Pro Mechanics (Giving Balls & Strikes)

[Astrosdawg07]

I worked with a former minor league umpire this past weekend (graduate of Jim Evans). I had always been told to say 3 balls 2 strikes etc. However he told me that they teach just to say 3 - 2. Has anyone who has been to pro school validate this? While I will continue to do what my association ask, I would like to know the answer to this. He also had a problem with me being in C with 1st & 3rd (13U), I know I've worked FED to long. But I have trained myself to be in B with 1st & 3rd in college games.

Edited October 19, 2010 by AChesnut

[kcfan102]

I worked with a former minor league umpire this past weekend (graduate of Jim Evans). I had always been told to say 3 balls 2 strikes etc. However he told me that they teach just to say 3 - 2. Has anyone who has been to pro school validate this? While I will continue to do what my association ask, I would like to know the answer to this. He also had a problem with me being in C with 1st & 3rd (13U), I know I've worked FED to long. But I have trained myself to be in A with 1st & 3rd in college games.

I'll let you know in February.

[noumpere]

He also had a problem with me being in C with 1st & 3rd (13U), I know I've worked FED to long. But I have trained myself to be in A with 1st & 3rd in college games.

There are different philosophies about when to be in B and when to be in C.

In the situation you presented, I prefer B.

[Astrosdawg07]

There are different philosophies about when to be in B and when to be in C.

In the situation you presented, I prefer B.

I meant to say B, I don't know why I put A. :bang:

[mazzamouth]

I have been to Jim Evans Clinic ( which they tech the same stuff) and yes they say 3-2... everyone should know what your saying.

And at the International camp, they say the same thing.

[spiritumpa]

I worked with a former minor league umpire this past weekend (graduate of Jim Evans). I had always been told to say 3 balls 2 strikes etc. However he told me that they teach just to say 3 - 2. Has anyone who has been to pro school validate this? While I will continue to do what my association ask, I would like to know the answer to this. He also had a problem with me being in C with 1st & 3rd (13U), I know I've worked FED to long. But I have trained myself to be in B with 1st & 3rd in college games.

do not say 2 balls 2 strikes--just 2-2 2-1 1-2 etc etc--with runner on 1&3 field ump is in b

FED is in c but more and more High School associations are going to the NCAA-Major leage mechanics of ump in b with 1&3 .

[UmpTTS43]

At JEAPU they teach you to say, "3 balls 2 strikes". They teach the basics so there is a base line for evaluation purposes. They also instruct you as if you have never stepped 0n a field before. Once you work real games, depending on the level and type of score board, you can just give the number, 3-2, etc.

[Astrosdawg07]

So what is recommended then as far as saying the count in varsity high school games? My association teaches "3 balls 2 strikes" but my association won't dock points for just saying 3-2! This fall I'm really striving to work on my advanced mechanics as well as regular professional two man mechanics. Such as saying and signaling a strike at the same time.

[UmpTTS43]

So what is recommended then as far as saying the count in varsity high school games? My association teaches "3 balls 2 strikes" but my association won't dock points for just saying 3-2! This fall I'm really striving to work on my advanced mechanics as well as regular professional two man mechanics. Such as saying and signaling a strike at the same time.

I would first follow what direction your association mandates. Outside of that, it is my opinion that when dealing with varsity high school games and higher, it is more appropriate to simply give the number count. The players know how to interpret the count with just numbers. Saying "balls" and "strikes" can give the appearance of a youth baseball umpire.

[Astrosdawg07]

I would first follow what direction your association mandates. Outside of that, it is my opinion that when dealing with varsity high school games and higher, it is more appropriate to simply give the number count. The players know how to interpret the count with just numbers. Saying "balls" and "strikes" can give the appearance of a youth baseball umpire.

Well the thing is our association is extremely laid back. I believe they teach some mechanics to slow everything down for the new guys!

[Umpire in Chief]

I use to say "3 balls, 2 strikes" all the time. But 90% of the time just say 3-2 now.

[mstaylor]

I use to say "3 balls, 2 strikes" all the time. But 90% of the time just say 3-2 now.

I am the opposite, while the players know the order, if you say it too fast then they can't understand the numbers you are saying. I found this was the case so I added saying ball and strike to make me slow down.

[Stan W.]

I would first follow what direction your association mandates. Outside of that, it is my opinion that when dealing with varsity high school games and higher, it is more appropriate to simply give the number count. The players know how to interpret the count with just numbers. Saying "balls" and "strikes" can give the appearance of a youth baseball umpire.

Its good advice to follow your association lead, but I disagree that saying balls and strikes give the appearance of a youth umpire..........of all the habits we have to try and break youth umpires of, ...... its usually....the old standards of knocking fists together and calling out "full count" or "full boat"......or "thirty two"........or "double dueces"...Id much rather have them say "3 balls and 2 strikes".....but as an evaluator, I would not ding them for saying "3 and 2"....

Edited October 20, 2010 by Stan W.
clarity

[mstaylor]

We used to have an older umpire that had a bunch of little sayings instead of what he should have been saying. An example: with a 3/2 count and two outs he would say,"All the lights are lit."

[JaxRolo]

We used to have an older umpire that had a bunch of little sayings instead of what he should have been saying. An example: with a 3/2 count and two outs he would say,"All the lights are lit."

wow

[mstaylor]

Two outs was two in the well, 2/2 count was twenty-two and other cute little sayings.

