Balks

[Guest Juan can]

Thoughts on this statement: If a pitcher deliberately deceives a runner, it is a balk.

[scrounge]

My thoughts: it's a truism, in the same vein as tie goes to the runner, the hands are part of the bat, etc. In other words, it's a myth.

Deception is perfectly fine, deception while violating a set of specific pitching rules is a balk. Then again, so is non-deception while violating a set of specific pitching rules.

[maven]

6 hours ago, Guest Juan can said:

Thoughts on this statement: If a pitcher deliberately deceives a runner, it is a balk.

If we saw that on a rules test, the correct response would be: "FALSE"

[scrounge]

13 minutes ago, Rich Ives said:

"Tie goes to the runner" is true. The runner or the base has to be tagged BEFORE  he touches the base. A tie isn't "before".

Not going down this silly rabbit hole again...beat the throw. There are no ties.

[Stan W.]

deception is legal............illegal deception is not.........

Think of all the things that can be done to legally deceive a runner...........speed up motion, slide step, arm position, pitch outs, varying pitch velocity, throwing over..........all legal......

then the things that cause balks............illegal deception.....  

[noumpere]

45 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

And before we say that there can't be ties to an infinite number of decimal places...sure...I can buy that...but if the Olympic games can have ties to two or three decimal places, in distances from 50 m (summer - swimming) to 50 km (winter - cross country), then I think baseball can have a tie at 90 feet.

Maybe the concept of a "tie" only exists in the metric system and not in the English system? 

[roothog66]

6 hours ago, scrounge said:

Not going down this silly rabbit hole again...beat the throw. There are no ties.

I would say to avoid the premises completely. I would suggest that the correct response when someone wants to declare "it was a tie!", is not "the runner beat the throw," but rather "the throw did not beat the runner."

[BT_Blue]

8 hours ago, maven said:

If we saw that on a rules test, the correct response would be: "FALSE"

Unless it is FED... then who knows!

[beerguy55]

5 minutes ago, BT_Blue said:

Unless it is FED... then who knows!

Wouldn't New Jersey have

a. True

b. False

c. All of the above

d. None of the above

[maven]

30 minutes ago, BT_Blue said:

Unless it is FED... then who knows!

I stand by my statement: that's the correct answer.

Depending on the state, the FED credited response might differ.

[BT_Blue]

26 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

Wouldn't New Jersey have

a. True

b. False

c. All of the above

d. None of the above

Of course the correct answer will most likely be E.

1 minute ago, maven said:

I stand by my statement: that's the correct answer.

Depending on the state, the FED credited response might differ.

Oh... not arguing that you are correct or not (of course you are). Just that it turns into the wild west at times with these things.

[Richvee]

5 hours ago, beerguy55 said:

Wouldn't New Jersey have

a. True

b. False

c. All of the above

d. None of the above

d would read....."Both b & c"

( I'm working on becoming a NJSIAA test writer)

[BT_Blue]

5 minutes ago, Richvee said:

d would read....."Both b & c"

( I'm working on becoming a NJSIAA test writer)

My god, that is so true. Lol

[Rich Ives]

2 hours ago, scrounge said:

My thoughts: it's a truism, in the same vein as tie goes to the runner, the hands are part of the bat, etc. In other words, it's a myth.

Deception is perfectly fine, deception while violating a set of specific pitching rules is a balk. Then again, so is non-deception while violating a set of specific pitching rules.

"Tie goes to the runner" is true. The runner or the base has to be tagged BEFORE  he touches the base. A tie isn't "before".

[beerguy55]

5 hours ago, Rich Ives said:

"Tie goes to the runner" is true. The runner or the base has to be tagged BEFORE  he touches the base. A tie isn't "before".

Agreed

If you go by FED rules, and softball rules...and I suspect at some point in the past OBR was worded this way too (OSR pretty much started with OBR as the template when they wrote the rule set), a runner is out if they are tagged while not in contact with the base.   If there is a tie, that means the runner is in contact with the base...ergo, tie goes to the runner.

Anyway, that IMO has always been the spirit of the game...if you're touching the base you're safe.

And before we say that there can't be ties to an infinite number of decimal places...sure...I can buy that...but if the Olympic games can have ties to two or three decimal places, in distances from 50 m (summer - swimming) to 50 km (winter - cross country), then I think baseball can have a tie at 90 feet.