Did he double him up? Voluntary release?

[noumpere]

 

 

Voluntary release can also mean "makes some other controlled movement with the ball not associated with the momentum of the catch / tag".  So in your ridiculous play once the fielder starts jogging under control to the mound any  release will meet the voluntary release portion of the catch.

 

 

 

 

Which is a complete contradiction from your earlier statements in this thread, as mstaylor has clearly pointed out that after tagging the bag, the guy then starts a new movement which causes him to lose control, yet you have somehow decided that this does not qualify as a voluntary release.

 

You should probably make up your mind which way you want to argue this point before you continue.  Don't worry, we'll all take a timeout and wait for you.

 

My previous posts are numbers 16 and 42 and don't contain any contradiction as far as I can see.  So either your reading comprehension needs improving or your quoting abilities need improving.  Don't worry, we'll all take a time out for you to figure out which it is.

[Fittske24]

After some conversation with a few of my contacts in AAA, here is some additional interp on Voluntary Release. Voluntary Release can be treated as a “subset†of “secure possession†meaning it is needed but not always required. If a play results in a CATCH and secure possession of the ball in hand or glove has been demonstrated, AND the momentum of the play has stopped, THEN Voluntary release is NOT needed to be considered a CATCH. However, if the “momentum†of the catch has not been completed and results in a ball that is dropped, or a ball that falls to the ground, THEN the ball must have done so as the result of the players Voluntary Release to be considered a completed CATCH.

 

 

In the OP, the momentum of the CATCH has not been completed when the fielder flips causing the ball to fall to the ground. Based on the above info, and since the momentum of the CATCH has not been completed, his release of the ball has to have been done so voluntarily for it to be a completed CATCH. If you ask me, I've never seen a player step on second, flip, then toss the ball with his glove toward short stop on purpose. IJS...

[noumpere]

Exactly what I was trying to say up above and I apologize for my sarcasm in post #76.

 

The question still remains though -- is the criteria for a "catch" needed on the play (to tag the base).  Some say yes, including me.  Some say no. 

[JaxRolo]

After some conversation with a few of my contacts in AAA, here is some additional interp on Voluntary Release. Voluntary Release can be treated as a “subset†of “secure possession†meaning it is needed but not always required. If a play results in a CATCH and secure possession of the ball in hand or glove has been demonstrated, AND the momentum of the play has stopped, THEN Voluntary release is NOT needed to be considered a CATCH. However, if the “momentum†of the catch has not been completed and results in a ball that is dropped, or a ball that falls to the ground, THEN the ball must have done so as the result of the players Voluntary Release to be considered a completed CATCH.

 

 

In the OP, the momentum of the CATCH has not been completed when the fielder flips causing the ball to fall to the ground. Based on the above info, and since the momentum of the CATCH has not been completed, his release of the ball has to have been done so voluntarily for it to be a completed CATCH. If you ask me, I've never seen a player step on second, flip, then toss the ball with his glove toward short stop on purpose. IJS...

Ken I think you and all your AAA buddies are completely wrong on this!!!    j/k

 

 

I can go go with that answer!

[Fittske24]

Exactly what I was trying to say up above and I apologize for my sarcasm in post #76.

 

The question still remains though -- is the criteria for a "catch" needed on the play (to tag the base).  Some say yes, including me.  Some say no. 

 

The CATCH is an element of the play which results in a TAG. in order for the TAG to be completed, the fielder must demonstrate that he is holding the ball securly and firmly. Since the first element of the play (which results in a TAG attempt) is the CATCH of the thrown ball, The CATCH  has to be satisfied before the TAG can be completed.