It is optional for the base umpire to carry an indicator if the field has a scoreboard

[JaxRolo]

I thought we already did. Thats why I posted my comment.

I don't think we have a conclusive answer yet. Some say true and some say false.

Haven't seen an actual citation yet.

[BT_Blue]

I thought we did get a ruling. That the book says PU has to carry one but there is nothing about the BU.

[mstaylor]

BT is correct, PU has to carry, BU is not mentioned. It says the PU "needs to have a ball/strike indicator." Page 7

It is optional for the BU to carry an indicator but the scoreboard portion is a red herring. So the answer is true up to point of the scoreboard.

[BT_Blue]

so is the answer true or false because sometimes they ask crazy stuff that voids the question and makes the answer something completely different.

[mstaylor]

I would say true, then complain it was a BS question if they say it's false.

[LeePitts]

Our manual for Alabama prohibits U2 from carrying an indicator.

[wvumpire1807]

I dont care if there is a scoreboard or not. When i am working the plate, my base umpire will not have an indicator in hand. And i as the base umpire, will not have an indicator in my hand either.

[BT_Blue]

I dont care if there is a scoreboard or not. When i am working the plate, my base umpire will not have an indicator in hand. And i as the base umpire, will not have an indicator in my hand either.

Why do you care if your BU uses an indicator. Just as long as he doesnt try and give you the count unless you ask him I dont see what its any concern of yours.

[mstaylor]

I dont care if there is a scoreboard or not. When i am working the plate, my base umpire will not have an indicator in hand. And i as the base umpire, will not have an indicator in my hand either.

That is a BS attitude. If I want to carry an indicator I will. If you want to ding me then ding away. If you don't want to carry one, fine. I don't understand the hated of carrying one. I understand dinging guys that stand there watching TV on the bases.

[johnnyg08]

I dont care if there is a scoreboard or not. When i am working the plate, my base umpire will not have an indicator in hand. And i as the base umpire, will not have an indicator in my hand either.

That is a BS attitude. If I want to carry an indicator I will. If you want to ding me then ding away. If you don't want to carry one, fine. I don't understand the hated of carrying one. I understand dinging guys that stand there watching TV on the bases.

I totally agree.

[JaxRolo]

I dont care if there is a scoreboard or not. When i am working the plate, my base umpire will not have an indicator in hand. And i as the base umpire, will not have an indicator in my hand either.

That is a BS attitude. If I want to carry an indicator I will. If you want to ding me then ding away. If you don't want to carry one, fine. I don't understand the hated of carrying one. I understand dinging guys that stand there watching TV on the bases.

I totally agree.

Me too +1

[noumpere]

I dont care if there is a scoreboard or not. When i am working the plate, my base umpire will not have an indicator in hand. And i as the base umpire, will not have an indicator in my hand either.

That is a BS attitude. If I want to carry an indicator I will. If you want to ding me then ding away. If you don't want to carry one, fine. I don't understand the hated of carrying one. I understand dinging guys that stand there watching TV on the bases.

I totally agree.

Me too +1

Add me to the list. I put it along the same lines as whether you wear a jacket or a long sleeve shirt behind the plate or whether you tuck your jacket or whether or not you crease your hat or whether or not your underwear has the exact same rips in it or whether or not you default to 90 degrees or two steps fair at first or whether you start in B or C in three man with R1 only ect. ect.

[UmpTTS43]

I do not allow any partner to carry an indicator while working the bases. They have a job to do, I have a job to do. My job is to keep track of the count. I can think of no plausible reason to carry one and have it possibly detract from their own responsibilities. Find me any college or pro game where the BU uses one. There are some conferences that may require U3 to carry one, but they put it in their pocket and leave it alone. If you want to work big boy ball and look like you know what your doing, leave it in the car. Nothing looks more smitty like than a BU looking at an indicator or even reaching in his pockets after every pitch to change it. My opinion of course, along with every other respected, trained umpire I know.

[mstaylor]

It may be the opinion of all the trained guys you know but that is not true accross the country. It is headed that way but I just don't understand why. Sure it started in the minors because they don't need them. Because we go to clinics run by minor league guys we have been taught to not carry one. But guess what I have taught by several of the guys at the new school and by at least one guy at Jim's school. They all say what they are teaching are SUGGESTIONS and to take all the information the instructors are giving us and use what works for us as individuals. Even in clinics they say they teach not to carry but do what works at the local level.

I can work without one but I spend half the game wondering what the count is. You say the base umpire has a job to do and it doesn't include knowing the count. So, do you use the open hand, closed hand on a D3K? How the hell can you help your partner if you don't care what the count is. I will give you that many working D1 do not use an indicator but most are doing three man so one guy is carrying. How is that reconcilled? Putting in your pocket and not using it is stupid. Pros that carry one, use it, not put it in their pocket.

