Professionalism

[Jocko]

1 2 3 NOT IT!!!

[AZump78]

Sorry, but I'm moving on too Jocko. Being wrong is their prerogative.

[Jocko]

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

[noumpere]

what does, "don't echo unless you have to" mean?

That's not what he said..He said  Unless you have IT, TOO. 

Right. If i see the balk then I call it even if my partner has already called it.  But if I don't know whay the pitcher balked (maybe I'm at first and the RHP seperated his hands from the set) then I can call time if needed after the balk call but I shouldnt be yelling "balk".  Thats what was mentioned.

[Guest]

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

 

 

Here's the way I look at it:

 

None of us like to be shown up. If someone shows us up bad enough, we dump them. I know that when I played, I would have been extremely pissed off if I was shown up by an umpire / referee. Therefore, I attempt to be cognizant of this when I'm working. 

 

If the whole park sees the balk, I'm not going to shove it up the pitcher's ass. For instance, last year, I had a RHP try to go to 1B with a quick jab step, except he caught a spike, went ass over tea kettle, and the ball rolled about 15 feet to 1B. Didn't even say anything, just motioned the runner to 2B. 

 

On the other hand, when you have something more discrete / borderline, you need to be loud and demonstrative (if applicable - don't be pointing as PU if you've got a pitch inbound), so there is no doubt as to A) who is calling the balk and b ) when exactly you call the balk (to save the 'you got talked into that' argument).

 

Think to MLB games. Even the least sensitive ballpark microphones usually pick up the umpires yelling for a balk. Unless it's clearly obvious. 

 

Also, FWIW, in amateur ball, I think it is unwise to echo a balk call if you don't have the balk. I will call time and direct the runners as needed but I will not echo because of the reasons mentioned above. However, it was said above PBUC wants the balk echoed...at that level, the reasons mentioned above are probably going to be irrelevant because umpires at that stage will know enough to step up and intercept a manager coming out to argue with the wrong umpire. 

[Pete Peterson Sr]

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

 

 

Far be it from me to disagree, but you have it backward. Call "balk", signal time, and award bases.

[Jocko]

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

  Far be it from me to disagree, but you have it backward. Call "balk", signal time, and award bases.

maybe I misread my eval, but I got dinged for not calling time first. I think I still have the email. I'll reread it again.

[Pete Peterson Sr]

 

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

  Far be it from me to disagree, but you have it backward. Call "balk", signal time, and award bases.

 

maybe I misread my eval, but I got dinged for not calling time first. I think I still have the email. I'll reread it again.

 

 

 Try the mechanics manual, instead. Hell, maybe I am wrong. It has happened before.

[Jocko]

 

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

  Far be it from me to disagree, but you have it backward. Call "balk", signal time, and award bases. 

maybe I misread my eval, but I got dinged for not calling time first. I think I still have the email. I'll reread it again.

   Try the mechanics manual, instead. Hell, maybe I am wrong. It has happened before.

tomorrow. Books are in my truck and it's too dang cold out there!

[Pete Peterson Sr]

 

 

 

This seems like a good segue into another balk question. In FED, the proper way to call balk is to first call and signal "Time! That's a balk!" OBR, it's simply "That's a balk!" Here's the question. When you call it, how loud and emphatic are you? I tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, when I call a non-fed balk, F1 is so startled by my projected vocalization that he fails to deliver the pitch. This, IMO, is the best case scenario. Since no pitch is thrown, no further action is necessary except to award bases. Cuts down on the confusion, and makes my job easier. Sound off.

  Far be it from me to disagree, but you have it backward. Call "balk", signal time, and award bases. 

 

maybe I misread my eval, but I got dinged for not calling time first. I think I still have the email. I'll reread it again.

 

   Try the mechanics manual, instead. Hell, maybe I am wrong. It has happened before.

 

tomorrow. Books are in my truck and it's too dang cold out there!

 

 

 

WUSS

[Jocko]

Come on, Pete! I'm already in my jammies!

[Pete Peterson Sr]

Come on, Pete! I'm already in my jammies!

 

 

 

 Aight. Please know the correct procedure for the meeting Sunday.

[Jocko]

Come on, Pete! I'm already in my jammies!

    Aight. Please know the correct procedure for the meeting Sunday.

¡Si Señor Pedro!

[JaxRolo]

I hate to agree with The Jock Man but the procedure is: "Time" "That's a Balk" "Time"

[UmpTTS43]

When you have a situation where you have an immediate dead ball the first word out of your mouth should be "Time"

[Thunderheads]

When you have a situation where you have an immediate dead ball the first word out of your mouth should be "Time"

only when you're playing FED and there's a balk...

 

UmpTTS43:  Do you echo?

[JaxRolo]

When you have a situation where you have an immediate dead ball the first word out of your mouth should be "Time"

only when you're playing FED and there's a balk...

 

UmpTTS43:  Do you echo?

 

When would an immediate dead ball not be time?

[Thunderheads]

 

When you have a situation where you have an immediate dead ball the first word out of your mouth should be "Time"

only when you're playing FED and there's a balk...

 

UmpTTS43:  Do you echo?

 

When would an immediate dead ball not be time?

Rolando, that's not what I said, or meant.

 

This post has primarily talking about balks.  So, I took UmpTTS's post and referenced it to balks.  In OBR a balk isn't immediate dead ball ....   that's all I was saying, ...  and, ....I asked him if he echos a balk call.

 

CAVEAT:  Trust me I know that UmpTTS knows what rule-set is an immediate dead ball on a balk, I was just kind of funning with the details

[Jocko]

From the AHSAA 2012-2013 Umpires Manual

Page 16, item 12

"Whenever a balk occurs, the umpire will point to the pitcher and call 'balk', then signal time, and award bases."

I don't think this wording is all inclusive. By literal interpretation, the umpire never gives a verbal "Time!"

Edit: the 1st sentence of item 12 states "When a balk occurs, the ball is dead immediately."

I thought since we were discussing NFHS, everyone knew that, but decided to add this for posterity.

[JaxRolo]

From the AHSAA 2012-2013 Umpires Manual

 

 

Must really be the ASSHA Umpires Manual.  You gor the letters backwards!

[grayhawk]

From the official NFHS Umpire Manual, page 34:

 

(16) BALKS. The umpire calling the balk shall point to the pitcher and call loudly, "That's a balk!" The ball is dead at the time of the balk. Umpires should signal a dead ball while calling out, "That's a balk!"

[Jocko]

From the official NFHS Umpire Manual, page 34: (16) BALKS. The umpire calling the balk shall point to the pitcher and call loudly, "That's a balk!" The ball is dead at the time of the balk. Umpires should signal a dead ball while calling out, "That's a balk!"

again, no verbal "Time!"

[Thunderheads]

From the AHSAA 2012-2013 Umpires Manual

Page 16, item 12

"Whenever a balk occurs, the umpire will point to the pitcher and call 'balk', then signal time, and award bases."

I don't think this wording is all inclusive. By literal interpretation, the umpire never gives a verbal "Time!"

CORRECT, that would be FED ...

 

I said OBR it's not immediate

[Jocko]

From the AHSAA 2012-2013 Umpires ManualPage 16, item 12"Whenever a balk occurs, the umpire will point to the pitcher and call 'balk', then signal time, and award bases."I don't think this wording is all inclusive. By literal interpretation, the umpire never gives a verbal "Time!"

CORRECT, that would be FED ... I said OBR it's not immediate

Agreed, the ball is delayed dead in OBR, but the mechanics for calling it are very similar in both codes. Neither require a verbal "Time"

[UmpTTS43]

Thunder

Echoing balks for me requires a thorough pregame with my partner. Depending on crew and type of game it is not an automatic that we do it.

my partner and I must have a complete understanding of how this mechanic works and how to handle situations when a coach wants to come out and goes to the echoing guy.

What chaps my behind is that there are those that say to do it without explaining the proper procedures for doing so.

This is what I believe should happen when balks are echoed. When the appropriate time comes, (play complete, play has stopped, or time has been called) the original calling umpire should come out and repeat the balk call and verbalize the infraction. ie "That's a balk. No stop". This way your partner knows at least why you made the call and if coach happens to go to the echoer he has an explanation.

In the event that an explanation is not given and coach comes out, the calling umpire should immediately get coach's attention and try to have the conversation. If coach continues out to your partner you let him go and you get to see if your partner is able to handle business.

This is what I see happen most of the time when crews say they will echo without going through it pregame. One umpire sees a balk, the other does not. A balk is called. Partner echoes. No explanation by original caller. Coach goes to other guy. Other guy simply says he balked and leaves it at that resulting in a not so nice encounter. Or, tells coach what might have happened which is usually wrong. Next inning coach asks original caller what he had. Surprise, different call. Now coach has issue, at minimum with other guy and his credibility, or at most, with the entire crew.

To answer your original question "do you echo?"

Sometimes