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interference/obstruction/play on???

Guest Craig

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Guest Craig

Guest Craig

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Posted

Play at home plate. Runner from third begins slide, catcher fumbles and drops the ball which rolls under the sliding runner. Runner has not reached home, but continues to inch toward home plate with the ball underneath him. Runner is not intentionally attempting to interfere, simply trying to reach home base. What would the proper ruling be???

Thanks, in advance, for your time.

Peace,

Crag

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CJK
CJK

Whistle the puck down when you lose sight of it.  No goal.

noumpere
noumpere

IT's possible for the runner to INT here, and the umpire should have that in the back of his/her mind.  In practice, though, OBS is more likely as F2 in reaching for the ball moves or blocks the runne

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Kevin_K

Kevin_K

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Posted

If the runner's access to HP was denied and F2 did not have possession of the ball then it could be obstruction on F2 depending on the rule set.

 

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beerguy55

beerguy55

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Posted
12 hours ago, Guest Craig said:

Runner has not reached home, but continues to inch toward home plate with the ball underneath him. Runner is not intentionally attempting to interfere, simply trying to reach home base. What would the proper ruling be???

Sounds more like the runner is simply trying to reach home base AND would like to keep the ball underneath him...which is why he is "inching" towards the plate.   Base runners typically don't stay still, or don't inch along slowly, unless injured, when they are not safely on a base.

 

Regardless of what actually is going on in the runner's mind and heart - only the runner knows that.  The casual observer can only collect the facts and make an educated guess.   Since the umpire's job is to track the ball, this umpire either knows exactly where it is...or, knows that it is under one of the two players.   Knowing I can't currently see the ball...and then combine that with seeing the base runner looking a lot like he's trying to sneak up on home plate...I'd come to the conclusion that the runner is hiding something.

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Rich Ives

Rich Ives

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Posted
2 hours ago, beerguy55 said:

Sounds more like the runner is simply trying to reach home base AND would like to keep the ball underneath him...which is why he is "inching" towards the plate.   Base runners typically don't stay still, or don't inch along slowly, unless injured, when they are not safely on a base.

 

Regardless of what actually is going on in the runner's mind and heart - only the runner knows that.  The casual observer can only collect the facts and make an educated guess.   Since the umpire's job is to track the ball, this umpire either knows exactly where it is...or, knows that it is under one of the two players.   Knowing I can't currently see the ball...and then combine that with seeing the base runner looking a lot like he's trying to sneak up on home plate...I'd come to the conclusion that the runner is hiding something.

If I'm a foot from the base I'm not standing up  or getting to my knees to get there, I'm doing a low crawl.

Catcher can learn to keep possession next time.

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ricka56

ricka56

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, beerguy55 said:

I'd come to the conclusion that the runner is hiding something.

And rule interference ? That could be supported by the rules maybe, but only the delight DHC would buy that judgement call.

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LRZ

LRZ

Posted
Posted

The OP wrote, "Runner is not intentionally attempting to interfere, simply trying to reach home base." I have a catcher searching for the ball he fumbled and a runner scrambling for the plate. Without some additional HTBT facts, I don't see how you can conclude the runner was trying to hide the ball, rather than simply reach the plate.

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noumpere

noumpere

Posted
Posted

IT's possible for the runner to INT here, and the umpire should have that in the back of his/her mind.  In practice, though, OBS is more likely as F2 in reaching for the ball moves or blocks the runner away from the plate.  90% play on, 9% OBS, 1% INT based on an extensive 100,000-event simulation I just ran through my mind.

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beerguy55

beerguy55

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, Rich Ives said:

If I'm a foot from the base I'm not standing up  or getting to my knees to get there, I'm doing a low crawl.

Catcher can learn to keep possession next time.

You're doing a low crawl and inching your way to home plate when you have no idea where the ball is?   Or only when you know the ball is underneath you?  I'd suggest the latter.  Doing the former would be plain dumb.   At best, you're scrambling/diving to the plate...again, unless you KNOW the ball is underneath you and it's the only way to keep the catcher from the ball.

 

19 minutes ago, LRZ said:

The OP wrote, "Runner is not intentionally attempting to interfere, simply trying to reach home base." I have a catcher searching for the ball he fumbled and a runner scrambling for the plate. Without some additional HTBT facts, I don't see how you can conclude the runner was trying to hide the ball, rather than simply reach the plate.

 Words mean things.  "Inching" to the plate has a definitive meaning.  I played ball for 30 years...under no circumstances have I  inched towards a base without being injured, nor ever seen someone else doing it...and can't conceive of someone doing it unless they're hiding the ball.

Yes...definitely HTBT to see if his "inching" matches my idea of "inching".

If I'm an umpire and I know the ball is under the runner...there's a pretty good chance the runner knows it too.

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Rich Ives

Rich Ives

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

You're doing a low crawl and inching your way to home plate when you have no idea where the ball is? 

Are you stupid enough to get up to your knees or stand up in order to go the last foot to the base, especially when you don't know where the ball is? You'd be running laps if you did that. 

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LRZ

LRZ

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, beerguy55 said:

Words mean things.

Yes, they do, but, with no disrespect to the OP, I doubt that internet posts can be read with the same precise linguistic analysis as if written by Hemingway, say, or Oscar Wilde. I read "inching" in conjunction with the rest of the OP's description.

By the way, I think you meant "definite."

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beerguy55

beerguy55

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Rich Ives said:

Are you stupid enough to get up to your knees or stand up in order to go the last foot to the base, especially when you don't know where the ball is? You'd be running laps if you did that. 

If I have slid in feet first and I have come to a stop about a foot or two short of the plate, and I have no idea where the ball is, I am getting to the plate as fast as I can.  HOW that happens doesn't really matter - whether I shuffle on my ass, or spin around, or dive or scramble, or teleport. 

What it won't be is "inching" towards the plate, or any other kind of slow, prolonged, protracted movement which extends my vulnerability to the catcher finding the ball, especially if it ends up being underneath or beside him, or beside me, and tagging me with it.    The only way the slow crawl helps me is if I am on the ball.

 

59 minutes ago, LRZ said:

By the way, I think you meant "definite."

Definitely possible.

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