I will again say that I have been doing this long enough that I will do what I feel is best. I will follow mechanics as taught but I will carry an indicator. If I go to a field and my PU TELLS me I WILL NOT carry, I will tell you to kiss my ass. If you say you prefer me not to, we will talk. I have worked D1, D3 and NAIA and never had a problem.

[BT_Blue]

In my training for our association I tell all the new guys to carry one. It will help keep them engaged into the game that they are not quite familiar with yet. This whole thing about YOU SHALL NOT and YOU WILL NOT is total BS! Only one that can tell me what to do and what not to do is my conference or state coordinator. Otherwise you can go suck an egg!

[Pops]

If I'm U2 in a 2-man game, and if my partner U1 loses the count, I will always be ready to help him if asked because I carry one and use it. I take games even if they're lower level, and some of my partners are fairly inexperienced. You have to help each other out or it can get ugly. I don't consider it beneath me to carry an indicator.

[catsbackr]

I have read many posts about BUs not carrying indicators. Quite frankly, I don't care if my partner is not carrying one. But I had a situation last year where I was PU and lost the count after a series of events (including taking a foul ball off the mask). The coach wanted the count, and I was unsure so I went to my partner who was clueless. He didn't feel it was his job to know the count. He definitely didn't have my back that day. So if you're not going to carry an indicator, at least keep your head in the game.

That is why you have an "official" book. Check with the scorekeeper for the count.

[Jeremy_UEFL]

Just make sure someone has the right count at all times....passed ball/wild pitch/stolen base/pick offs (and attempts) can distract you from the count if you are keeping it in your head only.

[Minnz]

I have read many posts about BUs not carrying indicators. Quite frankly, I don't care if my partner is not carrying one. But I had a situation last year where I was PU and lost the count after a series of events (including taking a foul ball off the mask). The coach wanted the count, and I was unsure so I went to my partner who was clueless. He didn't feel it was his job to know the count. He definitely didn't have my back that day. So if you're not going to carry an indicator, at least keep your head in the game.

That is why you have an "official" book. Check with the scorekeeper for the count.

Wow you put a lot of stock into the the "kid team manager" who is in the dugout keeping the home book. Good luck thinking they always know the count.

[Pops]

I have read many posts about BUs not carrying indicators. Quite frankly, I don't care if my partner is not carrying one. But I had a situation last year where I was PU and lost the count after a series of events (including taking a foul ball off the mask). The coach wanted the count, and I was unsure so I went to my partner who was clueless. He didn't feel it was his job to know the count. He definitely didn't have my back that day. So if you're not going to carry an indicator, at least keep your head in the game.

That is why you have an "official" book. Check with the scorekeeper for the count.

Wow you put a lot of stock into the the "kid team manager" who is in the dugout keeping the home book. Good luck thinking they always know the count.

My thoughts exactly. The kid keeping the scorebook probably isn't going to be reliable.

So, if you're out in the field, keep the count just in case...

[Cajuncubsfan]

If I'm U2 in a 2-man game, and if my partner U1 loses the count, I will always be ready to help him if asked because I carry one and use it. I take games even if they're lower level, and some of my partners are fairly inexperienced. You have to help each other out or it can get ugly. I don't consider it beneath me to carry an indicator.

The are older umpires here that don't want you to carry an indicator. With that being said I have found it easier for me to stay focused on the game if I don't carry one. It helps me stay focused. Hell my partner lost the count today and I was right there with it.

[yawetag]

First game this past week. I was on the bases. I carried an indicator, but kept it in my pocket. In one of the middle innings, I thought I had a count of 1-0; PU says "2 and 0". Batter ends up walking (on my ball 3). DM comes out and says "That's only ball 3!" PU calls a meeting with me and asks; I reply "I'm not using an indicator, but when you said it was 2-0, I thought I had 1-0." PU replies "Well, that makes two of you against me. I'll bring the batter back." OM didn't complain at all.

In short: I carry one, but don't use it. It's like a blanket for a little kid.

[MUAump2]

As an umpire who doesn't use an indicator (I'll have mine in my pocket on the stick), I see nothing wrong with a guy using an indicator on the bases, as long as he doesn't have his face buried in it the entire game. For me, not using one (both on the plate and bases) forces me to pay more attention and be more focused on the game. I have it in my pocket/ball bag, but it rarely comes out.

[MUAump2]

In addition to this response, I will ask the instructors at O.U.T.S. (see "Accomplishments and Milestones" topic Halfway through O.U.T.S for their names) and I'll let you know what they think.

[mstaylor]

Their answer should be yes on the plate, no on the bases.

For what I work, I carry one, I use it, I don't look at it, at least not often, and I don't care if my partners like it or not. I also don't care if my partner carries one on the bases or not. What I tell my guys, do what you feel comfortable until I get a nasty phone call about guys not keeping the count.