Officially starting my little league umpire journey tomorrow

[SeeingEyeDog]

On 3/3/2025 at 5:15 PM, 834k3r said:

"Days of Thunder" where Cruise is taking a test drive and Duvall asks him, "What do you know about stock car racing?" and Cruise responds, "Well, I've watched it on television, of course..."

"You've watched it on television?!?!"

"ESPN...the coverage is excellent..."

~Dawg

[orangebird]

Further soaking in org 1 training vs org 2, org 1 definitely placed a greater emphasis on the act of umpiring (which hand holds the indicator, how the slot works, 2-man positioning and roles) while org 2 seems more focused on knowing the rules (they covered the rules of a catch and org 1 legit just skipped that lol) but through 2 sessions they haven't mentioned anything about 2-man crews, the slot, etc

Guess I'll see how the next session for org #2 goes and what on-field training covers (if that open-note test doesn't trip me up) but it's definitely an interesting contrast to me 

[Richvee]

14 minutes ago, orangebird said:

Further soaking in org 1 training vs org 2, org 1 definitely placed a greater emphasis on the act of umpiring (which hand holds the indicator, how the slot works, 2-man positioning and roles) while org 2 seems more focused on knowing the rules (they covered the rules of a catch and org 1 legit just skipped that lol) but through 2 sessions they haven't mentioned anything about 2-man crews, the slot, etc

Guess I'll see how the next session for org #2 goes and what on-field training covers (if that open-note test doesn't trip me up) but it's definitely an interesting contrast to me 

Sounds like together you're getting a good education. I help out a few groups training new umpires. There's limited time to train, and different groups have different philosophies. One group I help with does more on field drills, plate work, mechanics, and advise you to read the rulebook, and get familiar with it, while the other focuses  is on the rule book, and then one or two classes on the field. Soak it all in. There's a lot to learn.  

 

As for that outline on the plate meeting...Obviously do what your group wants, but that whole paragraph about "the reasons we're here today" is a bit over the top for me. 

[orangebird]

Yeah I'm definitely aware of the timing constraints, and both of these orgs are mainly recruiting 8th graders and HSers based on who else I've shared these rooms with, where I think everyone only has so much brain power to pay attention to someone's lecture after already doing that from about 7:30 am to 2:30 pm

[Richvee]

1 hour ago, orangebird said:

Yeah I'm definitely aware of the timing constraints, and both of these orgs are mainly recruiting 8th graders and HSers based on who else I've shared these rooms with, where I think everyone only has so much brain power to pay attention to someone's lecture after already doing that from about 7:30 am to 2:30 pm

My son, in charge of hiring/training in his department once said to me, “Im tired of trying to teach “C” students.

[Velho]

2 hours ago, Richvee said:

I help out a few groups training new umpires. There's limited time to train, and different groups have different philosophies. One group I help with does more on field drills, plate work, mechanics, and advise you to read the rulebook, and get familiar with it, while the other focuses  is on the rule book, and then one or two classes on the field. Soak it all in. There's a lot to learn. 

We just finished our round of LL clinics. The two closest to me got it right (maybe my chirping helped). On BU sessions we didn't do double plays or first-to-third. Rather we focused on getting the play at 2B & 3B from B & C for ball in infield and getting inside (remember, small field) to from B & C to working area and seeing touches. Very happy about that.

[Velho]

42 minutes ago, Richvee said:

My son, in charge of hiring/training in his department once said to me, “Im tired of trying to teach “C” students.

Steve Jobs had a saying: A players hire A players. But B players hire C players, and C players hire D players. It doesn't take long to get to F players. This trickle-down effect causes bozo explosions in companies.

Regularly, after some rough meetings, a coworker and I would send this back and forth:

[The Man in Blue]

4 hours ago, SeeingEyeDog said:

"Days of Thunder" where Cruise is taking a test drive and Duvall asks him, "What do you know about stock car racing?" and Cruise responds, "Well, I've watched it on television, of course..."

"You've watched it on television?!?!"

"ESPN...the coverage is excellent..."

~Dawg

Have you ever been to the Ukraine?

Answer: I've been . . . I've . . . I've actually watched . . . the stories . . . 

