Fan ejection

[conbo61]

Here is a situation that happened recently and I wanted to get the board's take on it.

Two rival high schools (A vs B) are playing a regular season game at a neutral field. A fan of Team B (a student) is sitting close to the plate and is all over the catcher for Team A. It gets VERY personal (apparently there was a young lady involved). Gestures are exchanged between catcher and fan between innings, etc.

This situation spilled over into a fight in the parking lot (a coach was struck) and the catcher was suspended.

Question: As an umpire (lets say Plate who may have heard all this going on), what action, if any do you take during thee game? Recognizing that what happens in the parking lot is outside of your responsibility.

I was not at the game, but know some of the parties involved. If I were the plate umpire, I would have brought the HC for Team B over in front of the fan and told the fan to knock it off. I then would have put the coach on notice that if the fan persisted, the fan would have been tossed and the coach restricted. I would then have left to let the coach adress the fan and his behavior.

I would appreciate hearing opinions.

Thank you.

[Thunderheads]

As PU (if I were) I wouldn't have let it get escalated on the field (if I knew it was happening). Nip it right there ...its YOUR field, take control

[mstaylor]

You can't restrict a coach for a stupid fan. What you can do is get the game management into it. That is their job, your job is to tell the catcher to knock it off. In my area there is a game administrator and a deputy at every game. I am good friends with most of the deputies so I can get it handled quickly.

[Dannytheman]

My league has a new local rule that allows the Umpire in charge of the game to dismiss fans. The parents have all been notified. We do not always have a board member available at every game, so with some strong backing of the board, they passed a local rule that gives the ump the ability and board would back his/her decision.

2013 season it will go in effect. It is beyond the LL rules, but the majority of parents don't know the rules anyway.

So, in your case, I would have remarked to the fan, that he needs to be quiet, or you will have him removed, by the police if needed.

[RC@54OUTS]

I also wouldn't let the verbal crap to escalate. Sounds like it was personal. If you let a spark go it will start a fire. I would have gone to the "B" manager to take care of the problem. Discreettly. If he couldn't then he would be tossed. Once you indicate to the manager that he's gone watch how quick the big mouth leaves. Its covered at the plate meeting. Usually by that time the parents and fans are 100% behind you. I rarely see an AD at the high school games here. But they would be my first choice to handle the problem. The AD is the protocol.

[BRUMP]

Find the site director/ AD and get the fan out.

[Forest Ump]

Why threaten the coach/manager with an ejection? In the absence of an AD, not uncommon, walk over to the head coach of the home team and tell him a fan is creating a nuisance. Can he please have him removed? If its one man discussing with another man about an issue calmly and respectfully, then you shouldn't have to ratchet up to DEFCON 2. One of the distinctions between good umpires and great umpires is handling situations in a calm professional manner.

[mstaylor]

HS does not allow you to punish the coach in any way for stupid fans. Get the game admin guy to handle it. In lieu of that tell the coach. If they can't handle it then consider suspending the game, not forfeiting, but suspending. I can't imagine it ever getting to that level though. I have to assume the catcher knew the kid's name since they were jawwing over a girl. Get the spectator's name and do a report. The school will take care of him.

It might be as simple as giving him a stop sign and a strong hey.

[JaxRolo]

HS does not allow you to punish the coach in any way for stupid fans. Get the game admin guy to handle it. In lieu of that tell the coach. If they can't handle it then consider suspending the game, not forfeiting, but suspending. I can't imagine it ever getting to that level though. I have to assume the catcher knew the kid's name since they were jawwing over a girl. Get the spectator's name and do a report. The school will take care of him.

It might be as simple as giving him a stop sign and a strong hey.

Just playing devils advocate here.

Why do they have us tell coaches at the plate meeting that they are responsible for the conduct of players, assistant coaches and fans?

[mstaylor]

That must be a group thing or maybe a conference thing. All NFHS requires is that we mention that sportsmanship. That covers the game participants, says nothing about fans.

[JaxRolo]

That must be a group thing or maybe a conference thing. All NFHS requires is that we mention that sportsmanship. That covers the game participants, says nothing about fans.

It's a FHSAA thing. It's covered in the FHSAA Baseball Manual

[mstaylor]

Well, in that case, dump him quick. I was working a game several years ago and the starting QB was an ass. He was sitting on the first base side stands and starts heckling and being pretty personal. The manager asked for time, came up the line and very vocally dumped him. Of course he was also the football coach and AD. Kid turned tail and ran.

[yawetag]

First off, I'm telling my F2 to back off and that I would handle it. Since I don't know what school the fan is from (kids from the same school get at it the same way as OP did) and it's being played at a neutral site, I think I'd call both coaches to the plate and let them know that the fan needs to be removed from the park.

[NCAAump2]

I agree...have game administration step in and take care of it. Not much the coach can do about it, and you definitely can't eject or restrict him.

