Obstruction?

[Thunderheads]

Thank God I read the 'new posts' today or I would have added a 4th post on this subject ............

[scrounge]

Johnson's such a chump...he races in with his blindside "shot", such as it was, then does the fake "keep me back!" dance - he's not even trying to get around the guy nominally holding him back, just bouncing up and down. The meathead in me wouldn't mind one bit if one tails high and inside to him. And McCann too, just for good measure.

[Thunderheads]

I HAVE MERGED BOTH OF THE POSTS REGARDING THIS SUBJECT

[JaxRolo]

Personally I believe that it was a missed base.

 

Even if OBS was called he still needs to touch the base.

 

Even if the Umpires awarded the base the runner need to touch the base.

 

 

Braves missed an opportunity for an out.

[JaxRolo]

I take back the OBS. It was a HR so its a deal ball situation so no OBS is possible.

 

But I still think its is an appeal play that got missed by the Braves.

[JaxRolo]

Manny you have a Unique way of interpreting rules.

 

Not trying to be rude but you got this one wrong also.

[ricka56]

I don't understand why the "Obstruction/brawl/missed base" thread and the "Two wrongs make a right?" thread were merged. They weren't the same subject/issue. Now comments on one issue might be confused as a comment on the other.

[Thunderheads]

I don't understand why the "Obstruction/brawl/missed base" thread and the "Two wrongs make a right?" thread were merged. They weren't the same subject/issue. Now comments on one issue might be confused as a comment on the other.

It's the same play ....

 

Let me know what you want me to do ............I can see if I can UN-MERGE THEM

[ricka56]

It wasn't even the same game. One was the Braves/Brewers (Obstruction/missed HP)  and the other was the Phillies/Marlins (missed call at 2B/missed call at 1B).

[Thunderheads]

It wasn't even the same game. One was the Braves/Brewers (Obstruction/missed HP)  and the other was the Phillies/Marlins (missed call at 2B/missed call at 1B).

$hit!   Sorry, ..I'll see what I can do, ....I've asked Warren to help ..... I grabbed the wrong thread,...

 

I sincerely apoligize guys ....my fault

[ricka56]

This is the best case play of the 2013 season.

I don't think it is the best case play because I don't know what the umpires ruled. Obviously they didn't rule abandonment and they did EJ Gomez. But when did the umpires EJ Gomez? Did they adhere to 9.05(d) and allow Gomez the opportunity to touch HP before EJ'g him?

 

How are we supposed to give a correct ruling if we don't know where/when/if the umpire deviated from the rules.

[JaxRolo]

 

I don't understand why the "Obstruction/brawl/missed base" thread and the "Two wrongs make a right?" thread were merged. They weren't the same subject/issue. Now comments on one issue might be confused as a comment on the other.

It's the same play ....

 

Let me know what you want me to do ............I can see if I can UN-MERGE THEM

 

 

Jeff, looks like you also locked a thread that wasn't being discussed somewhere else.

 

The thread about the 3rd base rule.

[Thunderheads]

 

 

I don't understand why the "Obstruction/brawl/missed base" thread and the "Two wrongs make a right?" thread were merged. They weren't the same subject/issue. Now comments on one issue might be confused as a comment on the other.

It's the same play ....

 

Let me know what you want me to do ............I can see if I can UN-MERGE THEM

 

 

Jeff, looks like you also locked a thread that wasn't being discussed somewhere else.

 

The thread about the 3rd base rule.

 

RIGHT

[Texas Manny]

Manny you have a Unique way of interpreting rules.

 

Not trying to be rude but you got this one wrong also.

No I believe I did not.

 

No obstruction possible on dead ball.

 

Gomez should have been allowed to finish his home run trot, but they didn't allow for safety reasons. Why a PR was not allowed, I don't know but is allowable under the rules. (Maybe it was done, but not shown on any televised session or video).

 

Umpires awarded home plate to Gomez. Yes, under the rules even when an umpire awards a base, the runner(s) are still required to touch their bases, and an appeal could still be made on a missed bag, (exception: Missed bag on obstruction award cannot be appealed; see PBUC 7.27) however, in this situation, the umpires obviously gave it to him and said it's done to avoid any more issues.

 

Do you think that the Atlanta Braves would of missed this appeal situation? Talk about a "in your face" opportunity missed! If they could of appealed, they would have. No doubt.

 

How did I get this one wrong? If you are going to say I'm wrong, just don't say it. Tell me why.

[Texas Manny]

 

No appeal. The umpires awarded the run scored due to McCann blocking and the evident risk of having Gomez go back out and touch. Gomez was officially scored with a run scoring triple.

 

Not sure about that. According to the box score on MLB.com, Gomez has his 23rd home run.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/gameday/index.jsp?gid=2013_09_25_milmlb_atlmlb_1&mode=recap_home&c_id=atl#gid=2013_09_25_milmlb_atlmlb_1&mode=box

 

I was watching the game and the announcers (I know) said that the official scorer gave him a triple with a run scored. That was obviously changed. I did not watch the entire game.

