Homeplate Collision

[Guest jerry S]

 

OK guys.....what be the call?

[Replacematt]

Obstruction. F2, without possession of the ball, impeded the runner's path to home. This is not malicious contact because it appears the runner was bracing himself at the last second for an unexpected collision (he was probably anticipating F2 receiving the ball and making a tag or vacating the area, not standing there illegally.)

[BuckeyeMike]

I think we've seen this vid a time or two on here, and although I can't remember the general consensus, I have OBS on this.   A throw that pulls the F2 into the path of the runner, with a collision, should be OBS. 

 

Edit:  Clarifying my post above is for FED.   Maven in his post below makes a great point about NCAA/OBR.

[maven]

FED: OBS. F2 cannot deny the runner access to the base without possessing the ball. After playing action is complete, call time and award the runner HP.

 

OBR: train wreck. Not OBS, since F2 was in the immediate act of fielding the throw. Not INT, since the runner was trying to get to the plate. Not MC, since the runner is not clearly trying to truck F2. Out on the tag by F1.

[Replacematt]

Yep. I was assuming FED.

[johnnyg08]

What do you have in NCAA?  

[Replacematt]

What do you have in NCAA?

Train wreck.

[Guest jerry S]

Shazam....I got this one right. Thanks guys! I love spending my off time reading your rulings. I have learned so much.

[ElkOil]

FED: OBS. F2 cannot deny the runner access to the base without possessing the ball. After playing action is complete, call time and award the runner HP.

 

OBR: train wreck. Not OBS, since F2 was in the immediate act of fielding the throw. Not INT, since the runner was trying to get to the plate. Not MC, since the runner is not clearly trying to truck F2. Out on the tag by F1.

 

To clarify in FED, the act of fielding -- and not possessing -- the ball can result in OBS, correct?

[Guest Eastsidecoach]

In many tournaments and local leagues the runner is out. All the 11U, 12U and 13U tourneys Ive coached have rules that state the runner MUST slide or give up on close plays. Keep those quirky local rules in mind.

[BuckeyeMike]

Yes.  In FED, it matters NOT that a defensive player is "in the act of fielding".   In OBR, that DOES matter.

[Replacematt]

In many tournaments and local leagues the runner is out. All the 11U, 12U and 13U tourneys Ive coached have rules that state the runner MUST slide or give up on close plays. Keep those quirky local rules in mind.

I'd bet that's a misconception on your part (and a common one.) No sanctioning body has such a rule.

[blue23ll]

 

In many tournaments and local leagues the runner is out. All the 11U, 12U and 13U tourneys Ive coached have rules that state the runner MUST slide or give up on close plays. Keep those quirky local rules in mind.

I'd bet that's a misconception on your part (and a common one.) No sanctioning body has such a rule.

 

I have worked in some levels of youth ball that indeed do have a 'must slide' rule. 

[Replacematt]

In many tournaments and local leagues the runner is out. All the 11U, 12U and 13U tourneys Ive coached have rules that state the runner MUST slide or give up on close plays. Keep those quirky local rules in mind.

I'd bet that's a misconception on your part (and a common one.) No sanctioning body has such a rule.

I have worked in some levels of youth ball that indeed do have a 'must slide' rule.

Again, no sanctioning body has such a rule.

[blue23ll]

I suppose we must make the distinction between sanctioning body and local rules, to be exact and precise. 

[Guest Eastside Coach]

I suppose we must make the distinction between sanctioning body and local rules, to be exact and precise. 

Precisely.  It's not a sanctioning body. It's the local tournament rules and those can get quirky. Innings a pitcher can go in a day or in a tourney change from place to place. Must slide rules. Time limits. Bat weight and diameter. DH, EH, continuous batting orders, re-entry..all change from one tourney to another.

[Replacematt]

I suppose we must make the distinction between sanctioning body and local rules, to be exact and precise.

Precisely.  It's not a sanctioning body. It's the local tournament rules and those can get quirky. Innings a pitcher can go in a day or in a tourney change from place to place. Must slide rules. Time limits. Bat weight and diameter. DH, EH, continuous batting orders, re-entry..all change from one tourney to another.

Hope their insurance doesn't find out about those "must slide" rules.

[Jimurray]

I wonder what would have happened if the runner actually slide which usually happens in advanced baseball. Did the runner know or not that the catcher did or not have the ball? If the catcher had the ball in FED, would the runner have to slide or attempt to get around the tag ( or wording such as such)?

[ricka56]

I do think think the the runner did his best not to "truck" F2, but what if the runner didn't attempt to avoid a fielder in the immediate act of making a play on him (as required in 8-4-2c)(added caveat, no MC) . Which rule 2-22 or 8-4-2c takes presidence  ?

[Cav]

Can a NFHS player make a "play" without possession?

[Thunderheads]

Can a NFHS player make a "play" without possession?

not while impeding a runners advance

[Cav]

Which rule 2-22 or 8-4-2c takes presidence  ?

 

Without possession, 2-22; with, 8-4-2.

[ricka56]

Can a NFHS player make a "play" without possession?

 

Oh crap, did I just invite a discussion on the definition of a "play".

[Cav]

That's easy enough: engage in an activity for enjoyment and recreation rather than a serious or practical purpose.  (Did I mention it's sunny out?)

[Guest Wizard2]

 

I suppose we must make the distinction between sanctioning body and local rules, to be exact and precise. 

Precisely.  It's not a sanctioning body. It's the local tournament rules and those can get quirky. Innings a pitcher can go in a day or in a tourney change from place to place. Must slide rules. Time limits. Bat weight and diameter. DH, EH, continuous batting orders, re-entry..all change from one tourney to another.

 

I would never uphold any "Must Slide Rule" ever  I tell the caoches at plate meeting that there is a rule put out by the tourney but I will not tell tell the kids they have to slide but will instruct as I do in all sets to aviod contact

 

 

[Aging_Arbiter]

Shazam....I got this one right. Thanks guys! I love spending my off time reading your rulings. I have learned so much.

 

 

He said "Shazam"