Obstruction

[Jessebleu]

BR misses first base and eventually is obstructed (in a rundown between third and home) as he is attempting to return to third base. The umpire correctly calls time and awards him home plate. Prior to touching home, the BR legally returns and touches first base. What now is his award? (Home or Second).  OBR 6.01(h)(1)

[agdz59]

How did the runner legally return to touch first if the ball was dead?

[Coach Carl]

I believe this applies:

5.09(c)(2) APPROVED RULIING (B)

(c) Appeal Plays

Any runner shall be called out, on appeal, when:

(1) After a fly ball is caught, he fails to retouch his original base before he or his original base is tagged; Rule 5.09(c)(1) Comment: “Retouch,” in this rule, means to tag up and start from a contact with the base after the ball is caught. A runner is not permitted to take a flying start from a position in back of his base. Such runner shall be called out on appeal.

(2)  With the ball in play, while advancing or returning to a base, he fails to touch each base in order before he, or a missed base, is tagged;

APPROVED RULING: (A) No runner may return to touch a missed base after a following runner has scored. (B) When the ball is dead, no runner may return to touch a missed base or one he has left after he has advanced to and touched a base beyond the missed base. 

Once he advanced to and touched second (the "base beyond the missed base") AND the ball became dead, he could not legally correct his error at first base.  

If he does run the bases in reverse order to (apparently) correct the error and a valid appeal is made when the ball becomes live again, the appeal should be granted since his touch should not be recognized as a valid correction. 

 

[grayhawk]

@Coach Carl cited the correct rule, however, hIs award is home. The defense must still appeal the missed base at 1st, in which case if that appeal is properly carried out, he should be called out. The rule doesn't prevent him from "physically" returning to first. It prevents him from "legally" returning to first.

So the mechanics of this should be:

OBR & NCAA: Call time for the type 1 obstruction and declare, "That's obstruction! You, score!"
FED: Point at the infraction and declare, "That's obstruction!," wait until the play has concluded and then make the award.

Allow the runner to reverse course and return to 3rd, 2nd, and 1st and then back to 2nd, 3rd and home. Do not allow an appeal until this happens.

OBR & NCAA: When the next batter gets in the box and the pitcher is on the rubber, put the ball in play. If the defense appeals, then the proper umpire should make the out call. If they don't appeal, then play on.
FED: Allow the verbal, dead ball appeal (or, if they don't know they can do this, see above, or try to avoid all that by just asking the coach what they're doing. Hopefully, he'll say, "We're going to appeal that he missed 1st," and then he can just be called out.

[noumpere]

1 hour ago, Coach Carl said:

APPROVED RULING: (A) No runner may return to touch a missed base after a following runner has scored. (B) When the ball is dead, no runner may return to touch a missed base or one he has left after he has advanced to and touched a base beyond the missed base. 

 

 

Although the wording is strange, in OBR, this means that the runner may not touch the next base AFTER the ball becomes dead.  So, he could correct his error in the OP up until the time he touches home.

 

In FED, a runner cannot legally correct his error if he in on or past the next base WHEN the ball becomes dead.

[TOMUIC]

That is correct in the OBR AND NCAA. THE runner can legally return to touch first base. The original question asked refers to the award for obstruction, home or second, based on OBR 6.01(h)(1).

[grayhawk]

1 hour ago, noumpere said:

Although the wording is strange, in OBR, this means that the runner may not touch the next base AFTER the ball becomes dead.  So, he could correct his error in the OP up until the time he touches home.

 

In FED, a runner cannot legally correct his error if he in on or past the next base WHEN the ball becomes dead.

Ahh, yes. Right you are Mr. Kott-air...

[umpstu]

1 hour ago, grayhawk said:

Ahh, yes. Right you are Mr. Kott-air...

I get it

[TOMUIC]

6.01(h)(1) states that the obstructed runner is awarded at least one base beyond the last base legally touched before the obstruction. Does the runner get home or second after correcting his missing of first base?

[maven]

Home. The fact that the runner missed 1B does not nullify the legality of the touch of 3B.

[noumpere]

3 hours ago, TOMUIC said:

6.01(h)(1) states that the obstructed runner is awarded at least one base beyond the last base legally touched

First base wasn't legally touched at the time of OBS so ...

[TOMUIC]

So what..,.?

[TOMUIC]

I don’t think you finished your thought

[834k3r]

4 hours ago, noumpere said:

First base wasn't legally touched at the time of OBS so ...

I may be misreading where you're heading with this thought, but the touch/no-touch at 1B really has no bearing on the OBS. The obstructed runner is given one base past last legally touched, so the runner in the OP is awarded home.

Please correct me if I'm missing something.

[noumpere]

Just pointing out that if the minimum award is "one base past the base last legally touched" the (minimum) award can't be second.

[Biscuit]

Oh man, I need to go back to pro school or go dig out my MiLB manual... There are cases where you adjust the award based on the runner correcting their base running mistakes. I distinctly remember awarding runners home on a dead ball, then, when they go back and correct a mistake, changing the award. I cannot for the life of me remember when that is. Any help before I go find the manual?

[TOMUIC]

You are referring to the play in which a runner returns to a base left too soon on a caught fly ball. His original award based on his location may be changed when he goes back to retouch the base left to soon and now the award will be made from the original base; many members on this site also feel the same concept applies to a missed base. However, it is not specifically stated in the rules or the manual for a missed base. I think the original question regarding the obstruction award was hinting towards this idea of the original base after the base running mistake is corrected. 

[Biscuit]

9 hours ago, TOMUIC said:

You are referring to the play in which a runner returns to a base left too soon on a caught fly ball. His original award based on his location may be changed when he goes back to retouch the base left to soon and now the award will be made from the original base; many members on this site also feel the same concept applies to a missed base. However, it is not specifically stated in the rules or the manual for a missed base. I think the original question regarding the obstruction award was hinting towards this idea of the original base after the base running mistake is corrected. 

Yep, pulled out the manual last night and taht is what I'm referring to. It makes sense to me that the same concept would apply, but I've never seen it in writing, and I've never been taught it. 

[TOMUIC]

Good for you. That is what the problem is with the OBR, the award on the missed base (on an overthrow) and this case of obstruction is not clearly spelled out, and yet the theory is that the award is made from the last base legally touched, (which means the base they go back and correct the mistake at). So basically it seems to be still up in the air.