LLWS

[JaxRolo]

I like Black Hats with Black Ball Bags with every color shirt.

They match my shoes and belt better.

I believe on my avatar I have black

[Dannytheman]

I like Black Hats with Black Ball Bags with every color shirt.

They match my shoes and belt better.

I believe on my avatar I have black

I happen to agree with that. You are pretty smart for a Navy Chief! Semper Paratus!!

[Jocko]

AHSAA allows navy or grey bags. I have 2 of each, black, navy, grey. They grey go unused.

As for LLWS, I saw a replay today on a force at 2b. The one I would've thought they would replay, they didn't. This one wasn't all that close to me. Guess they thought F6 pulled. The rabbit got the out, and it was correctly upheld.

[basejester]

I'm watching Connecticut vs. Nebraska.

It feels to me that there's too much delay between the PU's verbal call and his hand signal.

Do you agree?

[Rich Ives]

I'll address what Rich Ives posted above:

(1) The LLWS is not local Little League. Our local leagues use teenagers wearing balloons for a lot of league games. Once we get to District play, the umpires are expected to umpire at a certain level and dress a certain way. We would not use an umpire in the All Star tournament who used a raft. We would not allow someone to umpire with shins outside the pants or not in a complete uniform.

(2) Just as teams have to prove they are the best in Districts/Sectionals/State before they get to Regionals, it isn't an unreasonable expectation that Regional umpires be the best of those who work Districts/Sectionals/State. A WS assignment shouldn't be given out as a gold watch for XX number of years of volunteering for a local league. Again, this is just my opinion, and that isn't worth much of anything.

I'll say this. When I went to Indianapolis, I knew I'd be working 3 games on TV. My pants were taken to the dry cleaners before I left for the week and I made sure they were properly pressed. Hell, I had them pressed again when I was down there. My shoes shone when I went on the field. I made sure everything I wore reflected positively on me, my district, the region, and on LL.

It's not too much to ask. It's also not hard to look good in a properly fitting, clean, pressed uniform. I get that we're going to see guys who are very quick behind the plate (we saw a few today) and sketchy mechanics -- some of that is because these guys are *amped up*. Trust me, I know that feeling. Hell, I had tears in my eyes when they played the anthem before my game last Friday I was so amped up knowing that my wife, kid, and a ton of other people were watching.

And these guys *are* volunteers. I don't expect to see all of them work at the same level as the HS/college guys I work with on a regular basis. Many of the umpires I met there last week work *nothing but* LL. A few have never worked on anything but a 60' diamond, even.

But looking good isn't hard *if* you want to work regionals or the LLWS. Not everyone will get to do those tourneys and that's OK. It's unlikely I'll ever get to WP even with a regional behind me. Only 16 umpires get to do it each year, after all.

I comprehend the notion that one should look good.

I comprehend the notion that at any game it looks better if all the base umpires are dressed alike - PU sometimes has a different shirt color even in MLB.

But as we have seen in various discussions, (and even above in this thread on ball bag color) styles and requirements vary across associations/states/whatever. So bashing another for having a different notion of "correct" is somewhat parochial.

I don't see anyone bashing someone else for having a different brand/style of chest protector, cup, shin guards, shoes, etc. Standared mask versus HSM - people choose what they wish with little objection. I guess then personal protection is up to the individual - unless of course you want to use a balloon - then you're an idiot/dweeb/smitty.

Acceptable jersey colors seem to vary by area/association too. Red seems to draw a lot of comment. Light blue was unacceptable for a few years but seems to be making a comeback. White shirts, ties, and jackets (see the ump-attire ad below) are nowhere to be seen (nice hats huh?)

So I guess the local "boss" sets the expectations. If he says a balloon is acceptable it's acceptable.

What should we do about the players. Pant lengths vary. Catcher1 has different equipment than catcher2. Batter6 has a mask on his helmet,but no one else does. The SS has a red glove. RF has a blue glove. Others have mostly brown but a couple have black gloves. OMG! What shall we do about these abhorent situations!?!?

Things vary . . it makes life better that way too.

And guys, from a manager/coach perspective - I do notice how you look as you walk in but at the end of the game what mattered is how did you umpire - not how did you look doing it.

And from you - why all the comments on how the LLWS guys are performing? I guess it plays a role . . . .

