Professionalism

[spiritump]

Gentlemen, if your association mandates you give the full count signal with closed fists, that's what you do. your assignors/evaluators decide what is appropriate. You may not agree with it, but if you want assignments and big game assignments, you better do as you're told by the powers-that-be.

 

time to finf a new and better association

[Jocko]

If you keep jumping until you find an association you agree with 100%, pretty soon you'll find yourself with no games. There will always be something you think isn't correct. NFHS has done away with the DDB signal. AHSAA says we're still to use it. That's the whole state. Every HS umpire in Alabama is to use the defunct DDB half safe signal. Should I quit calling HS all together? Should I move to another state? Of course not.

South Carolina still has the umpire give an automatic out for leaving early on a tag situation. The whole state. Should they quit? Move?

I don't think so.

Aside from baseball, how often in your "real" job are you tasked with some ridiculous assignment you know is a bad idea? You gonna quit your job? Highly doubtful. And even if you did, the next job will undoubtedly have you doing things you disagree with. You gonna sacrifice weeks of vacation, seniority, benefits, and retirement because you are right but your superiors feel differently than you?

YOU DO AS YOUR SUPERIORS INSTRUCT YOU TO DO. PERIOD.

It would be pretty self-serving and sanctimonious of me to say that because your association does it different than mine, you are a lesser/worse group. I'm not so self-righteous to think that what I've been taught is the best or only way to do it. YMMV

I'm out :rantoff:

[JaxRolo]

If you keep jumping until you find an association you agree with 100%, pretty soon you'll find yourself with no games. There will always be something you think isn't correct. NFHS has done away with the DDB signal. AHSAA says we're still to use it. That's the whole state. Every HS umpire in Alabama is to use the defunct DDB half safe signal. Should I quit calling HS all together? Should I move to another state? Of course not.

South Carolina still has the umpire give an automatic out for leaving early on a tag situation. The whole state. Should they quit? Move?

I don't think so.

Aside from baseball, how often in your "real" job are you tasked with some ridiculous assignment you know is a bad idea? You gonna quit your job? Highly doubtful. And even if you did, the next job will undoubtedly have you doing things you disagree with. You gonna sacrifice weeks of vacation, seniority, benefits, and retirement because you are right but your superiors feel differently than you?

YOU DO AS YOUR SUPERIORS INSTRUCT YOU TO DO. PERIOD.

It would be pretty self-serving and sanctimonious of me to say that because your association does it different than mine, you are a lesser/worse group. I'm not so self-righteous to think that what I've been taught is the best or only way to do it. YMMV

I'm out

Some people just don't get it.

 

 

 

 

[Thunderheads]

This thread is getting stupid

 

My God people, enough already.

 

If you want to be a 'yes-man' and do whatever your assignors tell you to do REGARDLESS of it being right or wrong, then go ahead and do that.  If you KNOW (based on all published training manuals) that whatever your association/assignors are telling you is wrong, then why not bring it up and ask why?  Why don't we do this the way all training manuals are written??

 

For me, I come from the school of asking questions.  I expect a respectable answer, then I continue on with what I'm supposed to do whether I like or not.  This way, I'm conforming, but I'm also bringing up the fact that I know it's UN-conventional.   This way you see, ......you DON'T BECOME a robot

[JaxRolo]

This thread is getting stupid

 

My God people, enough already.

 

If you want to be a 'yes-man' and do whatever your assignors tell you to do REGARDLESS of it being right or wrong, then go ahead and do that.  If you KNOW (based on all published training manuals) that whatever your association/assignors are telling you is wrong, then why not bring it up and ask why?  Why don't we do this the way all training manuals are written??

 

For me, I come from the school of asking questions.  I expect a respectable answer, then I continue on with what I'm supposed to do whether I like or not.  This way, I'm conforming, but I'm also bringing up the fact that I know it's UN-conventional.   This way you see, ......you DON'T BECOME a robot

 

How do you know we are not bringing it up at meetings? Believe it or not some of us are smart enough to to bring it up. But if we want to move up we do it their way.

 

I'm sorry but when i get talked down to by other know nothing members (not referring to you Jeff) that think they are just the best and work for the best associations I will respond back.

 

There has been a lot of this going on lately. We are supposed to be a brotherhood.

[Thunderheads]

This thread is getting stupid

 

My God people, enough already.

 

If you want to be a 'yes-man' and do whatever your assignors tell you to do REGARDLESS of it being right or wrong, then go ahead and do that.  If you KNOW (based on all published training manuals) that whatever your association/assignors are telling you is wrong, then why not bring it up and ask why?  Why don't we do this the way all training manuals are written??

