Not Running on Dropped 3rd Strike

[Mudder]

OBR, 12 year olds, no runners, uncaught swinging strike 3, batter begins to walk away thinking he is out, but is not walking directly to his 1st base side dugout, instead he is just kind of walking towards 1B, about 2ft into foul territory, takes about 6 or 7 steps finally hears the coach yelling "run to 1st!" and takes off to 1B, F3 mishandles the throw from F2 and batter/runner is safe.

 

Technically he left the "dirt circle surrounding the plate" (although there is no grass on this diamond), but he was not on his way back to the dugout, he was walking up the line towards 1st, then took off to run.

 

Did I handle it correctly, or should I have called the batter out for leaving the dirt circle?

[noumpere]

Out if hes not advancing by the time he leaves the dirt circle

[Mudder]

Out if hes not advancing by the time he leaves the dirt circle

 

This is what's confusing for me, he is "advancing" to 1B when he leaves the dirt circle, albeit not intentionally as he is just walking in that direction.

[maven]

If he's walking toward 1B, then it's sufficiently intentional for purposes of this rule.

 

On an uncaught 3rd strike in a situation where the BR can run, I always signal "safe" and verbalize "No catch!" That can help trigger the thought that they can run, and can help trigger the thought in F2 that he can tag the BR or throw down.

[HeadHunterLA]

Safe all day.

[semper_fi_72]

OBR, 12 year olds, no runners, uncaught swinging strike 3, batter begins to walk away thinking he is out, but is not walking directly to his 1st base side dugout, instead he is just kind of walking towards 1B, about 2ft into foul territory, takes about 6 or 7 steps finally hears the coach yelling "run to 1st!" and takes off to 1B, F3 mishandles the throw from F2 and batter/runner is safe.

 

Technically he left the "dirt circle surrounding the plate" (although there is no grass on this diamond), but he was not on his way back to the dugout, he was walking up the line towards 1st, then took off to run.

 

Did I handle it correctly, or should I have called the batter out for leaving the dirt circle?

What is the width of the running lane outside of the 1B foul line?

3 feet that should start halfway to 1B.

So how can you consider abandonment if he is 2 feet outside the line only 6 or 7 steps up the line?

You handled it correctly.

[Dannytheman]

In Little League 12's Majors, he is safe.

6.05 (b) Approved Rulling note.

[th3]

in LL he can run to 1st as long as he hasnt entered dugout or team area, right? How about FED?

[Dannytheman]

in LL he can run to 1st as long as he hasnt entered dugout or team area, right? How about FED?

Yup on LL.

[noumpere]

in LL he can run to 1st as long as he hasnt entered dugout or team area, right? How about FED?

Also dugout.  NCAA is dirt area.

[noumpere]

The rule:

Rule 6.09(b) Comment: A batter who does not realize his situation on a third strike not

caught, and who is not in the process of running to first base, shall be declared out once he leaves the

dirt circle surrounding home plate.

 

In your play he was not "in the process of running to first" when he left the circle.  Out.

[Dannytheman]

We truly need to make a committee to get all these rules to be the same!!!  I nominate Jim.

 

LL is different from Cal Ripkin, and Cal is different from OBR which has variants on FED,not to even mention NCAA.   Soooooo confusing.

[Pete Peterson Sr]

We truly need to make a committee to get all these rules to be the same!!!  I nominate Jim.

 

LL is different from Cal Ripkin, and Cal is different from OBR which has variants on FED,not to even mention NCAA.   Soooooo confusing.

 

 And here lies the body of the BRD.... dead from having no market, lol.

[Mudder]

 

On an uncaught 3rd strike in a situation where the BR can run, I always signal "safe" and verbalize "No catch!" That can help trigger the thought that they can run, and can help trigger the thought in F2 that he can tag the BR or throw down.

 

So do I, but at younger age levels we all know some kids are clueless, and get the deer in the headlights look on their faces with everyone yelling at them, some catchers as well.

[JaxRolo]

The rule:

Rule 6.09(b) Comment: A batter who does not realize his situation on a third strike not

caught, and who is not in the process of running to first base, shall be declared out once he leaves the

dirt circle surrounding home plate.

 

In your play he was not "in the process of running to first" when he left the circle.  Out.

 

Safe!  Walking to first is a slow method of running.

[umpcoachfather]

OUT!!!!  strikes and outs make the game go quicker. 

Seriously if he is doing anything that remotely resembles movement toward 1st base, im giving him the benefit of the doubt, in this instance, banging him out would have led to a ^$*& storm. 

[maven]

Safe!  Walking to first is a slow method of running.

That's kind. My running is sometimes confused with walking.

[clawdad]

 

in LL he can run to 1st as long as he hasnt entered dugout or team area, right? How about FED?

Yup on LL.

 

FED is similar to LL:

 

Case book 7.4.1 Situation A

 

".....he is out if he gives up by entering the bench or dugout area."

[MadMax]

 

in LL he can run to 1st as long as he hasnt entered dugout or team area, right? How about FED?

Also dugout.  NCAA is dirt area.

 

 

NCAA is "dirt area" because in some of these stadiums, the dugouts are a mile away! Did you watch the Witchita State vs. Illinois State NCAA tournament play-in game? This kid strikes out, and the camera tracks him back to the dugout... I kid you not, the dugout didn't come into frame for a good two minutes.

 

Okay, I exaggerate, a minute.

 

I had (incorrectly) instituted a "dirt circle area" rule into my ground rules after having to react and rule on a kid sulking after a dropped third strike and headed to his dugout, only to have him confronted by every coach and teammate and a Chinese Fire Drill break out while he tried to finally dash to 1B. From my vantage, I couldn't completely discern whether or not a coach had made contact with him to propel him that way, since I had taken my eye off of him completing my lawnmower pull, and then looking back to the backstop to see what was taking the catcher so long (did the ball go under the fencing?). So I ruled that he had already conceded he was out.

 

Prior to a game start-up at CDP, my fellow umpires on my crew (we ran 3-4 man every day, we had that good of a crew) corrected me that it's until the batter retires to the dugout, as per OBR (i.e. Major League rules) and NFHS, which apply at CDP in lieu of their specific rules set.