1 Man Strike Zone

[mjr_2013]

Here. This is a good video of what I'm talking about. I don't really like this dude running the video or his video series (I've heard from others he's a scammer), but this shows a point. 

From behind the pitcher, will you be able to tell if these that barely graze the zone are balls or strikes?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vow6R85Pjxs

 

 

--EDIT--

You say you work primarily varsity. Act like these are damn good breaking balls then.

[IABlue]

 

 

Keep in mind that we're only talking about balls and strikes here.  I admit there are advantages to behind the catcher for things like fair/foul and plays at the plate.

 

If the angle behind the catcher is the best to see the strike zone, then why aren't TV cameras set up at the backstop for televised games?  How about putting one in the umpire's mask (yes, I know they have these).  How come this isn't used as the primary TV angle?

 

The reason you never see this angle is because it sucks.  Anybody can watch a televised game from the center field camera (behind the pitcher) and could call an accurate and consistent strike zone.

 

I've never missed a pitch from the bases.  It's obvious where everything is at.  I'll try to dig up the Carl Childress article where he makes these exact same points.

 

Dude, you can't seriously be using a TV camera angle argument, are you? The reason a mask cam is not the primary angle is because it MOVES all the time and would give viewers vertigo. The center field camera (which isn't even directly in center field in almost all cases but offset a bit) is predictable, controllable, stable, and easy. If they could put a cameraman instead of the umpire, they would. And never missed a pitch? Ever? You're a better ump than me and the rest of the mortals, then.

 

This is getting bizarre.

It's really hard to miss one while looking directly at home plate with no catcher or batter in your way.  Pretty damned hard to do.  Just like it's nearly impossible to miss one from your living room.  This ain't rocket science.

 

Well, then, by your logic we should just eliminate home plate umps and just go with Tim McGarble and the K-Zone.

 

Look, you like being behind F1, that's cool. But why do you have to be such a jerk to those who disagree? And again, *never* missed a pitch? That's the kind of hyperbolic nonsense that kills your credibility.

There are reasons to have an umpire near the plate.  Plays at home come immediately to mind, as well as less frequent things like Catcher Obstruction, etc.

 

But balls and strikes is certainly not a good reason to have him there.

 

And I didn't say I've never missed a pitch from behind the plate, obviously I have, and usually a few per game.  But I've never once watched a game on TV, or been on the bases rotated into the infield, and not had a damn good idea where that pitch was.

 

If you don't possess the same skills, then I would question your ability to judge balls and strikes from any position.

[scrounge]

 

There are reasons to have an umpire near the plate.  Plays at home come immediately to mind, as well as less frequent things like Catcher Obstruction, etc.

 

But balls and strikes is certainly not a good reason to have him there.

 

And I didn't say I've never missed a pitched from behind the plate, obviously I have, and usually a few per game.  But I've never once watched a game on TV, or been on the bases rotated into the infield, and not had a damn good idea where that pitch was.

 

If you don't possess the same skills, then I would question your ability to judge balls and strikes from any position.

 

Ok, superman, you stand out by the pitcher and never miss a pitch (that *IS* what you said). Have the last word if you wish, throw in an insult if you'd like, I think this has passed the point of usefulness.

[BalkHawk]

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=25449879&c_id=mlb

[Richvee]

I kind of like that IABlue isn't backing down. Standing up for what he believes.

 

I disagree with him, but I like that he isn't immediately backtracking.

 

The reason for me that behind HP is the best for balls/strikes (not getting into fair/foul and OOP), is because of the breaking pitch, or, in some youth leagues, pretty much any pitch. Anyone can tell, from any part of the ball park, that a fastball right down the pipe is a strike. Similarly, anyone can tell when a pitch bounces, it's a ball.

But when there is a nice curveball at upper levels, or a pitcher who can't throw a ball straight yet at lower levels, you need to exactly where the pitch crosses the plate to accurately judge it... If you're 70-75 feet away, or even in youth leagues, 50-55 feet away, it would take a superhero like depth perception to be able to tell.

 

Just my  .

Maybe at a lower level, I wouldn't know as I rarely work anything below high school varsity.

 

I can tell you with absolute certainly that I can accurately judge an MLB breaking ball on TV from my living room from EXACTLY the same angle that I would when looking from behind the pitcher's mound if I were on the field.

1 man varsity from behind F1??     

[SnareDrum]

Main TV cameras are in CF offset a little to LF for a reason. It's the best position for a TV CAMERA. When games first began being broadcast  it was one of the few places where there were no seats, so they could just build a platform and it was great spot. Nowadays, there still aren't very many seats out there, but the angle and coverage from 450 feet away of the field and game for television and an elevated TV CAMERA is still better than it would be behind the plate.  Whenever they use camera #4 behind the plate, you can't even see the ball all the way into the mitt, and most times, not even see where the ball crossed the plate... but the umpire can.  The best spot to get the most coverage of your field, and call balls and strikes, is behind F2. 

[IABlue]

 

I kind of like that IABlue isn't backing down. Standing up for what he believes.

 

I disagree with him, but I like that he isn't immediately backtracking.

 

The reason for me that behind HP is the best for balls/strikes (not getting into fair/foul and OOP), is because of the breaking pitch, or, in some youth leagues, pretty much any pitch. Anyone can tell, from any part of the ball park, that a fastball right down the pipe is a strike. Similarly, anyone can tell when a pitch bounces, it's a ball.

