Clapping and whistling on the bases

[Nic]

Babe Ruth 15U game between two towns that feed into the same high school. The kids all go to school together. It was chippy between the two sides before we even showed up on the field.

One particular kid was extra obnoxious above all the other kids. I was BU and the obnoxious kid reaches base and proceeds to clap and scream at the pitcher the entire way around the bases. He reaches 3B and his act goes up to another gear. 

I couldn't remember if this was allowed or not so I erred on the side of caution and sided with the defensive team. I quietly instructed the runner to stop clapping. He wasn't satisfied but he did stop clapping. 

Next time up, he gets on and now he's whistling and yelling "hey hey hey" the entire time around the bases. He gets to 3B and I tell him knock off the whistling.

Now he throws a fit. The 3B coach cries bloody murder. Another coach threw a fit. "There's nothing in the rulebook against it!!" 

I can't find anything that says it's not allowed. In fact, most everything says to let the players police themselves. At 14?! 

And Im not usually one to make a mountain out of a mole hill, but this seemed especially egregious.

Is clapping and chanting and whistling really allowed by the baserunner? How do you handle this?

[Jimurray]

4 minutes ago, Nic said:

Babe Ruth 14U game between two towns that feed into the same high school. The kids all go to school together. It was chippy between the two sides before we even showed up on the field.

One particular kid was extra obnoxious above all the other kids. I was BU and the obnoxious kid reaches base and proceeds to clap and scream at the pitcher the entire way around the bases. He reaches 3B and his act goes up to another gear. 

I couldn't remember if this was allowed or not so I erred on the side of caution and sided with the defensive team. I quietly instructed the runner to stop clapping. He wasn't satisfied but he did stop clapping. 

Next time up, he gets on and now he's whistling and yelling "hey hey hey" the entire time around the bases. He gets to 3B and I tell him knock off the whistling.

Now he throws a fit. The 3B coach cries bloody murder. Another coach threw a fit. "There's nothing in the rulebook against it!!" 

I can't find anything that says it's not allowed. In fact, most everything says to let the players police themselves. At 14?! 

And Im not usually one to make a mountain out of a mole hill, but this seemed especially egregious.

Is clapping and chanting and whistling really allowed by the baserunner? How do you handle this?

I tell him it’s annoying me. 

[Senor Azul]

From the 2015 Babe Ruth rules:

No manager, player, substitute, coach, trainer or batboy shall at any time, whether from the bench, the coach’s box or on the playing field or elsewhere--

4.06(a)(3) Call “Time,” or employ any other word or phrase or commit any act while the ball is alive and in play for the obvious purpose of trying to make the pitcher commit a balk.

Penalty:  The offender shall be removed from the game and shall leave the playing field, and, if a balk is made, it shall be nullified.

From the 2016 Wendelstedt manual (p. 52):

Participants in the game, active or otherwise, are prohibited from:  Calling or employing any other word or phrases, or commit any act while the ball is alive, for the purpose of making the pitcher balk. [6.04(a)(3)]

From the 2018 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (p.124):

Any player, manager or coach who fails to comply with an order from an umpire to do or refrain from doing anything that affects administering the rules and regulations governing play is subject to ejection in accordance with Official Baseball Rule 8.01.

[maven]

For FED, I use 3-3-1f(4), which prohibits unsporting action not in the spirit of fair play. Warn (I notify coach that I've warned his player), then eject.

For me, this is a game management issue. Sure, a little teenage exuberance is to be expected. But when it crosses the line, it threatens to ruin the game.

Good judgment and experience tell us when it crosses the line.

[SeeingEyeDog]

15U? Jeez...

What do I have to do to keep you in this game tonight? Grow up...knock it off.

~Dawg

[Nic]

46 minutes ago, SeeingEyeDog said:

15U? Jeez...

What do I have to do to keep you in this game tonight? Grow up...knock it off.

~Dawg

Exactly. On top of being d-bags, they acted like I was out of line for saying something. It was like a bizarro world. 

[Nic]

2 hours ago, maven said:

For FED, I use 3-3-1f(4), which prohibits unsporting action not in the spirit of fair play. Warn (I notify coach that I've warned his player), then eject.

