Bat Flip Ejections - How Not to Be Ejected for Flipping?

[Lindsay]

After umpires ejected UConn's Matt Malcolm and Penn State's Kyle Hannon, both for bat flips after hitting a home run, you asked us how a college player can avoid ejection for celebrating a big hit, and why bat flips have seemingly been deemed illegal by NCAA Baseball. Perhaps of equal importance is to consider why college baseball adopted the bat flip ejection rule in the first place.

Prior to the 2023 season, NCAA adopted rule 5-17: Unsportsmanlike Conduct, which states

Game personnel shall not use language that will, in any manner, refer to or reflect negatively upon opposing players, coaches, umpires or spectators. Any orchestrated activities by any player or dugout personnel designed to distract, intimidate or disconcert the opposing team or reflect poor sportsmanship shall not be allowed. This includes activities such as:

> Negative comments directed at an opponent, umpire or spectator.

> Bench jockeying.

> Bat flips near or toward an opponent or umpire.

> Use of props or signs directed at an opponent or umpiring decision.

The instruction to umpires appears to be one of strict scrutiny: interpret most bat flips as qualifying under this new sportsmanship rule 5-17. After all, an opponent (including the opposing dugout) or umpire is bound to be near a bat flipping player.

During a college baseball playoff game in 2016, a Miami player flipped his bat after a grand slam, resulting in a benches-clearing incident when defensive team Boston College responded with objection. Eight years later, the NCAA rules committee stepped in to address the bat flip issue, effectively finding that its member schools had been unable to address the problem on their own, requiring a sportsmanship intervention.

*An earlier version of this article's title contained the phrase, "How to not be ejected for flipping?" The author sincerely apologizes for exposing the reader to this reckless split infinitive. This careless error has been corrected.

Video as follows:

Alternate Link: Runner Gomes steps in front of fielding Adames, but ump no-calls the play

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[The Man in Blue]

How about this one?

 

 

[Jimurray]

20 minutes ago, The Man in Blue said:

How about this one?

 

 

That's an easy "time, pinch runner for him" chew his asss in the dugout" no ejection neccessary. But some college coaches have no gonads any more.

[SeeingEyeDog]

Spike the football...check.

Flip the NCAA bat...nope to the nope.

~Dawg

[Richvee]

On 3/19/2024 at 1:04 AM, SeeingEyeDog said:

Spike the football...check.

Flip the NCAA bat...nope to the nope.

~Dawg

Football players don’t get their panties in a bunch or want to fight the opposing team when their opponent scores and spikes a football. 
Flip a bat at the opponent, flex and yell something into their dugout, and the next thing you know there’s 64 kids on the field screaming and yelling at each other. They brought it on themselves. 

[SeeingEyeDog]

Lol...I will see you and raise you, @Richvee!

Flip the bat...nope!

Storm the basketball court...come on down!
~Dawg

[Jimurray]

33 minutes ago, Richvee said:

They brought it on themselves. 

Yes they did. NCAA wants umpires to do the coaches and AD's job. We take care of some stuff but we need to focus between the lines. If sht happens NCAA, NCAA umpire coordinator, rules person, whoever the f, should take action against the teams, coaches, ADs who should "educate" these "student athletes" about unsportsman like behavior. As it is any umpire who tries to head off incidents is castigated on social media with nary a peep from NCAA or his association that the action was appropriate and supported by them. I guess the money is good and needed by a lot of big division umps and their assignors because if they had cohones they would tell NCAA that they are not going to police sht that coaches are responsible for.

[Velho]

Where there is a will, there is a way. Hockey cut down their fighting (I think, I don't watch it anymore). Basketball took care of it with anyone leaving the bench is ejected (even if it's a single step).

 

 

[Jimurray]

32 minutes ago, Velho said:

Where there is a will, there is a way. Hockey cut down their fighting (I think, I don't watch it anymore). Basketball took care of it with anyone leaving the bench is ejected (even if it's a single step).

 

 

So it's not NCAA, it's NCAA baseball.

[beerguy55]

On 3/20/2024 at 8:50 PM, Velho said:

Where there is a will, there is a way. Hockey cut down their fighting (I think, I don't watch it anymore). Basketball took care of it with anyone leaving the bench is ejected (even if it's a single step).

