Combo pants

[Storm13]

I am a fairly new umpire to the high school level and am wanting to get your thoughts on combo pants?  Do you wear them or do you have separate pants for the plate and bases?  Thanks for your comments.

[udbrky]

I like the separate pants. I got a pair of combos to keep in the car for emergencies, but never even got around to getting them hemmed. I think it might be a personal preference though.

[Stk004]

18 minutes ago, Storm13 said:

I am a fairly new umpire to the high school level and am wanting to get your thoughts on combo pants?  Do you wear them or do you have separate pants for the plate and bases?  Thanks for your comments.

I find I need my pants hemmed at a different length for base vs. Plate, so I like them separate.

[Tksjewelry]

HS, if I could, I'd get plate and base pants. Combos are great for multiple kiddie game days.

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[Mudisfun]

In my area for the first couple HS seasons most of your games would be solo so plate makes more sense.

That being said my first couple seasons umpiring was little league so I was base and plate often so combos it was.

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[Magic]

I think my first 2 seasons of High School I wore Combo pants. Now I have at least 3 base and 3 plate pants for every season.

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[Kevin_K]

If you plan on continuing with umpiring, it would probably serve you best to get plate pants and base pants.

Whether you (or anyone else for that matter) agree with it or not, you are going to be judged by other umpires by the way you appear. If those who assign your games care about your appearance, you will stifle your progress and level of the games you receive by wearing what many consider to be unprofessional gear. On another note, if you plan on staying with umpiring, it is probably better to not get combo pants because you will want to have base and plate pants in a matter of time. The money spent on the combo pants will likely be money that hangs in the closet after a while.

Your question is akin to other equipment questions. Should you spend the money on quality gear initially or should you spend less initially and more in the long run when you upgrade to better equipment?

My .02? Get both and get multiples of each.

 

[MadMax]

I used to be one of the champions of the Combo Cause. I was doing 50-70 ball, primarily, and lots of games – we're talking 15 in a three day weekend, with 7 on Saturday. And, they were usually "drumbeat" schedules, with 15 minutes (if lucky) changeovers between games. And, you'd change partners, swap guys in and out, and not know if you were plate or base until mere minutes before the next plate meeting.

Besides that, I'm a fairly tall, slim umpire with an athletic build and profile. I would wear low-profile shinguards (either hockey shinguards or All-Star LGU313-17's), so combos worked just fine.

As you go up the age / skill levels, the games aren't as frenetic and frequent. You actually get time between games, if at a tournament or a doubleheader, to change and compose yourself. Even doing Scout / Recruiter -level showcase ball here in Arizona (now), there is time and expectation that we (as umpires) look the part and conduct ourselves in a near-professional manner. Surely, there are some games where you bust out the cheap combos because you know they're going to get trashed (dust, dirt, mud, etc.) and most of the guys do likewise, so it's no big deal. But, there are some guys who have nothing but combos... and they look... well... out of place.

Before I relocated to Arizona, I invested in a set of Davis-by-Fechheimer PolyWools and had them tailored exceptionally well. Best investment I ever made. I have to rinse them in my shower (cold water only) to get the salt off after nearly every day (what is it with this state??!!), and then when I have a downtime (about 2-3 days), I get them dry cleaned. If anything, I should get one more set, or a set of less expensive "common" polyesters just to beat on for the subprime games I do day-to-day.

If you're doing High School games of any substance or importance (i.e.. not Fall Ball / introduction-to-baseball stuff), leave the combos in the trunk and use the proper pants for the role. You'll look sharp.

[catsbackr]

Combo pants look to blousy (is that a word) for the bases and are too tight for shinguards.  Combo pants look AWFUL.  

 

It's one game fee, buy plate and base pants.

[KenBAZ]

Max:

I use My one pair of combos every day and have for years! They hang in my car and separate my base pants from my plate pants. I may never have worn them. Too loose for the bases, too tight for the plate.

