Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 10 hours ago, Razzer said: After talking with Mad Max on friday I guess I should chime in and tell you where I am at right now. It is true I am now working full time on what I will say is a Hard Good legacy project(s) which will be 3 products with a distinctive Brand name under the UL branding. These will be protectives based products that will be tested this season at both MLB and MiLB levels with a soft launch later in the year. I am lucky that I have those contacts to bring products to market but started out the opposite way until the pro umpires started to contact me after they had seen my products on armature umpires at camps or clinics. A few years ago I went down the CP replacement pad option and had everything ready to go and a very good price point to work with but there were just too many variables to deal with until I found the solution to make the pad work on so many protectors. I am not going to say how I figured it out but I know you will understand why. This project remains viable and still may come to the market but right now I am concentrating my efforts make my version of the ultimate protective chest pad. Retail this replacement pad would sell for $79.99-$89.99 I have used and owned most of all of them and I see what works and what doesn't work so I think I have a good starting point. My two go to units are the Carlucci and the Power but I cannot make both. We all remember Reebok Magistrate plate and base shoes, we all remember they felt like slippers and we wish they would come back. That is both CP's I mentioned and they are also not coming back. Modern foams combined with breathable fabrics with an ABS shell can be achieved and retailed for $150-$179.99 if sufficient units are produced. The best solution is my version of the Power and that is where I am heading. Stay Tuned Well there goes all my hard work and effort, and business. Congrats ray. Glad to see you are able to further your business. Quote
The Short Umpire Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 11 hours ago, Umpiresrock74 said: Well there goes all my hard work and effort, and business. Congrats ray. Glad to see you are able to further your business. I don’t think this is a death sentence for your business. There’s just gonna be a lot of work that needs to be done. 3 Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 Yah. I mean I have a product that I can sell. I also found some of the best foam on the market, and according to a 2007 study it is better than team Wendy foam. Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 59 minutes ago, The Short Umpire said: I don’t think this is a death sentence for your business. There’s just gonna be a lot of work that needs to be done. Thanks man. I appreciate it. Quote
The Short Umpire Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 1 hour ago, Umpiresrock74 said: Yah. I mean I have a product that I can sell. I also found some of the best foam on the market, and according to a 2007 study it is better than team Wendy foam. To be frank this means nothing to anyone. “Better than” is too general of a statement to mean anything. @Rock Bottom already explained, “complicate it further, what's "better" to me may be more or less important to someone else. For example, somehow who umps a lot in 95+ heat might value breathability and light weight at the expense of a little protection, vs. someone who primarily umps in colder climates, etc.” Your drive to accomplish this project is admirable but please stop trying to market this on your own. You’ve gotten a lot of great advice on this thread and people want to see you succeed but marketing is not a strength of yours. I know you’re young but that just means you’re gonna need help. This last post about the foam you found being better is just showing that either you can’t see the big picture or you’re not reading/listening to the great advice you’re getting. Quote
DerekGDS Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 @Umpiresrock74 Keep in mind that market competition is inevitable. This shouldn't deter you, but rather encourage you to identify how and where you can carve out your niche. I assure you, UL and you are not alone in exploring opportunities in hard goods and replacement padding. 1 Quote
The Man in Blue Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 51 minutes ago, The Short Umpire said: To be frank this means nothing to anyone. “Better than” is too general of a statement to mean anything. @Rock Bottom already explained, “complicate it further, what's "better" to me may be more or less important to someone else. For example, somehow who umps a lot in 95+ heat might value breathability and light weight at the expense of a little protection, vs. someone who primarily umps in colder climates, etc.” Your drive to accomplish this project is admirable but please stop trying to market this on your own. You’ve gotten a lot of great advice on this thread and people want to see you succeed but marketing is not a strength of yours. I know you’re young but that just means you’re gonna need help. This