[noumpere]

Isn't there a rule saying that if a batter hits a home run and is unable to round the bases, a pinch runner may be substituted for him?  I remember hearing this in the minors that somebody hit a home run and then fainted on his way to first, a pinch runner then finished his trip around the bases.  Could a pinch runner (or whoever his replacement was) have been put in to finish the last 30 feet?

 

 

 

 

You can put in a PR as you say but it wasn't needed here because they scored the run because if OBS is the proximate cause of a missed base then you can award the base without it being touched under the "any penalties" clause.  jmo of course

[Mudder]

Thats twice now in the last while the Braves have had issues with opponents admiring their home runs.  Where do they get off intentionally jumping in front of a guy like that while he's rounding the bases.  Retaliate with a bean ball on his next at bat the way everyone else does!

[ricka56]

 

Manny you have a Unique way of interpreting rules.

 

Not trying to be rude but you got this one wrong also.

No I did not.

 

No obstruction on dead ball.

Gomez should have been allowed to finish his home run trot, but they didn't for safety reasons.

Umpires awarded home plate to Gomez. Yes, under the rules even when an umpire awards a base, the runner(s) are still required to touch their bases, and an appeal could still be made on a missed bag, however, in this situation, the umpires obviously gave it to him and said it's done to avoid any more issues.

 

Do you think that the Atlanta Braves would of missed this appeal situation? Talk about a "in your face" opportunity missed! If they could of appealed, they would have. No doubt.

 

How did I get this one wrong? If you are going to say I'm wrong, just don't say it. Tell me why.

 

Why would the umpires have to award Gomez HP? He hit a HR, he was already awarded HP? What rule/interp can you use to allow the umpire to "Give it to him" ? Yes there would have been more problems bringing him back to touch HP before EJ'g him, but that is just a speculative problem. What rule/interp allows the umpires to forgo the HP touch requirement while making the missed base touch unappealable?

[noumpere]

 

Why would the umpires have to award Gomez HP? He hit a HR, he was already awarded HP? What rule/interp can you use to allow the umpire to "Give it to him" ? Yes there would have been more problems bringing him back to touch HP before EJ'g him, but that is just a speculative problem. What rule/interp allows the umpires to forgo requiring a touch HP without making it an appealable missed base?

 

 

See my post no. 41 about the proximate cause -- that's in one of the manuals I'm pretty sure.

 (And you might have posted while I was and not seen it)

 

Theres also a precedent that if fans rush the field you can award the bases.  edit to add: that's rule 4.90(b) COMMENT  Sure opponents aren't fans but it shows that it can be done.

[Rich Ives]

7.10(b)  " . . . The umpire shall then call “Time†and impose such penalties, if any, as in his judgment will nullify the act of obstruction."

 

He can do whatever he wants to do to fix it. This includes awarding the touch.

[ricka56]

But why would a PR be needed, gomez was physically able to complete his award. 9.05(d) says that the EJ comes after the play is complete. Even though this was all a deadball sitch, they could still allow Gomez to touch HP before the EJ. I don't think that threat of a riot can be used to justify not following the rules.

[ricka56]

Game management solution-UIC says to both managers, we can do this one of two ways. 1) No abandonment,  we bring Gomez out to complete his 4 base award before I eject him, the crowd trashes the field and we wait 15 minutes for the grounds crew to clean up the mess; or 2) Gomez stays in the clubhouse, the run scores, Atlanta agrees not to appeal the missed touch of HP and we can get back to baseball. If you guys can't agree, I'm going with option #1. You guys decide. Cooler heads prevail, managers agree on #2

[Haid D' Salaami]

Not sure why Freddie Freeman was tossed and Reed Johnson wasn't.

 

I'm surprised McCann stayed in the game also.[/quote

I think Gomez abandoned. Did they score the run? Manny, we need help here.

This is not an adandonment type play... he got ejected therefore he couldnt touch the plate... use 9.01c.. common sense and fair play... this is also not an dead ball obstruction either.

[Haid D' Salaami]

I'm saying Gomez ran in to McCann when he could have gone around him with no effort. McCann was on the foul line and Gomez had rounded third and his base path would have taken him by McCann but Gomez veered into a confrontation with McCann. He then could have disengaged and proceeded to HP. I have abandonment. I think my judgement is colored by Gomez demeanor. I would have loved to not score that run. Don't really know who the good guys or bad guys are here though.

i'm not sure you watched the play... do you think Gomez was gonna go around.. nope.. this is typical trashing talking at it's finest...

[mstaylor]

 

I'm saying Gomez ran in to McCann when he could have gone around him with no effort. McCann was on the foul line and Gomez had rounded third and his base path would have taken him by McCann but Gomez veered into a confrontation with McCann. He then could have disengaged and proceeded to HP. I have abandonment. I think my judgement is colored by Gomez demeanor. I would have loved to not score that run. Don't really know who the good guys or bad guys are here though.

i'm not sure you watched the play... do you think Gomez was gonna go around.. nope.. this is typical trashing talking at it's finest...

 

There was no way Gomez was doing a-n-y-t-h-i-n-g except stick his nose in the catcher's face.