For me, this is a game management issue. Sure, a little teenage exuberance is to be expected. But when it crosses the line, it threatens to ruin the game.

Good judgment and experience tell us when it crosses the line.

Well put. It seemed like this kid was being a bully and it started to infringe on the grounds of unsportsmanlike behavior.  Almost like he was tainting.

[Nic]

9 hours ago, Senor Azul said:

From the 2015 Babe Ruth rules:

No manager, player, substitute, coach, trainer or batboy shall at any time, whether from the bench, the coach’s box or on the playing field or elsewhere--

4.06(a)(3) Call “Time,” or employ any other word or phrase or commit any act while the ball is alive and in play for the obvious purpose of trying to make the pitcher commit a balk.

Penalty:  The offender shall be removed from the game and shall leave the playing field, and, if a balk is made, it shall be nullified.

From the 2016 Wendelstedt manual (p. 52):

Participants in the game, active or otherwise, are prohibited from:  Calling or employing any other word or phrases, or commit any act while the ball is alive, for the purpose of making the pitcher balk. [6.04(a)(3)]

From the 2018 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (p.124):

Any player, manager or coach who fails to comply with an order from an umpire to do or refrain from doing anything that affects administering the rules and regulations governing play is subject to ejection in accordance with Official Baseball Rule 8.01.

I wish I had these references last night when the maniac coach was yelling at me to prove you couldn't clap and whistle at the pitcher. Thank you sir!

[ousafe]

3 hours ago, Nic said:

tainting

Ummm...taunting? 🤔

[HokieUmp]

5 minutes ago, ousafe said:

Ummm...taunting? 🤔

Actually, it DOES seem like the kid was behaving in a taint-like manner.  So, sure - you can verb that word.

[beerguy55]

15 hours ago, Nic said:

Is clapping and chanting and whistling really allowed by the baserunner? How do you handle this?

Be careful on this...YES, they are allowed.  The baserunner can clap, cheer, chant just like the rest of the players on the bench would.

What you're talking about is potential taunting, unsportsmanlike behavior and maybe trying to induce a balk...the actions you mention are only a problem (potentially) because they are directed AT the pitcher...and in that respect, it doesn't really matter if he's clapping, whistling, belching or singing YMCA.

So, don't focus on the verb...the issue is the intent/target.

And, yeah, it may look like you're out of line if they've been able to do that every other game to this point and no other ump ever said anything...that doesn't mean you're wrong, but it's your judgment and the potential is there that you're less tolerant than other umps.  This is completely different than a pitcher getting away with a balk all season until he runs into an ump that enforces the rule correctly...your situation is one of pure judgment...party dictated by experience to what is and isn't over the line...but also dictated by sensitivity and a lot of emotional elements that can change hourly.  And from a game management perspective, a lot of umps will ignore this entirely, as is their judgment.

For me, I would look for any reason I could to shut down ANY bush league behavior - it's annoying, and it's not baseball.  In the end that is another reason why I probably should never become an ump.

[aaluck]

5 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

For me, I would look for any reason I could to shut down ANY bush league behavior - it's annoying, and it's not baseball.  In the end that is another reason why I probably should never become an ump.

Its actually the very reason you should become an ump.

Too many folks let anything and everything happen and when a competent umpire shows up he's 'the bad guy'. Jewelry, hybrid pitching, coming set, two batters outside the dugout warming up (I've seen 10 guys out there swinging with the coach saying 'we've done it all year), FPSR, batter standing up with one foot in each box after a 'swing' on a steal, assistant coaches arguing with umpires, I could go on for pages.

Incompetent, 'nice guy umpires' make everyone's job harder.  You can be liked as a umpire AND enforce the rules. However, if you cannot you are only being paid for one of the two.

[mac266]

On 5/27/2021 at 7:26 AM, Nic said:

Well put. It seemed like this kid was being a bully and it started to infringe on the grounds of unsportsmanlike behavior.  Almost like he was tainting.

Tainting maybe, but I'll call it taunting.