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[LittleBlue]

When I started working games as a summer job at 14 I asked my parents to get me combo pants for my birthday (they figured it was cheaper than video games or anything electronic so they got me them). It made me look more professional than the other kids and I got more games as a result. When I was 18 and decided to work HS games I invested in plate and base pants. It made me look more professional and I got more games (not just HS but other levels of ball as well). You can see the trend right? Invest in your uniform and look good on the field and it will say a lot about how much you care about your job. Your fellow officials and assigners will notice, not to mention you'll be more comfortable too!

[BT_Blue]

@MadMax so you would recommend the Davis/Fechheimer pants? I will be buying a pair or two next year.

[Storm13]

 @Stk004 @MadMax @LittleBlue @KenBAZ I have another question...how should a pair of base pants fit...I went ahead and bought both plate and base pants on a great deal at Ump-Attire. (Got the Smitty Poly-wools for both)  The base pants seem to be a little baggy...is that normal?  Also what is the proper way to hem them?  I was asked by the seamstress what type of break I want.  Not sure what is appropriate for umpiring.  Thanks for all the help and have a great day.

[Stk004]

5 minutes ago, Storm13 said:

 @Stk004 @MadMax @LittleBlue @KenBAZ I have another question...how should a pair of base pants fit...I went ahead and bought both plate and base pants on a great deal at Ump-Attire. (Got the Smitty Poly-wools for both)  The base pants seem to be a little baggy...is that normal?  Also what is the proper way to hem them?  I was asked by the seamstress what type of break I want.  Not sure what is appropriate for umpiring.  Thanks for all the help and have a great day.

My base pants are pretty snug at the bottom. Fit like slacks. I don't know the first thing about hemming. 

[Replacematt]

32 minutes ago, Storm13 said:

 @Stk004 @MadMax @LittleBlue @KenBAZ I have another question...how should a pair of base pants fit...I went ahead and bought both plate and base pants on a great deal at Ump-Attire. (Got the Smitty Poly-wools for both)  The base pants seem to be a little baggy...is that normal?  Also what is the proper way to hem them?  I was asked by the seamstress what type of break I want.  Not sure what is appropriate for umpiring.  Thanks for all the help and have a great day.

What do you mean by baggy?

I would suggest having them hemmed to the top of your soles in the rear with a military break.

[Storm13]

48 minutes ago, Matt said:

What do you mean by baggy?

I would suggest having them hemmed to the top of your soles in the rear with a military break.

The pants seem to be pretty loose at the top

[Replacematt]

28 minutes ago, Storm13 said:

The pants seem to be pretty loose at the top

In the waist? Billowy with the pleats?

[LittleBlue]

2 hours ago, Storm13 said:

 @Stk004 @MadMax @LittleBlue @KenBAZ I have another question...how should a pair of base pants fit...I went ahead and bought both plate and base pants on a great deal at Ump-Attire. (Got the Smitty Poly-wools for both)  The base pants seem to be a little baggy...is that normal?  Also what is the proper way to hem them?  I was asked by the seamstress what type of break I want.  Not sure what is appropriate for umpiring.  Thanks for all the help and have a great day.

Mine base pants aren't really tight at the bottom but they're definitely not baggy like my plate pants would be if worn on the bases. They look more like normal pants while still having enough room to run and go hands in knees without worrying about the pants ripping.

When having plate and base pants hemmed always bring your shoes and shin guards and wear them while the seamstress measures you so you get the right length. I don't know much more than that but I would follow what @Matt said.

[MadMax]

On 10/22/2016 at 10:20 AM, BT_Blue said:

@MadMax so you would recommend the Davis/Fechheimer pants? I will be buying a pair or two next year.