[yawetag]

Two outs was two in the well, 2/2 count was twenty-two and other cute little sayings.

Anything like this guy?:

You can see his encore here:

[kcfan102]

There is an older guy (70 somthin) that I worked my first legion game with who said, instead of "I need two managers please" or something to that affect, he'd say "C'mon guys! Let's talk about it!"

[JaxRolo]

I worked with a guy tonight were he had a close play at 3rd and he yelled out "oh yea oh yeah oh yeah he got him"

[24sdad]

At JEAPU they teach you to say, "3 balls 2 strikes". They teach the basics so there is a base line for evaluation purposes. They also instruct you as if you have never stepped 0n a field before. Once you work real games, depending on the level and type of score board, you can just give the number, 3-2, etc.

Having just returned from the Desert Classic, they teach "B" for R1 and R3. They also teach "3 balls and 2 strikes" as opposed to "3 and 2." Like stated above, they want everyone at the clinic employing the same mechanics. The instructors (a mix of AAA, AA, A and two MLB, plus Sarge) were asked what they did in actual games. All said they continued to use "3 balls and 2 strikes." Now, whether that is the standard clinic answer or what they actually do, I don't know. But the chief instructor (AAA chew chief) said do not simply state "3 and 2" at the clinic or during actual games.

[Forest Ump]

Having just returned from the Desert Classic, they teach "B" for R1 and R3. They also teach "3 balls and 2 strikes" as opposed to "3 and 2." Like stated above, they want everyone at the clinic employing the same mechanics. The instructors (a mix of AAA, AA, A and two MLB, plus Sarge) were asked what they did in actual games. All said they continued to use "3 balls and 2 strikes." Now, whether that is the standard clinic answer or what they actually do, I don't know. But the chief instructor (AAA chew chief) said do not simply state "3 and 2" at the clinic or during actual games.

That's right but remember what else Sarge said "Do what Charlie tells you to do".

Don't play F--k F--k :yippie:

[24sdad]

That's right but remember what else Sarge said "Do what Charlie tells you to do".

Don't play F--k F--k

That is correct! Sarge was something else, wasn't he? Great instructors, great course...even though I am sure they will be teaching the same content next year, I would not mind attending again.

[PeteBooth]

I worked with a former minor league umpire this past weekend (graduate of Jim Evans). I had always been told to say 3 balls 2 strikes etc. However he told me that they teach just to say 3 - 2. Has anyone who has been to pro school validate this? While I will continue to do what my association ask, I would like to know the answer to this. He also had a problem with me being in C with 1st & 3rd (13U), I know I've worked FED to long. But I have trained myself to be in B with 1st & 3rd in college games.

Comparing PRO ball to amateur ball (which is what most of us umpire in) is Apples / Oranges

I am assuming (I know I know) that most of us belong to an association. As they say do as the Romans do.

This type of OP reminds me of the BU carrying an indicator on the bases. Some associations say NO and some leave it up to the BU.

I do not say 3 balls 2 strikes. I say 3 and 2 or 32. Where I work everyone understands the nomanclature 22 (for a count of 2 balls 2 strikes) 21 (2 balls and one strike) and so on and so forth. In HS Varsity and CBL I also say 2's which means a count of 2-2. Again they understand the nomanclature.

Here is the most important part no matter what you do.

In amateur baseball give the count loud and clear so everyone knows what it is.

At least for me the fields I umpire in do not have luxurious scoreboards where the count is given etc.

As far as PRO school, remember they need a certain criteria in which to rate their students, hence if you aspire to umpire PRO ball then do what the instructors tell you to do.

Also, as we have found out over the past 10 yrs or so umpire mechanics are in a way similar to computer software meaning they are constantly changing.

Todays mechanics are different then what was taught 20 yrs ago or as mentioned even 10 yrs. ago.

Pete Booth

[GT25Ump]

Well said, Pete!

[LMSANS]

Comparing PRO ball to amateur ball (which is what most of us umpire in) is Apples / Oranges

I am assuming (I know I know) that most of us belong to an association. As they say do as the Romans do.

This type of OP reminds me of the BU carrying an indicator on the bases. Some associations say NO and some leave it up to the BU.

I do not say 3 balls 2 strikes. I say 3 and 2 or 32. Where I work everyone understands the nomanclature 22 (for a count of 2 balls 2 strikes) 21 (2 balls and one strike) and so on and so forth. In HS Varsity and CBL I also say 2's which means a count of 2-2. Again they understand the nomanclature.

Here is the most important part no matter what you do.

In amateur baseball give the count loud and clear so everyone knows what it is.

At least for me the fields I umpire in do not have luxurious scoreboards where the count is given etc.

As far as PRO school, remember they need a certain criteria in which to rate their students, hence if you aspire to umpire PRO ball then do what the instructors tell you to do.

Also, as we have found out over the past 10 yrs or so umpire mechanics are in a way similar to computer software meaning they are constantly changing.

Todays mechanics are different then what was taught 20 yrs ago or as mentioned even 10 yrs. ago.

Pete Booth

:yippie:This is a day for celebration. A post by Pete that I totally agree with! :hi5:B)