[The Man in Blue]

2 hours ago, orangebird said:

Yeah I'm definitely aware of the timing constraints, and both of these orgs are mainly recruiting 8th graders and HSers based on who else I've shared these rooms with, where I think everyone only has so much brain power to pay attention to someone's lecture after already doing that from about 7:30 am to 2:30 pm

 

Oh.  Trust me.  They should have plenty of brain power left because they weren't doing much of that from 7:30 to 2:30.  

[JonnyCat]

On 3/4/2025 at 8:04 AM, orangebird said:

Here's the plate conference sheet they gave us

I'm 50/50 between "it's good to make sure the coaches know all of this" and "I'm not sure this script will be necessary by the 5th game of the year" but am curious what the vets think

Good Lord, no. Throw that thing away. The only thing worthy in that document is asking about "legally and properly equipped." This type of instruction from whomever gave it to you is one of the reasons why bad habits get propagated.

A good plate meeting is short and sweet. 2-3 minutes tops, and that may be too long.

1. Introductions.

2. Line ups.

3. Ask if players are properly equipped.

4. Ground rules.

5. Any thing else special such as time limits, etc.

6. Done. Don't ask if they have any questions. And don't ask your base umpire(s) if they have anything to add. It's your meeting, run it. A good plate meeting sets the tone for the game.

When I'm a base umpire, or when I was coaching, I would just cringe at some of the long winded diatribes I was subject to. Who the Hell taught these blowhards that a lecture of over 5 minutes is a good way to start a game.

Here's what many people fail to realize. Coaches aren't listening. They want to get the game going, they are still strategizing about the game. They don't want to hear a monologue about what they should or should not do.

JMO

[orangebird]

Definitely see where you're coming from and don't think I really disagree with anything but...this is the higher-paying of the two local orgs, so I'd recite Hamlet to the coaches if that was giving me an extra 20 dollars per game haha

[JonnyCat]

11 hours ago, orangebird said:

this is the higher-paying of the two local orgs, so I'd recite Hamlet to the coaches if that was giving me an extra 20 dollars per game haha

Higher paying? By how much?

Don't even get me started on the poverty wages we accept to work games! 

My stance on this is well documented on this site, so I'll spare you my soapbox....for now. 

[orangebird]

29 minutes ago, JonnyCat said:

Higher paying? By how much?

Don't even get me started on the poverty wages we accept to work games! 

My stance on this is well documented on this site, so I'll spare you my soapbox....for now. 

Need to pass the test for org #2 to confirm fully confirm but org #1 is 36 for a first-year ump and org #2, which contracts out for 5 different LL's and is under the parks department's umbrella is 60, but I think those are just for plate and I don't know how it'll work for working base

[834k3r]

18 hours ago, Richvee said:

that whole paragraph about "the reasons we're here today" is a bit over the top for me. 

[BLWizzRanger]

I thought I would share. This is the business card that I lamented and carried with me on the field when I first started. I used it, well held it, for three or four plate conferences. Just reminders. No drawn out script. NFHS.

[Next post]
Sent from my SM-F721U1 using Tapatalk
 

[BLWizzRanger]

Here it is.

Sent from my SM-F721U1 using Tapatalk

[stevis]

16 hours ago, orangebird said:

Definitely see where you're coming from and don't think I really disagree with anything but...this is the higher-paying of the two local orgs, so I'd recite Hamlet to the coaches if that was giving me an extra 20 dollars per game haha

"Do you have something I can use to get the shine off of these baseballs?"

"Aye, there's the rub."

[834k3r]

1 hour ago, stevis said:

"Do you have something I can use to get the shine off of these baseballs?"

"Aye, there's the rub."

[The Man in Blue]

22 hours ago, orangebird said:

Definitely see where you're coming from and don't think I really disagree with anything but...this is the higher-paying of the two local orgs, so I'd recite Hamlet to the coaches if that was giving me an extra 20 dollars per game haha

@orangebird loses his focus on the ball and can't tell if it bounced over the fence or cleared it, so he yells at his partner, "To be, or not to be?"

The next inning, the offense hits into a routine 6-4-3 double play.  In the middle of making the call, he notices a stain on his shirt.  He was sure that he had treated that stain.  The call?  "Out, damned spot! Out, I say!"  (OK, MacBeth.)