 

For me, I come from the school of asking questions.  I expect a respectable answer, then I continue on with what I'm supposed to do whether I like or not.  This way, I'm conforming, but I'm also bringing up the fact that I know it's UN-conventional.   This way you see, ......you DON'T BECOME a robot

 

How do you know we are not bringing it up at meetings? Believe it or not some of us are smart enough to to bring it up. But if we want to move up we do it their way.

 

I'm sorry but when i get talked down to by other know nothing members (not referring to you Jeff) that think they are just the best and work for the best associations I will respond back.

 

There has been a lot of this going on lately. We are supposed to be a brotherhood.

Not talking to 'you' Rolando............

[Richvee]

This thread is getting stupid

 

My God people, enough already.

 

If you want to be a 'yes-man' and do whatever your assignors tell you to do REGARDLESS of it being right or wrong, then go ahead and do that.  If you KNOW (based on all published training manuals) that whatever your association/assignors are telling you is wrong, then why not bring it up and ask why?  Why don't we do this the way all training manuals are written??

 

For me, I come from the school of asking questions.  I expect a respectable answer, then I continue on with what I'm supposed to do whether I like or not.  This way, I'm conforming, but I'm also bringing up the fact that I know it's UN-conventional.   This way you see, ......you DON'T BECOME a robot

Agree. Also agree with "when in Rome" as far as association "rules" go. ^^^^This^^^, is a lot different than the "Find another association, I'm doing it my way anyway" attitude in some posts. 

[hckyosgood30]

Guys you need to know the mechanics for your local association AND the pro/cca mechanics. Bc if you want to move up you need to know them and apply them, period. Until this year with runners in 1st and 3rd in fed we were in C. Now we join the rest of the known world in B. So would go to a college tryout and stand in c bc my association tells me to? Be a student of the game and your profession. Be able to umpire 360 degrees and work on your play awareness. So if someone asks you why you do that it's not bc my association tells me too.

[Thunderheads]

Completed the SEMUC in SE Michigan over the weekend..   I asked one of the instructors while doing field work about this situation.

 

Instructor is a MiLB umpire ....

 

ME: Question ....when a balk is called, does the other umpire echo the balk?

 

INSTRUCTOR: (while nodding his head) Yes, always

 

Also, during field work, it was pointed out for us to make sure the sequence for calling balks is:    "That's a balk, ....TIME"    And was emphasized (especially for people like us who work both FED and OBR) that calling TIME first 'could' lead to problems ....

 

Anyhow ........just more ammo for the argument going on

[bam]

From the AHSAA 2012-2013 Umpires Manual

Page 16, item 12

"Whenever a balk occurs, the umpire will point to the pitcher and call 'balk', then signal time, and award bases."

I don't think this wording is all inclusive. By literal interpretation, the umpire never gives a verbal "Time!"

Edit: the 1st sentence of item 12 states "When a balk occurs, the ball is dead immediately."

I thought since we were discussing NFHS, everyone knew that, but decided to add this for posterity.

Nice job of looking it up in the manual, Grasshopper....

The book is wrong! In an immediate dead ball situation, the first word out if your mouth should be TIME (as a wise man said above).

So what do you echo?  "Time", "Balk", or both?

[Thunderheads]

 

From the AHSAA 2012-2013 Umpires Manual

Page 16, item 12

"Whenever a balk occurs, the umpire will point to the pitcher and call 'balk', then signal time, and award bases."

I don't think this wording is all inclusive. By literal interpretation, the umpire never gives a verbal "Time!"

Edit: the 1st sentence of item 12 states "When a balk occurs, the ball is dead immediately."

I thought since we were discussing NFHS, everyone knew that, but decided to add this for posterity.

Nice job of looking it up in the manual, Grasshopper....

The book is wrong! In an immediate dead ball situation, the first word out if your mouth should be TIME (as a wise man said above).

So what do you echo?  "Time", "Balk", or both?

According to my instructor over the weekend, ....  both ....  

[Sayhey]

Semper fi, you did not have a partner. You had a man who bought or borrowed a umpire uniform.

You ever right to complain no matter what month it was.

[Sayhey]

I would suggest that all umpires that work Fed. rule book games and O.B.R.Games get in the habit of saying," that's a balk". If you are in a habit of calling time you are going to do it and the batter is going to hit a home run. Proper mechanic in O.B.R. if you are U.I.C. is point at pitcher with your left hand and then go into your set position as he delivers a pitch and wait to see what happens. If all runners and the batter-advance 1 base you ignore the balk. If not, enforce the balk and it is no pitch. We had a very good umpire in a high school game call a balk and then the batter hit a homer. He kept it live. After the batter touched home the defensive coach wanted to know why the batter got a homer

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

[grayhawk]

Amen brother!

