Lindsay Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 Following a look at whether Brewers 1B Rhys Hoskins' block of Mets runner DJ Stewart was obstruction or not, we determine whether Hoskins' slide into Mets 2B Jeff McNeil satisfied the bona flide slide rule criteria relative to breaking up double play attempts. Of note, 2B Umpire Jonathan Parra made his MLB debut and was working his first major league game when the benches cleared as a result of Hoskins' slide and McNeil's reaction.Obstruction: In the bottom of the 2nd inning, Brewers catcher William Contreras threw to first base in an attempt to pickoff Mets baserunner R1 Stewart, with Milwaukee 1B Hoskins receiving the throw and appearing to place his left leg into runner Stewart's path, effectively blocking his access to first base. 1B Umpire Lance Barrett called the runner out, effectively no-calling potential obstruction as the retired runner complained that Hoskins was blocking the bag.Defined as "the act of a fielder who, while not in possession of the ball and not in the act of fielding the ball, impedes the progress of any runner," the new obstruction point of emphasis instructs umpires to call obstruction as in Official Baseball Rule 6.01(h)(1) or Type A when a fielder blocks the runner's path without possession of the ball unnecessarily, even if the fielder is in the act of fielding at the time.The goal is to crack down on fielders using the "act of fielding" defense to blatantly block runners' base paths when they distinctly do not need to occupy that space to receive the throw.Bona Fide Slide: In the top of the 8th inning, Brewers baserunner R1 Hoskins slid into second base on an infield ground ball and potential double play attempt. Hoskins slid through the base, but was able to keep his hand in contact with the second base bag, making contact with Mets 2B McNeil in the process, who took exception and whose reaction spurred both benches to briefly clear.After Replay Review, the Mets' challenge that Hoskins' slide was illegal was denied and the original call by 2B Umpire Parra of out and no slide violation was confirmed.The four criteria of a bona fide slide, as in OBR 6.01(j), are 1) begins the slide before reaching the base, 2) able and attempts to reach the base, 3) able and attempts to remain on the base, and 4) slides within reach of the base without changing pathway for the purpose of initiating contact with a fielder.Replay conclusively determined that R1 Hoskins satisfied all four criteria and, thus, engaged in a legal, bona fide slide.Note that in college and high school, Hoskins' slide may have violated the force play slide rule (FPSR doesn't exist in pro ball), given that Hoskins' failed to slide in a direct line between the two bases. NCAA Rule 8-4 governs FPSR cases and holds that "the runner’s entire body (feet, legs, trunk and arms) must stay in a straight line between the bases."Video as follows:Alternate Link: Did Hoskins Obstruct at 1B Before Sliding Into Jeff McNeil's Ankle?View the full article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 Great example of the difference between HS, NCAA and MLB slide rule. Illegal in NCAA- Legs/Buttocks/Torso not directly in line with the base Illegal in FED - Not in a direct line to the base, AND sliding past the bag and making contact with the fielder. Unfortunately, it's also why we hear crap when we call this exact slide Interference in HS. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tborze Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 12 hours ago, Richvee said: Great example of the difference between HS, NCAA and MLB slide rule. Illegal in NCAA- Legs/Buttocks/Torso not directly in line with the base Illegal in FED - Not in a direct line to the base, AND sliding past the bag and making contact with the fielder. Unfortunately, it's also why we hear crap when we call this exact slide Interference in HS. At the end of the video, Lindsay seems to imply that in FED, it is legal to over slide as long as it is in a direct line and you maintain contact with the base. I seem to recall an interp by Hopkins years back that affirms this. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senor Azul Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 Check out the NFHS online interpretations that would seem to indicate that it would be an illegal slide: 2000 FED online Situation 12 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 For those who can’t find it… SITUATION 12: R1 attempts to steal second base. F2, seeing he has no chance to throw out R1, does not attempt a throw. F4, who is standing behind second base to cover in case of a throw, is contacted by R1, who slid over the bag and contacts F4. RULING: R1 committed an illegal slide when he slid past the back edge of the base. Because he contacted a player during an illegal slide, he is called out. (8-4-2b penalty, 2-32-2c) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tborze Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 54 minutes ago, Richvee said: For those who can’t find it… SITUATION 12: R1 attempts to steal second base. F2, seeing he has no chance to throw out R1, does not attempt a throw. F4, who is standing behind second base to cover in case of a throw, is contacted by R1, who slid over the bag and contacts F4. RULING: R1 committed an illegal slide when he slid past the back edge of the base. Because he contacted a player during an illegal slide, he is called out. (8-4-2b penalty, 2-32-2c) A lot has changed since 2000. I thought there was a later interpretation on what sliding “past/beyond” the base meant. If not, what was the point of the diagram? Look at 2-25. Oversliding is the act of a runner who allows his momentum to carry him past the base so that the runner loses contact with it. (Paraphrasing) 2-32-2 c. The runner goes “beyond” the base Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 21 minutes ago, Tborze said: 2-32-2 c. The runner goes “beyond” the base Yes indeed. Atricle 2 A slide is ILLEGAL if: c. except at home plate, the runner goes beyond the base and makes contact with or alters the play of a fielder. 