[RichMSN]

I'll address what Rich Ives posted above:

(1) The LLWS is not local Little League. Our local leagues use teenagers wearing balloons for a lot of league games. Once we get to District play, the umpires are expected to umpire at a certain level and dress a certain way. We would not use an umpire in the All Star tournament who used a raft. We would not allow someone to umpire with shins outside the pants or not in a complete uniform.

(2) Just as teams have to prove they are the best in Districts/Sectionals/State before they get to Regionals, it isn't an unreasonable expectation that Regional umpires be the best of those who work Districts/Sectionals/State. A WS assignment shouldn't be given out as a gold watch for XX number of years of volunteering for a local league. Again, this is just my opinion, and that isn't worth much of anything.

I'll say this. When I went to Indianapolis, I knew I'd be working 3 games on TV. My pants were taken to the dry cleaners before I left for the week and I made sure they were properly pressed. Hell, I had them pressed again when I was down there. My shoes shone when I went on the field. I made sure everything I wore reflected positively on me, my district, the region, and on LL.

It's not too much to ask. It's also not hard to look good in a properly fitting, clean, pressed uniform. I get that we're going to see guys who are very quick behind the plate (we saw a few today) and sketchy mechanics -- some of that is because these guys are *amped up*. Trust me, I know that feeling. Hell, I had tears in my eyes when they played the anthem before my game last Friday I was so amped up knowing that my wife, kid, and a ton of other people were watching.

And these guys *are* volunteers. I don't expect to see all of them work at the same level as the HS/college guys I work with on a regular basis. Many of the umpires I met there last week work *nothing but* LL. A few have never worked on anything but a 60' diamond, even.

But looking good isn't hard *if* you want to work regionals or the LLWS. Not everyone will get to do those tourneys and that's OK. It's unlikely I'll ever get to WP even with a regional behind me. Only 16 umpires get to do it each year, after all.

I comprehend the notion that one should look good.

I comprehend the notion that at any game it looks better if all the base umpires are dressed alike - PU sometimes has a different shirt color even in MLB.

But as we have seen in various discussions, (and even above in this thread on ball bag color) styles and requirements vary across associations/states/whatever. So bashing another for having a different notion of "correct" is somewhat parochial.

I don't see anyone bashing someone else for having a different brand/style of chest protector, cup, shin guards, shoes, etc. Standared mask versus HSM - people choose what they wish with little objection. I guess then personal protection is up to the individual - unless of course you want to use a balloon - then you're an idiot/dweeb/smitty.

Acceptable jersey colors seem to vary by area/association too. Red seems to draw a lot of comment. Light blue was unacceptable for a few years but seems to be making a comeback. White shirts, ties, and jackets (see the ump-attire ad below) are nowhere to be seen (nice hats huh?)

So I guess the local "boss" sets the expectations. If he says a balloon is acceptable it's acceptable.

What should we do about the players. Pant lengths vary. Catcher1 has different equipment than catcher2. Batter6 has a mask on his helmet,but no one else does. The SS has a red glove. RF has a blue glove. Others have mostly brown but a couple have black gloves. OMG! What shall we do about these abhorent situations!?!?

Things vary . . it makes life better that way too.

And guys, from a manager/coach perspective - I do notice how you look as you walk in but at the end of the game what mattered is how did you umpire - not how did you look doing it.

And from you - why all the comments on how the LLWS guys are performing? I guess it plays a role . . . .

I don't know if you're referring to me or to everyone, but I'm not spending a lot of time talking about how the umpires perform. I could, but what's the point?

Once an umpire gets to a tournament, nothing is going to improve that umpire over the course of that week. All I can personally do is try to teach our local umpires the best I can and represent LL the best way I can when I'm personally selected. It'll be a while before that happens again now.

[spiritump]

the problem with little league umpires is that it does not matter how good you are (we all have seen at lot of SMITTYS out there)but how long you have been a Godd Old Boy that is who gets to go.

[Called3rdStrike]

I just want to know why Rich Ives continues to argue with us on appearance of an umpire?

[RichMSN]

I just want to know why Rich Ives continues to argue with us on appearance of an umpire?

Probably because he sees the umpire as somewhere on the LL food chain below the person that sells hot dogs.

[Dannytheman]

the problem with little league umpires is that it does not matter how good you are (we all have seen at lot of SMITTYS out there)but how long you have been a Godd Old Boy that is who gets to go.