The reason is LCD (Least Common Denominator). Fed believes the least among us is too ignorant to call it like OBR, so they dumb it down.

[LMSANS]

Ignoring the rules you don't agree with is the way to go.

[grayhawk]

Ignoring the rules you don't agree with is the way to go.

 

Just to clarify - I was not giving an "Amen" to the part about keeping that ball live.  That's flat out ridiculous.

[bam]

Ignoring the rules you don't agree with is the way to go.

Who was advocating ignoring rules?

Did I miss something?

Where am I?

[BalkHawk]

pass that, will ya?

[NFUA_44]

pass that, will ya?

Got a clip I can use on that?

[mstaylor]

SayHey said :

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

 

In OBR it is a live ball, in Fed, IT IS NOT. Whether you think it is stupid is irrelevant,that is the rule. If an umpire in my group let the HR stand, stating it is a stupid rule, would be missing some games.  

[bam]

. We had a very good umpire in a high school game call a balk and then the batter hit a homer. He kept it live. After the batter touched home the defensive coach wanted to know why the batter got a homer

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

How did the protest go?

[scrounge]

I would suggest that all umpires that work Fed. rule book games and O.B.R.Games get in the habit of saying," that's a balk". If you are in a habit of calling time you are going to do it and the batter is going to hit a home run. Proper mechanic in O.B.R. if you are U.I.C. is point at pitcher with your left hand and then go into your set position as he delivers a pitch and wait to see what happens. If all runners and the batter-advance 1 base you ignore the balk. If not, enforce the balk and it is no pitch. We had a very good umpire in a high school game call a balk and then the batter hit a homer. He kept it live. After the batter touched home the defensive coach wanted to know why the batter got a homer

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

 

To unilaterally appoint one's self as the arbiter of what rules are necessary and unnecessary and knowingly violate a fairly basic rule is unprofessional and unsupportable, no matter what. And the response was, frankly, cowardly.

[Thunderheads]

I would suggest that all umpires that work Fed. rule book games and O.B.R.Games get in the habit of saying," that's a balk". If you are in a habit of calling time you are going to do it and the batter is going to hit a home run. Proper mechanic in O.B.R. if you are U.I.C. is point at pitcher with your left hand and then go into your set position as he delivers a pitch and wait to see what happens. If all runners and the batter-advance 1 base you ignore the balk. If not, enforce the balk and it is no pitch. We had a very good umpire in a high school game call a balk and then the batter hit a homer. He kept it live. After the batter touched home the defensive coach wanted to know why the batter got a homer

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

I can't honestly see how you can call yourself an umpire ...........      

[HokieUmp]

 We had a very good umpire in a high school game call a balk and then the batter hit a homer. He kept it live. After the batter touched home the defensive coach wanted to know why the batter got a homer

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

 

So, what you're saying here is, it's okay to cheat a team because you don't like a rule?  So, it might be mean to say "that's a stupid philosophy," but you DID call me that last week, so good for the goose, good for the gander, etc.

 

Be honest:  the "very good umpire" wasn't you, was it?  Whoever it was, if he did that, he wasn't "very good" at all.  As bam asked:  how'd the protest go?

[Mike Prince]

I would suggest that all umpires that work Fed. rule book games and O.B.R.Games get in the habit of saying," that's a balk". If you are in a habit of calling time you are going to do it and the batter is going to hit a home run. Proper mechanic in O.B.R. if you are U.I.C. is point at pitcher with your left hand and then go into your set position as he delivers a pitch and wait to see what happens. If all runners and the batter-advance 1 base you ignore the balk. If not, enforce the balk and it is no pitch. We had a very good umpire in a high school game call a balk and then the batter hit a homer. He kept it live. After the batter touched home the defensive coach wanted to know why the batter got a homer

My friend told the coach that he could walk over to the player and tell him that his homer did not count because his pitcher balked. The coach walked back to his dugout and we scored the runs. It is an unnecessary Fed. rule. Why should the batter be penalized because the pitcher balked and then was silly enough to throw a pitch. In O.B.R. you might as well swing. It is a "free" pitch. Nothing negative can happen to the offense

My friend wrote a letter to the Feds. about the scenario and got a reply that made no sense just like the rule.

 

And we wonder why coaches are confused and pissed off at the umpires before a game even starts.  I'm sure the crew in either team's next game who makes this call correctly appreciates your efforts here to clean up the FED rules as you see fit.