But when there is a nice curveball at upper levels, or a pitcher who can't throw a ball straight yet at lower levels, you need to exactly where the pitch crosses the plate to accurately judge it... If you're 70-75 feet away, or even in youth leagues, 50-55 feet away, it would take a superhero like depth perception to be able to tell.

 

Just my  .

Maybe at a lower level, I wouldn't know as I rarely work anything below high school varsity.

 

I can tell you with absolute certainly that I can accurately judge an MLB breaking ball on TV from my living room from EXACTLY the same angle that I would when looking from behind the pitcher's mound if I were on the field.

1 man varsity from behind F1??     

No, I don't routinely work 1 man games.

 

But I have in the past, from both positions, and know which I prefer, not to mention having a lot of experience from watching a game, from the bases, at approximately the same position that I would be in were I calling the game by myself, and I know what my strengths and limitations would likely be in such a scenario.

[IABlue]

.  Whenever they use camera #4 behind the plate, you can't even see the ball all the way into the mitt, and most times, not even see where the ball crossed the plate... but the umpire can. 

Not even remotely true.  For example, a slot umpire has little to no idea whether a ball near the outside corner actually did or did not cross the plate.  This is at best an informed guess most of the time.  Someone looking straight in at the plate, with nothing in front of him, has a much better look.

[Richvee]

.  Whenever they use camera #4 behind the plate, you can't even see the ball all the way into the mitt, and most times, not even see where the ball crossed the plate... but the umpire can. 

Not even remotely true.  For example, a slot umpire has little to no idea whether a ball near the outside corner actually did or did not cross the plate.  This is at best an informed guess most of the time.  

OK. That's it. I'm done. I don't want to start getting nasty. 

[SnareDrum]

(Reply feature not working, but......)

 

First, I have a pretty good "idea" on a ball near the outside corner. I leave the all of the guesswork on balls and strikes to the DC. 

Second, there is something in front of me: F1. I'd also have to be at least a little to one side of him or the other, correct? There goes the straight-angle.

Third, when I have to go it alone due to a no-show, a partner injury/illness (can't see losing my PU partner and staying in the field), or just the way that league is, I'll be behind the plate. You prefer it in the field. Feel free. Not being petty or anything, but feel free.

[IABlue]

 

.  Whenever they use camera #4 behind the plate, you can't even see the ball all the way into the mitt, and most times, not even see where the ball crossed the plate... but the umpire can. 

Not even remotely true.  For example, a slot umpire has little to no idea whether a ball near the outside corner actually did or did not cross the plate.  This is at best an informed guess most of the time.  

OK. That's it. I'm done. I don't want to start getting nasty. 

Bring it on kiddo.  I can take anything that you can dish out.

 

(Reply feature not working, but......)

 

First, I have a pretty good "idea" on a ball near the outside corner. I leave the all of the guesswork on balls and strikes to the DC. 

 

So you've never missed a pitch either, huh?  Glad to see we have so many perfect PUs here.

 

I would absolutely LOVE to see some of you guys work.

[IABlue]

Have any of you guys ever been PU for a game that was televised, and then been able to go back and watch a re-broadcast or recording of that game from the CF angle?

 

I would imagine that most of you haven't had that opportunity yet, but if you ever do, it can really open your eyes up to a few of the issues being discussed here.

[mjr_2013]

IABlue, if you want to discuss your opinion, that's ok. I even encouraged it in an earlier comment.

 

But comments like "Bring it on kiddo" are meant to provoke a fight and has no place here.

[Jocko]

Knock it off

[BRUMP]

Aaah the offseason. When the game counts drop the tensions rise.

[johnnyg08]

Have any of you guys ever been PU for a game that was televised, and then been able to go back and watch a re-broadcast or recording of that game from the CF angle?

 

I would imagine that most of you haven't had that opportunity yet, but if you ever do, it can really open your eyes up to a few of the issues being discussed here.

 

This is where I have learned the most.

[BT_Blue]

Sweet! Over night my hero has arisen and someone voted that the best place to umpire a one man game is behind F1. You are a god to me sir... who ever you are. (Please note that all thoughts and beliefs in this post are loaded with . Thank you.)

[BalkHawk]

http://umpire-empire.com/index.php/topic/52010-inside-the-brain-of-an-internet-troll/#entry150931

[James Walker]

I was hoping calling one man games behind F1 was not the norm. 

 

Except maybe for this guy....

 

Alright, where'd you get a picture of me. Thought I burned all of em.

[mjr_2013]

[JaxRolo]

No point in continuing. He's not willing to learn.

Can't see how he can argue against Pro school grads D1 and other highly know leave umpires on this site. Sad

[bam]

I'm guessing auto correct made "knowledge" "know leave".  I would have preferred you just said "Now leave!"

[boyinr]

Seriously, can't we debate some plausible? My suggestion, is the earth round or flat?

We need some baseball ASAP.

[James Walker]

Seriously, can't we debate some plausible? My suggestion, is the earth round or flat?

We need some baseball ASAP.

Not to stir the pot.... But the earth is flat.

[BT_Blue]

Man do we need baseball bad. Worse then anyone thought.