I don't happen to agree with that. I look at it as a reward for years of volunteer service to LL. There is an evaluation process, and years of service is on there. But so is a lot more

[Jocko]

I just want to know why Rich Ives continues to argue with us on appearance of an umpire?

Because he's a rat who occasionally dons the uniform. My guess, and this is strictly speculation, is tha he hasn't invested the $ to not look smitty, but feels himself a good official. Hence, the argument on how look is unimportant. My $.02, and it ain't worth a dime.

[HokieUmp]

Love it 21 posts on attire and 1+ comment on mechanics. Priorities are set!

Part of the problem is - each and every year - if someone criticizes the LL crews on TV, the holy wars between the very-pro-LL crowd and the very-anti-LL crowd begin. Rich Ives and others will defend LL to the death, and others will blast LL to the death. In some ways, it's nice, because it's like the first blooms in spring, or swallows returning to Capistrano - a rite or tradition that never fades with time.

For me, LL has made its choices, and so have the guys that choose to follow it. But for the Big Show, you'd REALLY have to think they could enforce a standard. And given WP sold their rights for a BIG bag of cash, you'd think they could provide their 'volunteers' with the gear to enforce that standard. When the costs of some shirts/pants/bags amounts to nothing more than a rounding error for WP, it can only be labeled as either not giving a s--t or being crazy cheap with a buck.

Other than that? Since the ethos of the organization is "it's for the kids," the true (meaning, those what never take pay), lifelong volunteers will get the games for the most part. That's their decision. So they have to live with the results, good or bad.

[Jocko]

Watching highlights on ESPN, and I notice HP isn't moving for plays at the plate. He stayed behind the dish on every play they showed, some were whackers. Is there some reason LL umps don't go to 3BLE, or was this guy just lazy?

[mjr_2013]

I ump LL for pay and we have some of the best umps for this age level in the county... We also have some of the worst but that isn't the point.

As far as ball bags go, I love black, I'm iffy on navy, and I despise gray... That said, when I registered for MHSAA, their baseball dress code is navy or gray with navy or powder polo... I didn't like this but I bought two navy anyway. I will probably never wear gray because I think it looks Charles Barkley "turrible".

Expect to see my black bags in the selling category as soon as I get my lazy butt off the couch, dig them out of my bag and give them a wash.

[mjr_2013]

Watching highlights on ESPN, and I notice HP isn't moving for plays at the plate. He stayed behind the dish on every play they showed, some were whackers. Is there some reason LL umps don't go to 3BLE, or was this guy just lazy?

Just lazy. There is no excuse for bad positioning, even in LL.

[RichMSN]

I ump LL for pay and we have some of the best umps for this age level in the county... We also have some of the worst but that isn't the point.

As far as ball bags go, I love black, I'm iffy on navy, and I despise gray... That said, when I registered for MHSAA, their baseball dress code is navy or gray with navy or powder polo... I didn't like this but I bought two navy anyway. I will probably never wear gray because I think it looks Charles Barkley "turrible".

Expect to see my black bags in the selling category as soon as I get my lazy butt off the couch, dig them out of my bag and give them a wash.

I'll put our District's Top 5 up against any District in the country. All of us have worked a World Series for Little League and also work college baseball. 4 of the 5 of us worked a regional final at the LL level on the plate on TV and the fifth, quite frankly, got screwed. If you'd watch any of those games (I'm talking about the other 3 guys here, not me), you'd see some damned good umpiring, IMO.

The LLWS umpires are provided with full uniforms (shirts, hats, pants, jackets). They shold be provided with ball bags, but they are not -- those fit into the "bring your own" category just like you bring your own shoes and plate gear and belts. I was provided with the same at Bangor, ME last year for the Senior World Series. Unfortunately, the pants were altered incorrectly and since I had never worn those particular pants, they didn't fit exactly the way I would've liked. I did buy some extras and had them altered at home, so I used my own purchased pants and have never worn the provided ones. Then again, I'm super anal about those things. Hell, I even washed my own uniforms even though they provided an umpire washing service (they used bleach and they batched all the uniforms in one load and they didn't look great, so I watched the results the first night and decided to do my own).