24 minutes ago, Tborze said: what was the point of the diagram? That's out of the NCAA rulebook. Not FED. NCAA allows sliding past the bag: 8-4-b Contact with a fielder is legal and interference shall not be called if the runner makes a legal slide directly to the base and in the baseline extended (see diagram). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 32 minutes ago, Tborze said: Look at 2-25. Oversliding Simply the definition of oversliding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UmpAgain Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 And you also get the out on the BR per FPSR, correct? -Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 42 minutes ago, UmpAgain said: And you also get the out on the BR per FPSR, correct? -Steve Correct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senor Azul Posted March 30 Report Share Posted March 30 Mr. Tborze, there was a change made to FED rule 2-32-2 in 2017. It allowed sliding runners at the plate to overslide and make contact with a fielder. Here's the rationale given in the online interpretations: ...The committee altered this rule since the physical design of home plate makes it difficult for a runner to break momentum on a slide as opposed to the other three elevated bases... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tborze Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 3 hours ago, Richvee said: Yes indeed. Atricle 2 A slide is ILLEGAL if: c. except at home plate, the runner goes beyond the base and makes contact with or alters the play of a fielder. That's out of the NCAA rulebook. Not FED. NCAA allows sliding past the bag: 8-4-b Contact with a fielder is legal and interference shall not be called if the runner makes a legal slide directly to the base and in the baseline extended (see diagram). @Senor Azul also Indulge me please. Over sliding and contacting a fielder or altering the play is illegal. True! Sliding past the base while still in contact with the base is illegal only if contact is made or the play is altered? If the answer is yes, then the slide itself is not illegal? So, if the slide is legal, how is it illegal? Maybe I’m under the impression that a few years ago FED put out an interpretation that leaned toward NCAA. @lawump maybe? It could have been regarding a pop up slide. With more turf fields now, this can become more commonplace than usual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 It’s the same as a pop up slide. You can pop up providing you don’t make contact or alter the play. You can slide past the bag providing you don’t make contact or alter the play. You can go in standing up if you don’t make contact the fielder or hinder the play. I’m not sure what else to tell you. 26 minutes ago, Tborze said: With more turf fields now, this can become more commonplace than usual. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tborze Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 So contact is illegal in FED. Got it! Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimurray Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 14 minutes ago, Tborze said: So contact is illegal in FED. Got it! Lol Hindering the fielder with an illegal slide or the absence of a legal slide is illegal in FED. What's interesting is that LL has not revised their LLGB and basically you can break up the DP in LL with a bona fide slide. Which should be the rule and was the rule even before OBR tightened it up. They always had the bona fide slide in their interps. The umps just never applied it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man in Blue Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 I'll write the minority report. I do not feel he satisfied #4. 4) slides within reach of the base without changing pathway for the purpose of initiating contact with a fielder. We can't see it all, so I am apt to be wrong, however . . . his path coming in is NOT to the base, it is inside the base (within reach, granted) and directly toward the fielder with no intent to go into the base. If his intent was to go into the base, his foot would not be well past the base before he touched the base. He did the same thing as last time, he was just within reach this time. He still changed pathways and went directly after the fielder. We don't get the benefit of his post-game interview, but that removes any doubt I may have had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richvee Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 1 hour ago, Tborze said: So contact is illegal in FED. Got it! Lol Yeah. That’s exactly what I’m saying 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin_K Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 19 hours ago, Tborze said: So contact is illegal in FED. Got it! Lol 17 hours ago, Richvee said: Yeah. That’s exactly what I’m saying Contact is not illegal. Illegal contact is illegal. A runner can make contact with a fielder at a base as long as the slide is legal. If the slide is directly between the bases and the runner's feet are below the knee of the fielder when contact is made, there is no interference on the runner. If any aspects of 2-32-2 are present, however, the slide is illegal and the contact cis illegal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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