "Time"?

This is a live ball, play on (unless some sort of shift was on where another infielder had a play on the ball).

 

Yes.  MLB hasn't posted video of that play.  If you have an MLB.TV subscription you can go to 2:10:30 of the Cardinal broadcast and see the play from behind the plate.  Arozarena (getting his first MLB hit) chops it to SS.  Goes under the SS glove and hits Yadi Molina in the heel.  Molina reacts by stopping and acting like he knows its interference and both SS and 2B point at him.  Soon after, the PU calls time.  I don't know if he took his cue from Molina who is known for his high baseball IQ or what. Both 2B and 3B umps were looking but neither signals safe or play on.

Maybe Gil will post something on UEFL.

[grayhawk]

1 hour ago, agdz59 said:

Situation: bases loaded, no outs.  Ground ball to shortstop.  Ball goes underneath SS glove and hits R2.  Play stops.  After crew chief confers with defensive manager, everyone is safe and run scores.

 

Question: Was this a booted call?  Shouldn't this have been nothing and play on?

What inning?  Who was batting?  I can look it up.

[Richvee]

If Molina is known for his high baseball IQ maybe it just fell a few points. This is a textbook case of a ball that is through or by a fielder and in such cases there is no interference. Everyone stopped playing-  offense and defense. I think at that point, with everyone just standing around doing nothing is when time was called and runners placed on the next base. Maybe pro mechanics want nothing called in such a spot, but I would hope that  any level I do that I would be on the ball enough to signal safe and verbalize “that’s nothing” in this spot. 

[grayhawk]

On the park audio, you can hear Greg Gibson tell Ned Yost, "It was behind him.  My fault."  That tells me that Gibson killed it before realizing F6 was playing in front.

[grayhawk]

Here you go:
 

 

[agdz59]

13 minutes ago, Richvee said:

If Molina is known for his high baseball IQ maybe it just fell a few points. This is a textbook case of a ball that is through or by a fielder and in such cases there is no interference. Everyone stopped playing-  offense and defense. I think at that point, with everyone just standing around doing nothing is when time was called and runners placed on the next base. Maybe pro mechanics want nothing called in such a spot, but I would hope that  any level I do that I would be on the ball enough to signal safe and verbalize “that’s nothing” in this spot. 

I've watched years of Cardinals baseball and Molina is super sharp.  I'm surprised he didn't read the play right. 

[agdz59]

9 minutes ago, grayhawk said:

On the park audio, you can hear Greg Gibson tell Ned Yost, "It was behind him.  My fault."  That tells me that Gibson killed it before realizing F6 was playing in front.

Yup. Good to know the best can do what I do.  :-)

[Richvee]

8 hours ago, agdz59 said:

I've watched years of Cardinals baseball and Molina is super sharp.  I'm surprised he didn't read the play right. 

Not sure it's reading the play. It's more knowing the rule. In Molina's defense, I'd bet there's less than 10 MLB players who know the "through or by" exception to INT. ..and that might be pushing it. 

[noumpere]

10 hours ago, agdz59 said:

Situation: bases loaded, no outs.  Ground ball to shortstop.  Ball goes underneath SS glove and hits R2.  Play stops. 

Based on the video below, it doesn't look like  the "play stops" until everyone advanced a base, and F6 had the ball in the infield (which, in MLB, means no one is likely to advance any more).

 

calling "time" at that instance isn't really needed, but it doesn't hurt and, especially in our games, it might get called eventually anyway because someone is going to want an explanation.

IT does point out that more often than not, it's better to just let things play out, and then put them back if needed (retroactive time) as opposed to calling time because "that surprised me and it must be something" and then having to figure out "what would have happened."

[stkjock]

Molina standing on 3rd smacks himself in the head like "duh"  

[agdz59]

1 hour ago, Richvee said:

Not sure it's reading the play. It's more knowing the rule. In Molina's defense, I'd bet there's less than 10 MLB players who know the "through or by" exception to INT. ..and that might be pushing it. 

Jim Edmonds and Dan mcGlothlin in the Cardinals tv booth sure didn't. They were concentrating on if it hit the glove or not.

[Guest MR_DH]

1 hour ago, agdz59 said:

Jim Edmonds and Dan mcGlothlin in the Cardinals tv booth sure didn't. They were concentrating on if it hit the glove or not.

To enter the tv booth requires a lobotomy to remove actual rule knowledge.

I would pay to have an ex-umpire be in the booth at all times to provide the clarifications.  The amount of corrections would take more time than the color commentary.

And be with Harold Reynolds at all times (in or out of the booth).  The guy with the least baseball knowledge I know... well maybe Time He-who-shall-not-be-named.

 

/SOAPBOX

 

 

 

[BLarson]

Why can't the MLB have a replay/rules guy like college/NFL...anytime a replay is done or something strange, they bring in the rules/replay expert to clarify and say what he would call.

[Lou B]

He probably smacked himself for getting hit by the ball, if he doesn't get hit he scores on the play!

[Aging_Arbiter]

I don't recall the exact play or situation, just the story...... but Steve Palermo was at a game as umpire supervisor, after he was confined to a wheel chair.  There was something that happened on the field, he was summoned to the announcer booth for rule interpretation.  Then.....they (announce team) told him that he was wrong.

I'm sure that some of you with a better memory can provide more details.  I would mention the site historian that maintains a plethora of knowledge, but refuse to call him out by name for fear of being publicly chastised again for providing accolades.

[stkjock]

2 hours ago, Lou B said:

He probably smacked himself for getting hit by the ball, it he doesn't get hit he scores on the play!

he's too slow to score on that ball 

[umpstu]

2 hours ago, Lou B said:

He probably smacked himself for getting hit by the ball, it he doesn't get hit he scores on the play!

Not sure about that.  Yadi ain't exactly a speed demon.  But man I love watching him play.  Hopefully he'll manage in the majors before too long.

[umpstu]

21 minutes ago, stkjock said:

he's too slow to score on that ball 

Just posted the same thing about his lack of speed.

[agdz59]

1 hour ago, umpstu said:

Not sure about that.  Yadi ain't exactly a speed demon.  But man I love watching him play.  Hopefully he'll manage in the majors before too long.

Not to drift too far away but I do too. One of the best baseball minds I've seen in a player.

[Lindsay]

19 hours ago, agdz59 said:

Maybe Gil will post something on UEFL.

Thanks for the suggestion. https://www.closecallsports.com/2019/08/runner-struck-by-batted-ball-behind.html

[Lou B]

He's a third of the way to third, the ball is still in the infield, if it didn't hit him it's on its way to the outfield grass.  Doubtful F7 or F8 is anywhere close, heck I could probably score from second on a grounder towards left center!

[umpstu]

35 minutes ago, Lou B said:

He's a third of the way to third, the ball is still in the infield, if it didn't hit him it's on its way to the outfield grass.  Doubtful F7 or F8 is anywhere close, heck I could probably score from second on a grounder towards left center!

It's Yadi.

[The Man in Blue]

Son of a gun ... wouldn’t you know it ... I had this happen today in a middle school softball game.

After explaining it to the defensive coach while the parents were chirping away, I heard a parent say “They are right, I saw that in the Cardinal game the other night.”