On deck batter in Little league

[Rotten]

I am under the impression that there are no on deck batters in Little league with the exception of Seniors,   I prohibit all other divisions from having anyone swing a bat prior to their turn at bat.  In my opinion This includes the first batter of the inning. I always interpreted the rule as the first batter of the inning can come out of the dugout but can not swing a bat until he/she steps to the plate.  Am I missing something?

[stevis]

On-deck batters are allowed at Intermediate and above.  Reg. XIV b.

1.08 Note 2 allows for the first batter of each inning to be outside the dugout between half-innings in Majors and below.  Since it's explicit about that, it implies that at Intermediate and up, you can have a handful out of the dugout.  I'd watch that for safety, but I do allow it.

I think you are being too impermissive on the swings; since the Rules Instruction Manual itself since batters should be allowed a few swings while stepping to the plate, I see no problem with that lone out of the dugout batter swinging, either.

[Rotten]

this is the rule as per the Little league Rule book Rule 1.08 

 Note 1. The on deck batter position is not permitted in LL Major Division and Below

A,R, Fenced in areas may not be used for an on deck batter

 

Note 2, Only the first batter of each half inning will be permitted outside the dugout between half innings in LL Major Division and below/  A.R. The next batter should be ready with a helmet on, but may not pick up a bat until it is his/her turn at bat

Note 2's A.R. does not state that the First batter of each half inning can swing a bat. wouldn't swinging a bat outside the dugot be considered "on Deck"?

[Tborze]

1 hour ago, Rotten said:

this is the rule as per the Little league Rule book Rule 1.08 

 Note 1. The on deck batter position is not permitted in LL Major Division and Below

A,R, Fenced in areas may not be used for an on deck batter

 

Note 2, Only the first batter of each half inning will be permitted outside the dugout between half innings in LL Major Division and below/  A.R. The next batter should be ready with a helmet on, but may not pick up a bat until it is his/her turn at bat

Note 2's A.R. does not state that the First batter of each half inning can swing a bat. wouldn't swinging a bat outside the dugot be considered "on Deck"?

The on deck batter is the batter who follows the batter who’s turn it is to bat. 
 

The on deck circle is used by this batter. 

[Velho]

3 hours ago, Rotten said:

Note 2, Only the first batter of each half inning will be permitted outside the dugout between half innings in LL Major Division and below/  A.R. The next batter should be ready with a helmet on, but may not pick up a bat until it is his/her turn at bat

Note 2's A.R. does not state that the First batter of each half inning can swing a bat. wouldn't swinging a bat outside the dugot be considered "on Deck"?

Good on ya for being thoughtful but I think you may be overdoing it here. What does your fellow umpires do? What does your UICs (league, district) say?

I can't quote you a rule but by practice the first batter of each inning is allowed, with a helmet on and in a safe spot, to swing the bat while the pitcher is arming up. I'd have to check video for Region & LLWS but can say this happens everywhere I've personally worked - local leagues (~20), districts (2), section and state.

@Mudisfun is a muckyity-muck that can weigh in.

[beerguy55]

3 hours ago, Rotten said:

 

Note 2's A.R. does not state that the First batter of each half inning can swing a bat. wouldn't swinging a bat outside the dugot be considered "on Deck"?

"On deck" simply means the next batter up...doesn't matter where they are or what they are doing.  Some rule sets in baseball and softball define where an on deck batter must and must not be, but those conditions don't define the ODB.

I can understand prohibiting swinging for that first batter of the inning, and all the reasons for it, but there better be a rule prohibiting it.

 

What is the ODB batter allowed to do with their bat while they're walking to the batter's box...they have to keep it on their shoulder?  They allowed a couple of practice swings...they allowed to stretch the bat over each of their shoulders?  Careful how far you legislate this.

[Rotten]

beerguy55 wrote.

"What is the ODB batter allowed to do with their bat while they're walking to the batter's box...they have to keep it on their shoulder?  They allowed a couple of practice swings...they allowed to stretch the bat over each of their shoulders?  Careful how far you legislate this."

 

I would say that approaching the plate to get your at bat is the time to take a couple of swings, While everyone is aware of your coming up to bat. Swinging between the catcher and dugout opening while practice balls and players chasing them are in that area  is dangerous 

[Mudisfun]

So the way we have interpreted this in our league, our district and how it was taught at the Western Region week long when I was there in 2020 was, for Majors and below:

Prior to the start of the inning, the first batter of the inning is allowed out of the dugout with their bat. They are allowed to take swings and do what we would consider normal for the first batter who is coming to the plate. All other offensive players, unless heading to a coaches box are required to be in the dugout, no bats in their hands. There is no on deck batter allowed at this level or below.

Other than that first batter of the inning (or if there is a pitching change, that batter who should/will be up), no player will be out swinging a bat. 

When the next batter comes out of the dugout, that batter is permitted to take a couple practice hacks since they are not coming from a position where they are allowed to prepare.

 

Intermediate and above, the on deck batter is allowed, so 'real baseball'.

 

Hope this helps! And @Velho, thanks for the props, but I am just another LL Volunteer.

[Rotten]

OK  thank you for the clarification

   

[SeeingEyeDog]

Just a reminder to anyone working 13U under FED...since this is usually the players' (and maybe some managers') first year playing on the big field under FED rules, they still want to default to the LL on-deck rule which requires or requirED (if it's no longer the rule...) to be in the on-deck circle that is on the same side of the plate as the batter, regardless of what dugout their team is in.

For example, lefty at the plate? LL batters use the 1B side on-deck circle. Righty at the plate? LL batters use the 3B side on-deck circle. This is all in the name of safety. However, if this has been negated by a recent LL change or local league change, then by all means do what you are commanded to do.

Under FED rules, the on-deck batter remains on the side his dugout is, regardless of what side of the plate the batter is on. The 13U kids tend to struggle with this early in the season...

~Dawg  

[ousafe]

Since 2022, I believe - LL baseball Regulation XIV b. Approved ruling:

A.R. – Intermediate (50-70) Division/Junior/Senior League: The on-deck batter shall be positioned in the on-deck circle closest to their dugout.

[Velho]

 

[Mudisfun]

The 'training' issue I have more issues with once we hit an age where there is an on-deck batter is not them trying to use the wrong side... nope. It is getting on deck to recognize he/she is the pass ball with no one on, or the foul ball to the back stop ball-shagger.

Go fetch!

[ArchAngel72]

We run it as Mud has described it,

 

12U, 10U   The 1st batter up of the half-inning is allowed to be out of the dugout and get ready for their at bat. All other "On Deck" folks are in the dugout NO bats in hand.

 

13U   Game on play it like you would think.  On deck batters are out in the on deck circle.