last post about the foam you found being better is just showing that either you can’t see the big picture or you’re not reading/listening to the great advice you’re getting. Nope, nope, seems as if he has this. He doesn't need advice from professionals, people with advanced degrees, and people who have done this before. He has a SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD study that says it is better. Surely there have been no technological advancements since then, and Team Wendy has just been coasting on its laurels. @Umpiresrock74 I am sorry that you thought our advice was an attempt to tell you that you shouldn't do this. Guess you don't want to listen to the advice of others that this business is about relationship building, either. You know better. You got this. Best of luck. Go be a disruptor. Oooh . . . maybe you should just lease out the padding with a monthly subscription plan! My previous post was a serious attempt to help you. Now I need to include this: Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 6 minutes ago, The Man in Blue said: Nope, nope, seems as if he has this. He doesn't need advice from professionals, people with advanced degrees, and people who have done this before. He has a SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD study that says it is better. Surely there have been no technological advancements since then, and Team Wendy has just been coasting on its laurels. @Umpiresrock74 I am sorry that you thought our advice was an attempt to tell you that you shouldn't do this. Guess you don't want to listen to the advice of others that this business is about relationship building, either. You know better. You got this. Best of luck. Go be a disruptor. Oooh . . . maybe you should just lease out the padding with a monthly subscription plan! My previous post was a serious attempt to help you. Now I need to include this: Okay. I am not trying to not take you guises advice. But half the time I don’t know what you guys mean. Lol. I am trying with my word of mouth. I guess I am just trying to figure the whole business aspect out. Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 25 minutes ago, DerekGDS said: @Umpiresrock74 Keep in mind that market competition is inevitable. This shouldn't deter you, but rather encourage you to identify how and where you can carve out your niche. I assure you, UL and you are not alone in exploring opportunities in hard goods and replacement padding. Thanks. I will remember that. Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 1 hour ago, The Short Umpire said: To be frank this means nothing to anyone. “Better than” is too general of a statement to mean anything. @Rock Bottom already explained, “complicate it further, what's "better" to me may be more or less important to someone else. For example, somehow who umps a lot in 95+ heat might value breathability and light weight at the expense of a little protection, vs. someone who primarily umps in colder climates, etc.” Your drive to accomplish this project is admirable but please stop trying to market this on your own. You’ve gotten a lot of great advice on this thread and people want to see you succeed but marketing is not a strength of yours. I know you’re young but that just means you’re gonna need help. This last post about the foam you found being better is just showing that either you can’t see the big picture or you’re not reading/listening to the great advice you’re getting. Okay. So you’re sharing someone might prefer less protection in order to have a more breathable chest protector, or vice versa? Is that what you are saying? Thanks Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 1 hour ago, The Short Umpire said: To be frank this means nothing to anyone. “Better than” is too general of a statement to mean anything. @Rock Bottom already explained, “complicate it further, what's "better" to me may be more or less important to someone else. For example, somehow who umps a lot in 95+ heat might value breathability and light weight at the expense of a little protection, vs. someone who primarily umps in colder climates, etc.” Your drive to accomplish this project is admirable but please stop trying to market this on your own. You’ve gotten a lot of great advice on this thread and people want to see you succeed but marketing is not a strength of yours. I know you’re young but that just means you’re gonna need help. This last post about the foam you found being better is just showing that either you can’t see the big picture or you’re not reading/listening to the great advice you’re getting. I guess I am just trying to figure out everything. I’m sorry you guys feel like that you guys don’t think I want your guises suggestions or feedback. I really do. I’m just trying to figure it all out, and I’m sorry. Yes, marketing is not my stronghold. Lol. I’m trying. Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 1 hour ago, The Short Umpire said: To be frank this means nothing to anyone. “Better than” is too general of a statement to mean anything. @Rock Bottom already explained, “complicate it further, what's "better" to me may be more or less important to someone else. For example, somehow who umps a lot in 95+ heat might value breathability and light weight at the expense of a little protection, vs. someone who primarily umps in colder climates, etc.” Your drive to accomplish this project is admirable but please stop trying to market this on your own. You’ve gotten a lot of great advice on this thread and people want to see you succeed but marketing is not a strength of yours. I know you’re young but that just means you’re gonna need help. This last post about the foam you found being better is just showing that either you can’t see the big picture or you’re not reading/listening to the great advice you’re getting. I guess I don’t understand all of it. Maybe I am looking in the wrong place. What do you recommend? Because I want to grow when it comes to stuff like this, and be able to take stuff from people who are older and wiser than me. So maybe like if you were me, what would you do? Quote
johnnyg08 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 Americans love stuff that is cheap. If you can develop a product that's good enough, you'll sell plenty of units. Just look at the different shirts umpires wear. Many will wear one that's close enough to what the good ones look like just a save a few bucks. Quote
BT_Blue Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 Something I don't think anyone has brought up, is that Ray's original products (the harness and line up folder) were relatively inexpensive and a repeatable product. I could have ordered three different harnesses for the current three different chest protectors I currently have. And they would work on all three. I could also order folders for different associations I would have been in at the time so I could customize for games I work that day. Once I buy a replacement pad for a CP (and I know at least one of them wouldn't work with the padding discussed), I won't be buying new padding for a decade. That is A LONG TIME for a repeat customer. 1 Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 8 minutes ago, BT_Blue said: Something I don't think anyone has brought up, is that Ray's original products (the harness and line up folder) were relatively inexpensive and a repeatable product. I could have ordered three different harnesses for the current three different chest protectors I currently have. And they would work on all three. I could also order folders for different associations I would have been in at the time so I could customize for games I work that day. Once I buy a replacement pad for a CP (and I know at least one of them wouldn't work with the padding discussed), I won't be buying new padding for a decade. That is A LONG TIME for a repeat customer. That’s a good point. It’s not something that someone buys everyday. It’s not like pens, or hats, shirts, pants, belts… etc….. So make something that lasts? Quote
DerekGDS Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 6 minutes ago, Umpiresrock74 said: So make something that lasts? Ultimately, the consensus seems to be about understanding your market, as @wolfe_man thoroughly explained and @johnnyg08 briefly touched upon. If you're unsure, conducting market research is essential. Consider taking a cue from @Razzer, who plans to test his products through a soft launch to gain some traction. Remember, navigating this market is neither simple nor straightforward; umpires are a challenging market and they encompasses a broad spectrum of shopper profiles and values. I strongly recommend dedicating some time to understand it better. Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 28 minutes ago, DerekGDS said: Ultimately, the consensus seems to be about understanding your market, as @wolfe_man thoroughly explained and @johnnyg08 briefly touched upon. If you're unsure, conducting market research is essential. Consider taking a cue from @Razzer, who plans to test his products through a soft launch to gain some traction. Remember, navigating this market is neither simple nor straightforward; umpires are a challenging market and they encompasses a broad spectrum of shopper profiles and values. I strongly recommend dedicating some time to understand it better. Oaky. Thanks. Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 29 minutes ago, DerekGDS said: Ultimately, the consensus seems to be about understanding your market, as @wolfe_man thoroughly explained and @johnnyg08 briefly touched upon. If you're unsure, conducting market research is essential. Consider taking a cue from @Razzer, who plans to test his products through a soft launch to gain some traction. Remember, navigating this market is neither simple nor straightforward; umpires are a challenging market and they encompasses a broad spectrum of shopper profiles and values. I strongly recommend dedicating some time to understand it better. So maybe instead of trying for a huge launch, start small, and humble, and work with what has been given to me and not to work outside my means. Quote