No, with no runners on base, our new friend goes back and gets ready.  He forgets what he is supposed to be watching on the bases with nobody on.  He looks a little confused, so, as his partner, I would say "Look to the plate."  (Romeo and Juliet)

(We already did "Fair is foul . . . " in another thread.)

 

 

[The Man in Blue]

9 hours ago, BLWizzRanger said:

I thought I would share. This is the business card that I lamented and carried with me on the field when I first started. I used it, well held it, for three or four plate conferences. Just reminders. No drawn out script. NFHS.

[Next post]
Sent from my SM-F721U1 using Tapatalk
 

 

Why were you so downtrodden over this card?  

[JonnyCat]

13 hours ago, orangebird said:

Need to pass the test for org #2 to confirm fully confirm but org #1 is 36 for a first-year ump and org #2, which contracts out for 5 different LL's and is under the parks department's umbrella is 60, but I think those are just for plate and I don't know how it'll work for working base

Not directed at you.

$36.00 and $60.00 per game is what they're paying???

$60.00 per game is F*#King ridiculous, but I don't have a word for $36.00 per game! Why the F*#K would anyone work games for $36.00? Unless those games are 30 minutes long, in my area, that's not even minimum wage. Most games are usually at the very minimum, a 3 hour commitment, and that's not including travel time. That's like $12.00 per hour. If it took 4 hours out of your day, that's $9.00 per hour. With no benefits, no taxes taken out or portions paid by your employer, and no workman's comp.

Really? Why the Hell does anyone put up with this? At $60.00 per game you're being taken advantage of. At $36.00 per game, I don't even know where to begin.

[BLWizzRanger]

9 hours ago, The Man in Blue said:

 

Why were you so downtrodden over this card?  

Comic books and rule books, I read.  Thus, I don't know what you are saying.

[Velho]

10 hours ago, The Man in Blue said:

(We already did "Fair is foul . . . " in another thread.)

 

[orangebird]

9 hours ago, JonnyCat said:

Not directed at you.

$36.00 and $60.00 per game is what they're paying???

$60.00 per game is F*#King ridiculous, but I don't have a word for $36.00 per game! Why the F*#K would anyone work games for $36.00? Unless those games are 30 minutes long, in my area, that's not even minimum wage. Most games are usually at the very minimum, a 3 hour commitment, and that's not including travel time. That's like $12.00 per hour. If it took 4 hours out of your day, that's $9.00 per hour. With no benefits, no taxes taken out or portions paid by your employer, and no workman's comp.

Really? Why the Hell does anyone put up with this? At $60.00 per game you're being taken advantage of. At $36.00 per game, I don't even know where to begin.

Yeah as a newbie to this I have no idea where my pay ranks relative to a 9/10 rec ball ump anywhere else in the US so I appreciate the context.

Without attempting to turn this into an economic forum concerning the intricacies of supply and demand, is there a way for a LL to pay the umps more money without just charging the parents more money? I'd def be happier to make money from this but wouldn't want it to come at the expense at parents just trying to have their kids doing a non-travel ball league for fun

[JonnyCat]

50 minutes ago, orangebird said:

Without attempting to turn this into an economic forum concerning the intricacies of supply and demand, is there a way for a LL to pay the umps more money without just charging the parents more money? I'd def be happier to make money from this but wouldn't want it to come at the expense at parents just trying to have their kids doing a non-travel ball league for fun

I don't think so, it's up the the individual leagues to raise money and set the league fees. Most of that money comes from the registration fees and sponsorships. More sponsors could result in increased revenue for the leagues, which could in turn increase umpire pay. But it's not likely.

Most of the problem is umpires working for those rates. Leagues will also take advantage of newer umpires, particularly at the LL level. LL believes in an all volunteer system, so the culture is such that many LL umpires work for free, or reduced rates. Also, newer LL umpires are usually very enthusiastic about working games, and will go along with the system. To many, working games are the allure, not so much the money. Also, many youth leagues abuse the mantra of, "it's for the kids."

If umpires stopped working games that pay poorly, then the pay is likely to increase. After all, we are supposed to be "independent contractors."

It's a crappy system, at all amateur levels, and won't change unless umpires stop working games. Surprisingly, the nationwide shortage of umpires hasn't appreciably increased the rate of pay. Why? All we've done is get less people to cover more games. We haven't done anything to address the root cause of the problem.