What would you do?

[James Walker]

I had a 14u scrimmage game on Monday. One of the coaches was an umpire (smitty is more like it) that I got rid of due to discipline reason, so I've already got a bad rep with this guy. In the third inning, his pitcher had a 4 pitch walk ( no where near the dish), then started plunking batters ( not on purpose). After the 5th one, he calls time and goes to speak with his pitcher. I go out and tell him we need to talk. And this is how it went...

Me: alright coach, he's plunked 5 in a row. Will you please pull your pitcher? I just don't want to see anyone hurt.

Coach: ummm, no. He's all I got left.

Me: coach, pull him or John and I are leaving.

After our "exchange" he pulled him. There were no other problems and the game went pretty quick after that. I know I over stepped my bounds a little, but this kid was throwing in the low to mid 80's with very little control. And honestly, I was scared for the safety of these kids. So, is this a situation where I could use 9.01c? How would you have handled it differently?

[th3]

I would never do that - and if I were the coach I would call your bluff

[JaxRolo]

If it's just a scrimmage you might get away with it. But I would not try it in a real game.

[alex7]

"So, is this a situation where I could use 9.01c?"

 

Doubt it.  That mainly covers weird situations that might arise in the game that no rules cover.  

 

I'll edit it to agree with bam below.  Just assume after the first few that one of the HBPs was on purpose and get him off the mound.

[bam]

After he refused - "Okay coach, this is your warning.  The next time he hits someone, he's gone."  Warn the other bench as well. 

 

You probably should have warned after the third HBP. 

[Thunderheads]

naw...I'd never say that ....but here's why .........

 

scrimmage = dead time stop (on my watch) ....if he wants to waste time with a pitcher who can't hit water if he fell out of a boat, ...sobeit ...easy to call balls and strikes and you're just getting closer to the time-limit

[Rich Ives]

After he refused - "Okay coach, this is your warning.  The next time he hits someone, he's gone."  Warn the other bench as well. 

 

You probably should have warned after the third HBP. 

 

He already said it wasn't intentional so where's your basis for this approach?

[semper_fi_72]

I had a 14u scrimmage game on Monday. One of the coaches was an umpire (smitty is more like it) that I got rid of due to discipline reason, so I've already got a bad rep with this guy. In the third inning, his pitcher had a 4 pitch walk ( no where near the dish), then started plunking batters ( not on purpose). After the 5th one, he calls time and goes to speak with his pitcher. I go out and tell him we need to talk. And this is how it went...

Me: alright coach, he's plunked 5 in a row. Will you please pull your pitcher? I just don't want to see anyone hurt.

Coach: ummm, no. He's all I got left.

Me: coach, pull him or John and I are leaving.

After our "exchange" he pulled him. There were no other problems and the game went pretty quick after that. I know I over stepped my bounds a little, but this kid was throwing in the low to mid 80's with very little control. And honestly, I was scared for the safety of these kids. So, is this a situation where I could use 9.01c? How would you have handled it differently?

Would never do this.

This is not Umpiring and you have crossed the boundary line.

You call Balls, Strikes, Safe, Out, Fair, Foul.

Stay out of Coaching.

Do you want them to tell you how to Umpire.

Hey Blue, unless you start calling a better game, I am pulling my team off the field.

You basically did the same thing to the coach.

[Magic]

I had a 14u scrimmage game on Monday. One of the coaches was an umpire (smitty is more like it) that I got rid of due to discipline reason, so I've already got a bad rep with this guy. In the third inning, his pitcher had a 4 pitch walk ( no where near the dish), then started plunking batters ( not on purpose). After the 5th one, he calls time and goes to speak with his pitcher. I go out and tell him we need to talk. And this is how it went...

Me: alright coach, he's plunked 5 in a row. Will you please pull your pitcher? I just don't want to see anyone hurt.

Coach: ummm, no. He's all I got left.

Me: coach, pull him or John and I are leaving.

After our "exchange" he pulled him. There were no other problems and the game went pretty quick after that. I know I over stepped my bounds a little, but this kid was throwing in the low to mid 80's with very little control. And honestly, I was scared for the safety of these kids. So, is this a situation where I could use 9.01c? How would you have handled it differently?

Would never do this.

This is not Umpiring and you have crossed the boundary line.