[tphipps]

This is a situation that all umpire's at some point and at some level will encounter.  Some my disagree, but it has been my experience that I concentrate on everything that has to do with the players and coaches on the field and the dugouts.  As an umpire, we are responsible for managing the game within the fence.  Once you start listening to fans and take things personal then you are not 100% focused on doing your job.

 

Saying that, there should always be a school administrater, tournament director or a point of contact that should handle any problem fans in the stands.  When I arrive at a game site the first thing that I ask is who is in charge of administration duties and find that person, introduce myself and go over any possible situations that could come up and let him know that i will be in charge of everything on the field and I will expect him/her to handle any situations that may arise outside the field that might cause any disruption of the game.

When you do that, you are doing preventive umpiring that will allow you to be prepared should a situation come up.  When you have a plan of action for things like this, you will see it nipped in the bud and I promise you that the game administrater will appreciate your attention to detail and including he/she in your game plan.

 

I would definitly let the catcher know, in a discrete way, that if he is going to acknowledge the heckler and converse with him that he will not be in the game long for the simple fact that he is a player on the field.

 

It is hard to listen to stupid people that don't know anything about the game, but you as an umpire have enough to take care of on the field so have thick skin and focus on your task at hand.  It took me a long time to learn that but after I did, it was a load taken off of me and I became more in tuned and sharper at my job as an umpire.

[catsbackr]

Stay out of the stands!

[alex7]

Stay out of the stands!

 

Let's not oversimplify it.  F2 started jawing back, so it's no longer just an "in the stands" situation.  Sounds like most agree the coach(es) need to be involved to help out the situation.

[Jocko]

Stay out of the stands!

 Let's not oversimplify it.  F2 started jawing back, so it's no longer just an "in the stands" situation.  Sounds like most agree the coach(es) need to be involved to help out the situation.I'm with Hipps on this one. Control what's ON the field. Keep your F2 focused. That's self-preservation, as much as anything else. Notify someone in authority, be it the HC, AD, school admin, etc. and have THEM handle crowd control.

[dumbdumb]

As a coach, it is my responsibility to control my players and expect sportsmanlike conduct from both my fans and my players. I will control both, if needed, up to and including forfeiting the game for unsportsmanlike conduct by either my players or my fans if that is what I feel is necessary. As a coach of team B, as soon as my Team B fan (student) starting up on the opposing catcher, I would call time and immediately get the attention of the student from my school to knock it off or leave the premises. If it appeared there would become a major incident, I would go to the home plate umpire and forfeit the game. I would go over to the opposing coach and apologize for the conduct of my fans, and tell him I was forfeiting the game.

 

If team A, as soon as my player started responding to this student, I would immediately take him out of the game. I would have been preaching from day one to my players about the deportment, and sportsmanship I expected on the field. They would have been told to ignore the fans, and that I would immediately take care of anything involving fans crossing the line.

 

Somebody in this world has to stand up and take responsibility on these uncalled for actions of unsportsmanlike conduct that crosses the line. If I get fired for having the courage to stand up for what I believe in, then so be it. Unsportsmanlike conduct such as the OP has no place in HS athletics.

 

I would have explained my sportsmanship expectations to my Principle, the AD and the local school board that would have considered hiring me in the first place, and I also would have explained that I would not be afraid to forfeit a game because of my players or fans unsportsmanlike conduct if I felt in my heart that was right thing to do under the circumstances.

 

First of all, I would try to never accept a game at a neutral field or any event at any field for that matter without a representative of my school in attendance that had the authority to handle some such incident in the first place, up to and including calling for police protection, or for police to remove unruly fans. If by chance, I am the only representative, then I will do what I think needs to be done, and expect to be backed up by the administration. If you don't want me to take care of a situation the best way I see fit, keeping in mind the integrity or the game, sportsmanship, honesty and fair play, representation of the school and its administration, then send someone with the team who can take care of this.

 

Basically, at my games, if unsportsmanlike situations off the field are not going to be handled by the representatives with authority at my school, then I will not be coaching. That leaves Sportsmanship on the field to me the coach, and I will handle pronto.

 

The umpires at my games will only have to umpire things between the white lines. I will handle my players, and the administration will handle crowd control, etc., or there will be no game.

[alex7]

Good time to ask...how's the whole cloning process coming along?  Looks like I've found a use.

[mstaylor]

I like dumbdumb's response to a point. If I were the team A coach I would certainly address the issue with my catcher, but I wouldn't immediately pull him.  That is not entirely fair to the team, the fan may be trying to get a good player out of the line-up for his reaction to the fan. I would explain to him to let it go and let the adults handle it. But then the adults have to do that. I have had fans get on players and as the umpire I have talked to the player and backed him out of it, then gotten game admin into it.