Hockey (NHL - not sure how NCAA plays out) cut down on the fighting mostly organically, not through very much the league did through rule changes (instigator penalties, and "first player off the bench" rules aside).  They drastically cut down on bench clearing brawls through rules...mano a mano fights dropped on their own, through sound strategic decision-making about lineups.  

Simply put, for the most part NHL GM's and coaches realized that having a "goon" on their roster creates a hole in their lineup...meaning 5% of their roster is taken by a player who could fight, but could not score, skate, pass or defend against NHL caliber players.  Some 30 years ago, the talent pool was thin enough where you could afford to have a plug like this in your lineup, because there weren't great alternative options anyway...today, there are 500-1000 skilled players outside the NHL, just as talented as the bottom 150-200 that are on NHL rosters, and they're not boxing their way to a lineup (much like those MLB players who come from the Dominican Republic or Cuba say "you don't walk your way off the island")

And, for the top end skilled players who can/will fight, coaches would rather they not risk breaking their hand on someone's helmet/face.

Even with all that, fighting is still a (reduced) part of the game - either due to simple aggressive frustration, or to right a wrong the referees did not address - but still about 1 in 12 concussions for NHL players are caused by fighting.  No matter what lawyer/president Gary Bettman says, the NHL has not done "everything it can" to eliminate concussions...because that would mean doing everything it can to eliminate fighting...which some of the Neanderthals still want.

[BigBlue4u]

What are we missing in these NCAA bat throwing incidents?  If it's the first occurrence in a game the penalty is a warning:  5-17 PEN:  "The umpire shall warn the offending individual and the coach one time.  If the unsportsmanlike conduct continues after the warning, the offender shall be ejected." So, are we to assume the ejection in the bat throwing video, for example, follows an earlier warning for bat throwing.  Hummmmmmm.

[Biscuit]

3 hours ago, BigBlue4u said:

What are we missing in these NCAA bat throwing incidents?  If it's the first occurrence in a game the penalty is a warning:  5-17 PEN:  "The umpire shall warn the offending individual and the coach one time.  If the unsportsmanlike conduct continues after the warning, the offender shall be ejected." So, are we to assume the ejection in the bat throwing video, for example, follows an earlier warning for bat throwing.  Hummmmmmm.

The ejection is not for throwing a bat, it's for unsportsmanlike conduct. So, in some cases it may be preceeded by a warning for unaporting conduct, or it may be deemed to be inflammatory enough to be an ejection in its own right.

[BigBlue4u]

21 hours ago, Biscuit said:

The ejection is not for throwing a bat, it's for unsportsmanlike conduct. So, in some cases it may be preceeded by a warning for unaporting conduct, or it may be deemed to be inflammatory enough to be an ejection in its own right.

Biscuit,

5-17 PEN provides for a warning for unsportsmanlike conduct.  However, it is possible that the NCAA has told umpires that ANY bat throwing will be an ejection, previous warning or not.

[Biscuit]

On 4/3/2024 at 5:25 PM, BigBlue4u said:

Biscuit,

5-17 PEN provides for a warning for unsportsmanlike conduct.  However, it is possible that the NCAA has told umpires that ANY bat throwing will be an ejection, previous warning or not.

You can warn, for sure. In some of the cases that have been widely publicized, they were warned. But just like all unsportsmanlike conduct, a warning is not required, and sometimes should not be given, before ejecting. This has been a HUGE point of emphasis from the NCAA, especially this year 

[Velho]

On 4/2/2024 at 10:14 AM, beerguy55 said:

On 3/20/2024 at 7:50 PM, Velho said:

Where there is a will, there is a way. Hockey cut down their fighting (I think, I don't watch it anymore). 

Hockey (NHL - not sure how NCAA plays out) cut down on the fighting mostly organically, not through very much the league did through rule changes (instigator penalties, and "first player off the bench" rules aside). 

New information has come to light. I withdraw my statement.

https://apnews.com/article/rangers-devils-brawl-22e720cebcde0b7578d3458a2f29267a

[The Man in Blue]

Apparently they did that in 2012, also.