Absolutely, @BT_Blue, I would heavily and heartily recommend the Davis-by-Fechheimer PolyWools. I've been surprised that, despite my relocation from wintery Wisconsin to arid (and too f#©kin' hot all the f#©kin' time) Arizona, these PolyWools are light, breathable and able to withstand whatever I throw at them. They are the genuine article. I do treat them with kid gloves, though, and only rinse them in a cold shower and air-dry them after they get a-salted and soiled by sand and dust. My plate pants take the brunt of it. Whenever I have a few days away from umpiring (2-3 day span) I've been taking them to a local dry cleaner and they do an excellent job cleaning them.

Sizing-wise, I am 6'2" 205-10, and wear a 34x34 in jeans and slacks. I purchased the 36 in both Base and Plate, and they fit very well. I had them professionally altered (hemmed) and I got the "military break" that @Matt alluded to. I was surprised by both pairs, each in their own way – the Plate pants easily accommodate my Force3 Ultimate shinguards and a Nutty-buddy personal protector, yet you really don't noticeably see either when worn, nor are the pants all billowy and oversized. I am a very mobile umpire, and I don't even feel or notice these when I have to dash to 2B or 3B to cover a call. So too, the Base pants are rather trim and slim in the legs, but they certainly are not "skinny jeans", yet when I go hands on knees out in the field, they don't feel constrictive.

21 hours ago, Storm13 said:

 @Stk004 @MadMax @LittleBlue @KenBAZ I have another question...how should a pair of base pants fit...I went ahead and bought both plate and base pants on a great deal at Ump-Attire. (Got the Smitty Poly-wools for both)  The base pants seem to be a little baggy...is that normal?  Also what is the proper way to hem them?  I was asked by the seamstress what type of break I want.  Not sure what is appropriate for umpiring.  Thanks for all the help and have a great day.

I can't speak as to how the Smitty Poly-wools specifically fit now, as I bought a set of Smitty Poly-wool combos and returned them immediately because the "magic expanding" waistband was waaaaaaayyyyyy too complex and felt and looked like wearing a cummerbund. The pleating was just done... weird... too, such that when you bent over or went hands-on-knees... well, let's just say it looked funny.

When I first got my D-by-F PolyWools, I didn't expect the roominess (or bagginess you're speaking about) in the hips section. They are a bit generous there, considering how slim the legs seem to be. This must be by design to allow for a trim, athletic profile without being too snug, yet still allow for easy mobility. If/when hemming them, it's best to utilize the military break Matt spoke of, and the rear of the pant leg (the tail) should be off the ground and just above the sole of the shoe. One should not have "elephant ankles", nor should the pants be touching the mud/grass/dirt. My own seamstress nailed it perfectly, as my pants don't even ride up when I crouch into hands-on-knees – you don't even see my socks.

[Aging_Arbiter]

I don't think I even own a pair of base pants.  I usually order either plate or combo.  Many moons ago, I used to be into weight lifting.  I still have the large legs because of that and friends often refer to the tree trunks growing from my upper torso.  Combo pants on me look like regular base pants.  I tried on a pair of base pants once.  I think kids nowadays call those "skinny jeans".  So I guess you could say combo IS a preference for me.

[BT_Blue]

On 10/23/2016 at 4:39 PM, MadMax said:

Absolutely, @BT_Blue, I would heavily and heartily recommend the Davis-by-Fechheimer PolyWools. I've been surprised that, despite my relocation from wintery Wisconsin to arid (and too f#©kin' hot all the f#©kin' time) Arizona, these PolyWools are light, breathable and able to withstand whatever I throw at them. They are the genuine article. I do treat them with kid gloves, though, and only rinse them in a cold shower and air-dry them after they get a-salted and soiled by sand and dust. My plate pants take the brunt of it. Whenever I have a few days away from umpiring (2-3 day span) I've been taking them to a local dry cleaner and they do an excellent job cleaning them.

