Missing a Touch; Is There a Point of No Return?

[MadMax]

 

I am looking for the correct umpire ruling from an incident that took place yesterday during a 50/70 LL game.  Situation;  1 out, man on second.  The batter steps to the plate and hits a HR.  During the celebration at home, the runner from second fails to touch home plate.  The kid who hit the HR comes behind him and touches home and scores.  The opposing team appeals the play and argues that the runner from second should be out and the kid who hit the HR must go back to third (they argued that this exact play happened during their playoffs last year and they researched the correct ruling 3 months ago) .  The umpire ruled that the kid from second was out and the run scored (I agree).  I have spoken to several other coaches and most of them agree with the umpire but there are several interpretations of the "passing the runner" rule.  Can you please cite the exact rule? 

 

Just out of curiosity, what if there were two outs?  Does the home run count if the appeal is successful?

 

Thanks to all, this is a great website.

 

Not enough research.

 

7.12 Unless two are out, the status of a following runner is not affected by a preceding runner’s failure to touch or retouch a base.

 

 

 

 

I am looking for the correct umpire ruling from an incident that took place yesterday during a 50/70 LL game.  Situation;  1 out, man on second.  The batter steps to the plate and hits a HR.  During the celebration at home, the runner from second fails to touch home plate.  The kid who hit the HR comes behind him and touches home and scores.  The opposing team appeals the play and argues that the runner from second should be out and the kid who hit the HR must go back to third (they argued that this exact play happened during their playoffs last year and they researched the correct ruling 3 months ago) .  The umpire ruled that the kid from second was out and the run scored (I agree).  I have spoken to several other coaches and most of them agree with the umpire but there are several interpretations of the "passing the runner" rule.  Can you please cite the exact rule? 

 

Just out of curiosity, what if there were two outs?  Does the home run count if the appeal is successful?

 

Thanks to all, this is a great website.

 

The BR did not "pass" R2. R2 crossed the plate (without touching it, I know), so he is assumed to have touched the plate until such time as an appeal is made.Once he 'crossed" the plate, he was no longer a runner.

 

 

 

These are replies from this post, and they got my brain thinking about an entirely plausible (and probably encountered) situation:

 

R1, less than 2 outs. Batter hits a HR. While rounding the bases, R1 misses 3B (for the sake of the hypothetical, let's say he misses this one... it could be he missed 2B). 3BC realizes R1 has missed the bag, and is calling out to R1 to come back and touch it. Let's pause for a second, and introduce a fork:

• A) R1 has not touched HP yet and BR has not touched 3B yet.

• B) R1 has touched HP by the time he hears his 3BC yelling to him, and realizes it's directed at him. BR has not touched 3B yet.

• C) R1 has touched HP and about to congratulate BR who has "touched 'em all" and is on the verge of stepping on HP when the 3BC or BR finally gets R1's attention to the missed touch at 3B.

 

In A, this is easily remedied by R1 coming back, touching 3B, and then proceeding to head to HP. BR may have to slow up and wait before touching 3B for R1 to accomplish his touch of 3B before proceeding.

 

What I'm most interested in is how B and C are accomplished, if there is a legal course of action. Obviously, the DT cannot make an appeal yet because the ball is still dead, and likely has not been given a new ball by the umpire to make live. Also, let's assume that R1 stays near the plate and does not return to the dugout. What has to happen?

[Chip]

In B and C, R1 can no longer cure his error. See 7.10(b) AR: "(2) When the ball is dead, no runner may return to touch a missed base or one he has left after he has advanced to and touched a base beyond the missed base."

[noumpere]

Agreed with Chip.  But, as an umpire you let it happen, and wait to see if the defense appeals.