You call Balls, Strikes, Safe, Out, Fair, Foul.

Stay out of Coaching.

Do you want them to tell you how to Umpire.

Hey Blue, unless you start calling a better game, I am pulling my team off the field.

You basically did the same thing to the coach.

 

Yeah what he said. Not my business to tell a coach how to coach. Not going to grab the $hitty end of the stick.

[bam]

After he refused - "Okay coach, this is your warning.  The next time he hits someone, he's gone."  Warn the other bench as well. 

 

You probably should have warned after the third HBP. 

 

He already said it wasn't intentional so where's your basis for this approach?

 

When he hits three in a row, I'm done trying to determine if it's intentional or not.  It's intentional, period.  Warn both benches, because next half-inning someone's going to get plunked.  I know rats are as rats do, but if you want a beanball war in your game, have at it.  It's not happening on my watch. 

[Jocko]

I'd do a Captain Insano on the stupid coach for not having a bullpen

[semper_fi_72]

 

After he refused - "Okay coach, this is your warning.  The next time he hits someone, he's gone."  Warn the other bench as well. 

 

You probably should have warned after the third HBP. 

 

He already said it wasn't intentional so where's your basis for this approach?

 

When he hits three in a row, I'm done trying to determine if it's intentional or not.  It's intentional, period.  Warn both benches, because next half-inning someone's going to get plunked.  I know rats are as rats do, but if you want a beanball war in your game, have at it.  It's not happening on my watch. 

If you determine it is Intention, then why would you warn?

If you are going to determine it is Intentional then EJ the F1 and the HC/Manager.

Otherwise you can not predict what may or may not happen in the next half inning.

We hold indicators in our left hand and don't have a crystal ball in our ball bags.

Umpire the game and leave the Tarot Card reading to the professional Psychics.

[bam]

 

 

After he refused - "Okay coach, this is your warning.  The next time he hits someone, he's gone."  Warn the other bench as well. 

 

You probably should have warned after the third HBP. 

 

He already said it wasn't intentional so where's your basis for this approach?

 

When he hits three in a row, I'm done trying to determine if it's intentional or not.  It's intentional, period.  Warn both benches, because next half-inning someone's going to get plunked.  I know rats are as rats do, but if you want a beanball war in your game, have at it.  It's not happening on my watch. 

If you determine it is Intention, then why would you warn?

If you are going to determine it is Intentional then EJ the F1 and the HC/Manager.

Otherwise you can not predict what may or may not happen in the next half inning.

We hold indicators in our left hand and don't have a crystal ball in our ball bags.

Umpire the game and leave the Tarot Card reading to the professional Psychics.

FED rules - 6-2-3

 

ART. 3 . . . Intentionally pitch close to a batter. PENALTY: The pitcher shall be ejected if the act is judged to be  intentional. In

case of doubt, the umpire may first warn the pitcher.

 

I know you're trying get to about 50 EJs this year, but I'm cutting them some slack. 

 

Edited - You're launching the HC/Manager to pad those stats?

[sdix00]

"After three HBP, it is intentional"

 

Agree.

 

Failure to act is just as intentional as acting.  A warning here puts you in a defensible position.  

 

"I warned HTM that one more HPB and F1 would be EJd. HTM left F1 in the game. F1 hit a fourth batter. EJ."

[NFUA_44]

Its game mgmt. Once he hits the third one just issue the warning to both sides. If his HC can't figure out that its time to lift him that's his problem. The warning and EJ are the Only tools in our bag. Never ever give a coach a "suggestion" about lineups or subs. Issue the warning and move on, its not that tough.

[James Walker]

"After three HBP, it is intentional"

 

Agree.

 

Failure to act is just as intentional as acting.  A warning here puts you in a defensible position.  

 

"I warned HTM that one more HPB and F1 would be EJd. HTM left F1 in the game. F1 hit a fourth batter. EJ."

Didn't think about it like that. If it were a real game, I wouldn't have said anything. But it was a scrimmage, so I was trying to keep someone from getting hurt.

[NFUA_44]

"After three HBP, it is intentional"

Agree.

Failure to act is just as intentional as acting. A warning here puts you in a defensible position.