You aren't going to take someone who hasn't been properly trained on how to take a play at the plate and turn him into a good umpire overnight. The selection process is this: The umpire applies. The District Administrator forwards the applications he wants to forward to the region. The region selects the umpires, sight unseen. For WP, I'm not sure if WP is involved with the process or not. Our region gets 2 umpires just about every year (once in a great while, we get three). Some umpires go because they are good umpires. Some go because they are the only people applying from a state or geography. Some go as a gold watch for many years of service. Some go because they are properly connected. How is this different from other levels (12 HS umpires go to state in WIsconsin every year and I wouldn't hire 6-8 of them to work a JV game -- but they have the right connections)?

[Jocko]

As expected. The politicos rule the roost. SSDD

[Dannytheman]

As expected. The politicos rule the roost. SSDD

Same as some politically connected assignors I have worked for. Volunteer/paid there is always crap in there somewhere. Rich MSN hit this straight on the head!

[dumbdumb]

Just like with MLB who has the most video's and Collegiate who have the second most, I wish we could get videos of LL to help us with proper mechanics and positioning and handling situations.

Do they make mistakes? Sure, just like each speed of play an umpire progresses to, there will be missed calls and positioning no matter what. These same mistakes on calls and positioning at all levels are being played out all over the country at each level of play, statistically, with the same amount of frequency based on the level of experience and competency of the umpires. Great umpires make the same bad calls and positioning as the not so great umpire, they just make them less often, assuming both the great umpire and lesser umpire have been trained the same in all areas.

Just remember, if you are one of the great umpires after all your training, be glad you were able to pick up everything better than the other guy so you get to progress up the ladder faster and get the better games if that is what you consider it all about, and maybe that is exactly what it is all about. Imagine if you busted your tail and everyone picked it up better than you and you were stuck with a lesser schedule, yet you are a good competent umpire. Sometimes that happens. Oh well. Maybe it is just the fact someone has more free time to give to their umpiring than the other guy, and that helps with a quicker and better advancement, as well as overall competency of umpiring. Many variables go into becoming a top umpire but just like with anything, there will be some better than others even if both work their a$$es off. Just be glad when all your hard work has paid off for you.

Once again, I just wish there were more videos for teaching purposes during the LL playoffs that are on TV.

[Dannytheman]

Let's all unionize. Yup, that'll stop all this crap of LL umps, paid umps and "I do this level and I do that?"

So of us a trying to grow the profession and recruit new umps. Others want to tear down those with less experience and those haven't been through "proper training."

Can we all agree there are differences in every part of the world and then get back to what's really important? Black, grey or blue bags?? :yippie:

[Jocko]

Panama/Canada right now. I normally don't care to watch LL, but I rained out today and there's no mlb on until later.

So I just saw a play I want to discuss.

Bases juiced 1 out. Infield grounder to F4 who plays the force at 2b. R3 scores, but U3 drops some kind of flag. Apparently, R3 left early and had to come back. Out stands. I see a potential storm if the play is E4 and R1 ends up at 3b. What do you do with R2 and R3 if R3 leaves early? Why not call R3 out for leaving early? 3BC asked for replay, HP says not reviewable. Whats the review criteria?

[Dannytheman]

Panama/Canada right now. I normally don't care to watch LL, but I rained out today and there's no mlb on until later.

So I just saw a play I want to discuss.

Bases juiced 1 out. Infield grounder to F4 who plays the force at 2b. R3 scores, but U3 drops some kind of flag. Apparently, R3 left early and had to come back. Out stands. I see a potential storm if the play is E4 and R1 ends up at 3b. What do you do with R2 and R3 if R3 leaves early? Why not call R3 out for leaving early? 3BC asked for replay, HP says not reviewable. Whats the review criteria?

http://www.littlelea...eplay2010WS.pdf

This is from 2010, but I am not aware of any changes.

[basejester]

Bases juiced 1 out. Infield grounder to F4 who plays the force at 2b. R3 scores, but U3 drops some kind of flag. Apparently, R3 left early and had to come back. Out stands. I see a potential storm if the play is E4 and R1 ends up at 3b. What do you do with R2 and R3 if R3 leaves early?

R3 "poofs". No run scores. No out is recorded. R2 moves to 3rd. R1 moves to 2nd.

Why not call R3 out for leaving early?

Because that's not the rule.

[Dannytheman]

I'm currently in chat if anyone is watching the Panama and Canada game at 1:20 EST.

I also think they need to move the fence back another 25 feet. To many home runs per game now!

[johnnyg08]

So far, I like this crew. Plate umpire is well spoken. I'm glad that he didn't go for help on the Catcher's Interference.