Sizing-wise, I am 6'2" 205-10, and wear a 34x34 in jeans and slacks. I purchased the 36 in both Base and Plate, and they fit very well. I had them professionally altered (hemmed) and I got the "military break" that @Matt alluded to. I was surprised by both pairs, each in their own way – the Plate pants easily accommodate my Force3 Ultimate shinguards and a Nutty-buddy personal protector, yet you really don't noticeably see either when worn, nor are the pants all billowy and oversized. I am a very mobile umpire, and I don't even feel or notice these when I have to dash to 2B or 3B to cover a call. So too, the Base pants are rather trim and slim in the legs, but they certainly are not "skinny jeans", yet when I go hands on knees out in the field, they don't feel constrictive.

I can't speak as to how the Smitty Poly-wools specifically fit now, as I bought a set of Smitty Poly-wool combos and returned them immediately because the "magic expanding" waistband was waaaaaaayyyyyy too complex and felt and looked like wearing a cummerbund. The pleating was just done... weird... too, such that when you bent over or went hands-on-knees... well, let's just say it looked funny.

When I first got my D-by-F PolyWools, I didn't expect the roominess (or bagginess you're speaking about) in the hips section. They are a bit generous there, considering how slim the legs seem to be. This must be by design to allow for a trim, athletic profile without being too snug, yet still allow for easy mobility. If/when hemming them, it's best to utilize the military break Matt spoke of, and the rear of the pant leg (the tail) should be off the ground and just above the sole of the shoe. One should not have "elephant ankles", nor should the pants be touching the mud/grass/dirt. My own seamstress nailed it perfectly, as my pants don't even ride up when I crouch into hands-on-knees – you don't even see my socks.

I just got some great suggestions for seamstresses and alteration places in my area. So looking forward to how they do.

OH.... And just saw that Gerry Davis is having a 20% off sale on all their pants, including the DbF.

[UMPCourse]

On 10/17/2016 at 3:51 PM, catsbackr said:

Combo pants look to blousy (is that a word) for the bases and are too tight for shinguards.  Combo pants look AWFUL.  

 

It's one game fee, buy plate and base pants.

Man now I feel awful! I will commence burning my combo pants when our burn ban is not in effect anymore.

On that note, who in your opinion makes the best pants for plate/base?

[noumpere]

1 hour ago, jwclubbie said:

Man now I feel awful! I will commence burning my combo pants when our burn ban is not in effect anymore.

On that note, who in your opinion makes the best pants for plate/base?

Go to the equipment forum and search.

 

Or see who has some for sale in that forum, or post a want-to-buy thread.

[BT_Blue]

On Thursday, November 17, 2016 at 3:21 AM, jwclubbie said:

Man now I feel awful! I will commence burning my combo pants when our burn ban is not in effect anymore.

On that note, who in your opinion makes the best pants for plate/base?

Right now? Either Gerry Davis with their Fechheimer pants of Smitty polywool. 

[MadMax]

On 11/17/2016 at 4:21 AM, jwclubbie said:

Man now I feel awful! I will commence burning my combo pants when our burn ban is not in effect anymore.

On that note, who in your opinion makes the best pants for plate/base?

Naw, @jwclubbie, don't burn them... sell them on the cheap to junior umpires! Let them wear combos all they want... helluva lot better than the track pants, slacks and Dickies service pants that they typically (end up) wear(ing).

I think combos have their place... Like I said, junior / trainee umpires, drumbeat tournaments, slop ball. That being said, I no longer wear combos nor will ever wear them again.

The PolyWools are the top of the premium pyramid. In my experience / opinion, the Davis-by-Fechheimers are the best, followed by the Honigs and then the Smitty's. The reason I rank the Smitty's lower down is their waistband is a complex apparatus. It shouldn't be so difficult!

One challenge, though, is that you have to baby PolyWools. If you are in an environment that would otherwise thrash your pants, then I would say get a set of Honig's Ultimate Polyesters or Gerry Davis polyesters. I've tried them both and liked them both... but the Gerry Davis's are reputed to fade and turn purple, and some senior umpires / evaluators can tell what pants you are wearing at 30 paces.