SeeingEyeDog Posted February 18, 2024 Report Posted February 18, 2024 1 hour ago, johnnyg08 said: Americans love stuff that is cheap. The United States is Ferrari's biggest market. They sell more cars here than any other country in the world. To say Americans love stuff that is cheap is a broad brush. Most, not all, Americans have at least one luxury item in their lives. For some people, it's a high performance automobile. For others, it's travel or nice restaurants or concerts. And for some...it's umpire equipment. And by luxury item, I mean something that an individual chooses to spend money on that is excessive for purely aesthetic or pleasure related reasons. Sure...umpires as a group are notorious for their thriftiness. I may be an outlier but, I have always approached umpiring as a "buy once, cry once" proposition when it comes to equipment and uniforms. But, even I have my limits. I've been eyeing a Force3 CP for a long, long time because a lot of guys in my humid summer market really like that CP when the hot weather sets in. That's a $300 CP. I suspect there is room in the marketplace for a CP that is lightweight and breathable which is likely not going to be as protective as some of the other premium CPs, which sells for less than $250. If someone brings something like that to the marketplace, I will be interested. ~Dawg Quote
Razzer Posted February 19, 2024 Report Posted February 19, 2024 1 hour ago, Umpiresrock74 said: That’s a good point. It’s not something that someone buys everyday. It’s not like pens, or hats, shirts, pants, belts… etc….. So make something that lasts? Umpiresrock74..check your inbox 3 Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 19, 2024 Report Posted February 19, 2024 3 hours ago, DerekGDS said: Ultimately, the consensus seems to be about understanding your market, as @wolfe_man thoroughly explained and @johnnyg08 briefly touched upon. If you're unsure, conducting market research is essential. Consider taking a cue from @Razzer, who plans to test his products through a soft launch to gain some traction. Remember, navigating this market is neither simple nor straightforward; umpires are a challenging market and they encompasses a broad spectrum of shopper profiles and values. I strongly recommend dedicating some time to understand if Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 19, 2024 Report Posted February 19, 2024 1 hour ago, Razzer said: Umpiresrock74..check your inbox Hey guys! Has an awesome talk with Ray this evening. He gave me some pointers. 1 1 Quote
johnnyg08 Posted February 19, 2024 Report Posted February 19, 2024 16 hours ago, SeeingEyeDog said: The United States is Ferrari's biggest market. They sell more cars here than any other country in the world. To say Americans love stuff that is cheap is a broad brush. Most, not all, Americans have at least one luxury item in their lives. For some people, it's a high performance automobile. For others, it's travel or nice restaurants or concerts. And for some...it's umpire equipment. And by luxury item, I mean something that an individual chooses to spend money on that is excessive for purely aesthetic or pleasure related reasons. Sure...umpires as a group are notorious for their thriftiness. I may be an outlier but, I have always approached umpiring as a "buy once, cry once" proposition when it comes to equipment and uniforms. But, even I have my limits. I've been eyeing a Force3 CP for a long, long time because a lot of guys in my humid summer market really like that CP when the hot weather sets in. That's a $300 CP. I suspect there is room in the marketplace for a CP that is lightweight and breathable which is likely not going to be as protective as some of the other premium CPs, which sells for less than $250. If someone brings something like that to the marketplace, I will be interested. ~Dawg Sure...I own every high end CP that anyone would've wanted in the last 20 years. All American (Twice lol) Douglas WV Gold WV Memory Foam Force 3 - 1.0 All Star 4000 All Star Cobalt Gosh...I probably have more in my closet...but those are the ones I can think of off the top of my head. 1 Quote
Umpiresrock74 Posted February 21, 2024 Report Posted February 21, 2024 On 2/18/2024 at 5:18 PM, BT_Blue said: Something I don't think anyone has brought up, is that Ray's original products (the harness and line up folder) were relatively inexpensive and a repeatable product. I could have ordered three different harnesses for the current three different chest protectors I currently have. And they would work on all three. I could also order folders for different associations I would have been in at the time so I could customize for games I work that day. Once I buy a replacement pad for a CP (and I know at least one of them wouldn't work with the padding discussed), I won't be buying new padding for a decade. That is A LONG TIME for a repeat customer. This is the riddell I just finished. 2 Quote
blue32 Posted February 21, 2024 Report Posted February 21, 2024 I’ve got to hand it to you buddy, that looks pretty good! 8 minutes ago, Umpiresrock74 said: This is the riddell I just finished. Quote
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