"I warned HTM that one more HPB and F1 would be EJd. HTM left F1 in the game. F1 hit a fourth batter. EJ."

Didn't think about it like that. If it were a real game, I wouldn't have said anything. But it was a scrimmage, so I was trying to keep someone from getting hurt. I. Failed to read the OP all the way thru. Scrimmage, no biggie, talk to him but try avoid suggesting a remedy if possible. As semper pointed out earlier we don't want them feeling like they can make suggestions about umpiring, we should refrain from the same.

[bam]

Didn't think about it like that. If it were a real game, I wouldn't have said anything. But it was a scrimmage, so I was trying to keep someone from getting hurt.

 

#1 - no good deed goes unpunished

 

#2 - treat scrimmages with the same respect as games.  They're our only opportunity to practice. 

[carolinablue]

So you force him to take him out or worse toss F1 for unintentionally throwing at a batter. The next guy is worse than the other. What do you do now? We are umpires.

[bam]

I deemed it intentional.

 

What's YOUR idea?  "Gee coach, I know he hit your last 5 guys, but he really didn't mean to".  Get ready to toss him.

 

If that sentence ever got back to my assignor, I'd have some serious 'splainin to do.  

 

So that one is out.

 

Get ready to start pulling kids out of a pile.  Here you go:  

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UbR2xtsBQo&feature=share

 

have fun

[carolinablue]

That's certainly a bad situation but what does that have to do with this thread? This was an intentional act by the catcher not a wild pitcher.

 

Hey Rich or anybody else, didn't LL have some type of wild pitcher rule years ago?

[mstaylor]

It did not, process probably some local crap Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

[semper_fi_72]

FED rules - 6-2-3

 

If you determine it is Intention, then why would you warn?

 

If you are going to determine it is Intentional then EJ the F1 and the HC/Manager.

Otherwise you can not predict what may or may not happen in the next half inning.

We hold indicators in our left hand and don't have a crystal ball in our ball bags.

Umpire the game and leave the Tarot Card reading to the professional Psychics.

 

ART. 3 . . . Intentionally pitch close to a batter. PENALTY: The pitcher shall be ejected if the act is judged to be  intentional. In

case of doubt, the umpire may first warn the pitcher.

 

I know you're trying get to about 50 EJs this year, but I'm cutting them some slack. 

 

Edited - You're launching the HC/Manager to pad those stats?

Wow

 

So I had a couple of EJs recently and your going to say I am looking to get to 50 this year.

I probably have less EJs to game ratio then you do in your life.

 

Also make up your mind if there is doubt or not.

 

I will put my game management and on field professionalism against yours any day.

Maybe that is why I don't have problems like you have on the field.

[gnhbua93]

It''s not the quantity is the quality in anything umpiring, games  that you officiate or ejections.

[bam]

FED rules - 6-2-3

 

If you determine it is Intention, then why would you warn?

 

If you are going to determine it is Intentional then EJ the F1 and the HC/Manager.

Otherwise you can not predict what may or may not happen in the next half inning.

We hold indicators in our left hand and don't have a crystal ball in our ball bags.

Umpire the game and leave the Tarot Card reading to the professional Psychics.

 

ART. 3 . . . Intentionally pitch close to a batter. PENALTY: The pitcher shall be ejected if the act is judged to be  intentional. In

case of doubt, the umpire may first warn the pitcher.

 

I know you're trying get to about 50 EJs this year, but I'm cutting them some slack. 

 

Edited - You're launching the HC/Manager to pad those stats?

Wow

 

So I had a couple of EJs recently and your going to say I am looking to get to 50 this year.

I probably have less EJs to game ratio then you do in your life.

 

Also make up your mind if there is doubt or not.

 

I will put my game management and on field professionalism against yours any day.

Maybe that is why I don't have problems like you have on the field.

You're sooo easy. If I can get your hackles up on an Internet thread, then I can probably guess how you're going to act on the field.

"Make up your mind if there's doubt"? That's the entire point. There IS doubt, but I'm not turning this I to a SH*#show because some kid is going to be a complete a-hole. I say this sometimes and everyone goes "Whoa, Dude, don't get so uptight." But what the F*^K is the matter with you? It's just some little ass-wipe12 year old. He's trying to get a reaction. If you want to teach him a lesson, there are better ways to do it.