Rundown quiz

[maven]

Here's a play that happened in one of my games last week.

 

Rundown between 2B and 3B, no other runners. PU hustles down to 3B to help, and as he arrives, the runner turns to head toward 3B. The defense keeps running him there (not the standard play). PU is waiting till he turns to head to 2B to announce that he has 3B, but that never happens. The runner slides into 3B and is tagged near the base, pretty clearly out, right in front of PU.

 

Quiz for newer umpires: what happened next? What should have happened?

[mstaylor]

I'll stand in the library and wait for answers.

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[Thunderheads]

Wait, ....   Am I reading this right ?    Has PU arrived to help out with the run-down ( don't say pickle, Semper-Fi will have a coronary) at third base?

[Trakes2]

I'm going to venture a guess we have a "Safe" and an "Out" call  

[bam]

Standard mechanics have PU waiting until runner turns to 2d to announce "I'm here" or "I'm at 3rd".

So as PU is getting to 3rd and runner is retreating to 2d, PU should have said something.

If you've got a "safe" and an "out" you should probably get together and decide who had the best angle, have THAT umpire explain to both coaches what you've got, and listen to the loser gripe.

Standard mechanics have PU waiting until runner turns to 2d to announce "I'm here" or "I'm at 3rd".

So as PU is getting to 3rd and runner is retreating to 2d, PU should have said something.

If you've got a "safe" and an "out" you should probably get together and decide who had the best angle, have THAT umpire explain to both coaches what you've got, and listen to the loser gripe.

[Thunderheads]

Standard mechanics have PU waiting until runner turns to 2d to announce "I'm here" or "I'm at 3rd".

So as PU is getting to 3rd and runner is retreating to 2d, PU should have said something.

If you've got a "safe" and an "out" you should probably get together and decide who had the best angle, have THAT umpire explain to both coaches what you've got, and listen to the loser gripe.

Standard mechanics have PU waiting until runner turns to 2d to announce "I'm here" or "I'm at 3rd".

So as PU is getting to 3rd and runner is retreating to 2d, PU should have said something.

If you've got a "safe" and an "out" you should probably get together and decide who had the best angle, have THAT umpire explain to both coaches what you've got, and listen to the loser gripe.

you can say that again!

[grayhawk]

Since the runner never turned to head back to second base, PU is just window dressing on this play - it's all BU.  That's what SHOULD have happened.  Interested to hear what really happened.

[bam]

Since the runner never turned to head back to second base, PU is just window dressing on this play - it's all BU.  That's what SHOULD have happened.  Interested to hear what really happened.

OP states that as PU arrives, runner turns back to 3rd. HTBT but it sounds like PU was close enough to 3rd to verbalize before runner turned back.

[maven]

bam: newer umpire, are you? maven

[grayhawk]

 

Since the runner never turned to head back to second base, PU is just window dressing on this play - it's all BU.  That's what SHOULD have happened.  Interested to hear what really happened.

OP states that as PU arrives, runner turns back to 3rd. HTBT but it sounds like PU was close enough to 3rd to verbalize before runner turned back.

 

 

PU should not enter the rundown until the runner turns back towards 2B,  He should then enter the infield and announce, loudly, "Partner, I've got this half!" (or something similar).  He arrived as the runner turned towards 3B, so he did not have time to enter the rundown.  In other words, PU did everything right...so far...

[tldavis19]

If PU hasn't announced that he's there yet, he needs to keep his mouth shut on the call. It's BU all the way and his call until PU has announced his coverage of 3rd. Having said that if you have a double call, get together and talk to see who had the better angle. If PU does, then get the out and be prepared to have a talk with whichever coach gets the bad end of that deal. It's ugly, but the call's right and in postgame you need to discuss this with your PU.

[guyinaredhat]

Communication and timing is the key here .   If neither umpire has the quick trigger, the PU can  make eye contact with the BU , and communicate that he's got the call.   
 

[HeadHunterLA]

PU has arrived, he needs to announce he has that end of things.  In 25+ years of field work I have never had an issue here with the timing of this play.  Even if R1 is turning and heading back towards 3B, PU has to take control as the play happens "right in front" of PU.  How about just a little common sense thrown in with the proper mechanic.

[Mike Prince]

PU has arrived, he needs to announce he has that end of things.  In 25+ years of field work I have never had an issue here with the timing of this play.  Even if R1 is turning and heading back towards 3B, PU has to take control as the play happens "right in front" of PU.  How about just a little common sense thrown in with the proper mechanic.

 

This works unless he is tagged in the back (since the fielder is running him to 3B).

 

But in the case of the OP I would say that the PU should get out of dodge and head for home once he realizes that the runner never went back towards 2B and the BU still has the play.  As the OP stands, if the ball is thrown away at 3B (or some other mess) no one is covering the plate.

[mstaylor]

If the PU makes it but hasn't announced yet, he can hold his hand up to the BU and make the call. Not the best solution but a possibility.

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[maven]

OK, here's what happened: I was PU. Since the runner never headed back to 2B (stupid defense), I never had the opportunity to tell BU I was in position. But he saw me there, and saw the play right in front of me. Before making a call, I looked at him, saw his "You got this, right?" expression, so I took it. Since it was a pretty easy out call, no complaints. We were fortunate: if that runner had been safe or the play had been closer, it could have been a mess. maven

[bam]

Here's a play that happened in one of my games last week.

 

Rundown between 2B and 3B, no other runners. PU hustles down to 3B to help, and as he arrives, the runner turns to head toward 3B.

Somebody please explain to me how this runner ISN'T running toward 2d?

[maven]

Yeah, that's what I thought. Stupid defense... maven

[JHSump]

Yeah, that's what I thought. Stupid defense... maven

What was the age group?  Youngins are always doing something unusual, testing you realtime adaptability.

[noumpere]

OK, here's what happened: I was PU. Since the runner never headed back to 2B (stupid defense), I never had the opportunity to tell BU I was in position. But he saw me there, and saw the play right in front of me. Before making a call, I looked at him, saw his "You got this, right?" expression, so I took it. Since it was a pretty easy out call, no complaints. We were fortunate: if that runner had been safe or the play had been closer, it could have been a mess. maven

IMO you should either have announced that you were there even if the runner was coming toward third or waited to get there until the runner was running toward second.  The arriving and the announcing are to be done at the same time (or at least all as part of one move).  So go toward third and then take the final 3 or 4 steps or whatever as the runner is running toward second and announce it.

As it was you did half the mechanic and that caused the issue.

[umpire_scott]

OK, here's what happened: I was PU. Since the runner never headed back to 2B (stupid defense), I never had the opportunity to tell BU I was in position. But he saw me there, and saw the play right in front of me. Before making a call, I looked at him, saw his "You got this, right?" expression, so I took it. Since it was a pretty easy out call, no complaints. We were fortunate: if that runner had been safe or the play had been closer, it could have been a mess. maven

 

I'm lost as to the timing of this play.  If the runner stopped momentarily and then headed to third, but never went back towards second how was he not tagged out and when did you as the plate umpire find the time to get all the way down to third base?  This seems impossible if the runner never went back towards second.