third out force play or is it a timing play

[Guest Noel]

Looking for NFHS rule interpretation .Situation :One out ,runners on first and third base . Batter hits fly ball to right field which is caught. Runner on third tags legally and scores. runner on first does not tag legally on tries to get back to first base and is thrown out before he gets back to first for the third out.  runner on third clearly touches home well before runner at first is called out. Is this a timing play or a force out at first base after fly ball is caught by right fielder. does run count ?  To me the runner from first needs time to get back to first so Im thinking its a timing play and not a force out play. Was is the correct ruling on play? need help

[udbrky]

This is a timing play.

[grayhawk]

It’s impossible to have a force play when a batted ball is caught in flight.

[Mister B]

The out at first is an appeal, the defense is appealing that the runner left before the catch and didn't re-touch. 

[noumpere]

5 hours ago, Mister B said:

The out at first is an appeal, the defense is appealing that the runner left before the catch and didn't re-touch. 

While true, you can have an appeal play that is also a force out -- just saying "this is an appeal play" does not answer the question.

[maven]

...because appeals come in 2 flavors, missed base and retouch. The former can be force plays, the latter never can be.

[blue23ll]

Think about it like this, WHAT is forcing the runner to advance?? Once the fly ball is caught, there is nothing forcing the runner to advance. 

[beerguy55]

On 4/14/2018 at 9:15 AM, blue23ll said:

Think about it like this, WHAT is forcing the runner to advance?? Once the fly ball is caught, there is nothing forcing the runner to advance. 

And standard newbie response would be "I never said he was forced to advance.  He's forced to retreat.  The rules say he MUST go back to first...that would be forcing him to retreat wouldn't it?  That's why you only have to touch the base...because he's forced...right?"

People asking this question don't know that the baseball vernacular for "force" is different than the dictionary version.

[noumpere]

17 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

And standard newbie response would be "I never said he was forced to advance.  He's forced to retreat.  The rules say he MUST go back to first...that would be forcing him to retreat wouldn't it?  That's why you only have to touch the base...because he's forced...right?"

People asking this question don't know that the baseball vernacular for "force" is different than the dictionary version.

The rule book does also use the term "forced to retreat" (or similar)

[beerguy55]

3 minutes ago, noumpere said:

The rule book does also use the term "forced to retreat" (or similar)

even better

[Richvee]

Still amazes me this is beyond the shadow of a doubt THE most asked question on the forum, and I've seen it exactly once in 7 years. Evidently it's happening numerous times across the country every single day. So much so that soon it should be common knowledge that this is a time play.  

[MadMax]

Just once, @Richvee?

My instance happened exactly like the OP... except with more bickering...

... and someone cursing me out in Spanish...

... and being asked to leave.

[Tborze]

53 minutes ago, MadMax said:

Just once, @Richvee?

My instance happened exactly like the OP... except with more bickering...

... and someone cursing me out in Spanish...

... and being asked to leave.

I know Spanish curse words

[Richvee]

5 hours ago, MadMax said:

Just once, @Richvee?

My instance happened exactly like the OP... except with more bickering...

... and someone cursing me out in Spanish...

... and being asked to leave.

HA! Yeah, just once. And with a lot less fanfare (pun intended) than yours. I was actually waiting for the OHC to at least question it...but not a word.