Gorilla Arm Balk?

[umpire_scott]

Do you balk the swinging arm?  Is there a degree to which you balk it as a start/stop?

 

Had a situation last night that turned into an ugly mess due to this.  Pitching was swinging his arm and my BU partner asked him to not do it.  The kid being a jerk took a few steps toward his dugout after the pitch to complain to his coach that the umpire told him not to hang his arm down.  My partner explained to him that he can't swing it like that.  The coach said yes he can, so my partner said fine let him do it then (with the obvious implication being "and I'll balk it when he does").  Truth be told I didn't think he was deceiving the runner in any way and would not have balked it.  As karma would have it the kid did not swing or hang his arm on the next pitch but he did blow right through his pause.  We both saw it but my partner called it first and the coach started yelling that he was just looking for a reason to balk him.  Both my partner and I explained quickly that he didn't pause.  The coach continued to claim that it was a witch hunt on my partners behalf.  My partner told him "enough coach".  Coach said a few more words my partner ejected him.  Astonished at the ejection the coach proceeded to call my partner a punk (three times).  Said "you put that officials shirt on and think your a big man", claimed he would talk to the tournament director and make sure this umpire never worked again, and dropped an "F" bomb on his way out.

 

In all honesty this tournament director wants umpires that can manage games with as much decorum as possible so as to keep the coaches happy so they come back and give him more money for tournaments.  It's his business after all and the coaches and teams are his clients.  So you want to keep the clients happy.  It's a fine line to walk.

[johnnyg08]

As for the Gorilla Arm, if they're receptive, tell him how to properly hold the ball in the set position and move on.  This was a FED Point of Emphasis a few years ago.

 

As for the "pause" you mean he didn't come to a complete and discernible stop?

 

What is the definition of the set position?  (abbreviated) 

 

NFHS:  For the set position, the pitcher shall have the ball in either his gloved hand or his pitching hand. His pitching hand shall be down at his side or behind his back.  He shall go to the set position without interruption and in one continuous motion. He shall come to a complete and discernible stop (a change of direction is not considered an acceptable stop) with the ball in both hands in front of the body

 

NCAA:  The pitching arm shall be at the side or on the hip of the pitcher with the ball in the glove or pitching hand. The pitcher will come to the set position holding the ball in both hands in front of the body and coming to a complete and discernible stop.

 

OBR:  The Set Position. Set Position shall be indicated by the pitcher when he stands facing the batter with his pivot foot in contact with, and his other foot in front of, the pitcher’s plate, holding the ball in both hands in front of his body and coming to a complete stop. From such Set Position he may deliver the ball to the batter, throw to a base or step backward off the pitcher’s plate with his pivot foot. Before assuming Set Position, the pitcher may elect to make any natural preliminary motion such as that known as “the stretch.†But if he so elects, he shall come to Set Position before delivering the ball to the batter. After assuming Set Position, any natural motion associated with his delivery of the ball to the batter commits him to the pitch without alteration or interruption.  Preparatory to coming to a set position, the pitcher shall have one hand on his side; from this position he shall go to his set position as defined in Rule 8.01(b) without interruption and in one continuous motion.  The pitcher, following his stretch, must (a) hold the ball in both hands in front of his body and (b) come to a complete stop.

[Kevin_K]

The gorilla arm was a point of emphasis under FED a couple years ago. I don't see it much any more in these parts as it has been balked out of existence.

 

This could be an example of how warnings rather than enforcement can bite you, or it could simply be the baseball gods chuckling as they mess with you. 

[Rich Ives]

Do you balk the swinging arm?  Is there a degree to which you balk it as a start/stop?

 

.

 

FED ruled that the arm cannot be swinging.  OBR doesn't seem to care. Don't know about NCAA.

 

Which rules were in use?

[catsbackr]

Unless I see illegal deception, I do not call the Gorilla Arm balk. I am much more inclined to call the balk if the ball is in his hand. If the ball is in his glove, I got nothing.

I completely understand the TD's attitude regarding his clients. You, as an umpire, have to decide whether or not you can work understanding his attitude. If the TD doesn't stand behind you as umpires, I'd rethink my decision to work his tournaments.

[noumpere]

 

Do you balk the swinging arm?  Is there a degree to which you balk it as a start/stop?

 

.

 

FED ruled that the arm cannot be swinging.  OBR doesn't seem to care. Don't know about NCAA.

 

Which rules were in use?

 

NCAA is same as OBR.

 

Amd, personally, I think "swing" is much more than "move".

[UMP45]

Doesn't the ball have to be in the hand?

[ALStripes17]

Doesn't the ball have to be in the hand?

No, FED defines a swinging arm as a motion associated with a pitch. With or without the ball is the same thing.

[BalkHawk]

FED: "Hang it, don't swang it."

6-1-3... For the set position, the pitcher shall have the ball in either his gloved hand or his pitching hand. His pitching hand shall be down at his side or behind his back...

2013 NFHS Case book, pg. 52,

6.1.3 situation P: As he looks to the catcher for a signal... b) the pitching arm rocks slightly from side to side. RULING: b), any movement of the arm is considered the start of the pitching motion and a pitch must be delivered to the plate so this motion results in a balk.

OBR: from the stretch, he's good while he swangs it unless the umpire judges a jerky hesitation or a start/stop.

[johnnyg08]

Thanks for posting the case play @BalkHawk

[Jocko]

This is one nit I aint pickin. Let it go. Especially in tourneys.

[Mark Pepper]

This is one nit I aint pickin. Let it go. Especially in tourneys.

+1  I've never seen it have any real value in deceiving a runner or batter, hence the OBR/NCAA allowing it.  

 

But to the second point, it's unfortunate he blew through the stop so close on the heels of the first controversy.  Unfortunately the coach was out of line and fairly blatanly ejected himself.  There may be fallout with the TD, but if the situation was as you described after the balk, a smart TD would stand up for his umpires against that.  If he allows that kind of behavior and expects the umpires to tolerate it, other coaches/teams/fans won't want to play there.  It can be a tough balance for the TD, but this case is very clear.  That's why he gets the big bucks!

[Jimurray]

FED: "Hang it, don't swang it."

6-1-3... For the set position, the pitcher shall have the ball in either his gloved hand or his pitching hand. His pitching hand shall be down at his side or behind his back...

2013 NFHS Case book, pg. 52,

6.1.3 situation P: As he looks to the catcher for a signal... b) the pitching arm rocks slightly from side to side. RULING: b), any movement of the arm is considered the start of (coming set?) the pitching motion and a pitch must be delivered to the plate so this motion results in a balk.

OBR: from the stretch, he's good while he swangs it unless the umpire judges a jerky hesitation or a start/stop.

I think my inserted parentheses make more sense in the caseplay.

[JaxRolo]

Enforce the dang rules people!!!! :wave:

[johnnyg08]

Enforce the dang rules people!!!!

 

There's an idea!!

[Jocko]

@JaxRolo - only the ones that suit my needs at the time. Otherwise, I make em up as I go :smachhead: