Base Umpire Calls Foul Ball after Batted Ball Hits Batters Foot!

[gaman1974]

I would like to know what Page in the NFHS Umpire Manual or Rule Book or Little League Umpire Manual or Rule Book where it talks about  how the Base Umpire is allowed to call a Foul Ball when a Batted Ball hits a Batters Foot while he is still in the Box. I called a Foul Ball that hit a Batters Foot and My Plate Umpire was Blocked.....

 

Thanks

[Thunderheads]

The Home School coach yelling about who's call it is.

Oh, ok, .... it doesn't "read" that way

[Sayhey]

It looked like the winning run had just scored on a wild pitch with the bases loaded. Only problem was, the batter swung and fouled the pitch off his thigh. The U.I.C. missed the foul ball because he was partially blocked by the catcher trying to glove a wild pitch up high. The infield was in and I was behind the infield in a 3 man crew.

I knew the pitch was fouled and we had time and a foul ball. I waited for the U.I.C. to call time. When he did not. The first base umpire and I both called time. The winning run was placed back on third base. You are a crew. If the U.I. C. calls a runner out at home and the ball is laying on the ground you have to act. You umpire as a crew. Coaches need education on how a crew works together

[dddunn3d]

It looked like the winning run had just scored on a wild pitch with the bases loaded. Only problem was, the batter swung and fouled the pitch off his thigh. The U.I.C. missed the foul ball because he was partially blocked by the catcher trying to glove a wild pitch up high. The infield was in and I was behind the infield in a 3 man crew.

I knew the pitch was fouled and we had time and a foul ball. I waited for the U.I.C. to call time. When he did not. The first base umpire and I both called time. The winning run was placed back on third base. You are a crew. If the U.I. C. calls a runner out at home and the ball is laying on the ground you have to act. You umpire as a crew. Coaches need education on how a crew works together

RE: the bolded, underlined, italicized above... I hope you do not mean that the BU should come running into the scene yelling "No, the runner's safe, the ball's on the ground!" or some such nonsense.

[johnnyg08]

Thanks for all the answers but would any one fo you know where in the NFHS Umpire Manual or Rule Book it would be under,as I don't have a PBUC Manual

 

My NFHS umpire manual is in a landfill somewhere.  

 

Just take the advice of the people on here w/ the professional mechanics they're citing for you.  Hint:  they're right.  

[JaxRolo]

Thanks for all the answers but would any one fo you know where in the NFHS Umpire Manual or Rule Book it would be under,as I don't have a PBUC Manual

 

My NFHS umpire manual is in a landfill somewhere.  

Recycle man!!!!

[jmpnjmy]

 

Thanks for all the answers but would any one fo you know where in the NFHS Umpire Manual or Rule Book it would be under,as I don't have a PBUC Manual

 

My NFHS umpire manual is in a landfill somewhere.  

Recycle man!!!!

I gave mine to my daughter for a paper mache project

[Bumps]

I actually had this happen in a JV game yesterday. I am in C, fould ball off the leg, I wait for PU to call it, he didn't, so I did. Having said that, after reading the rest of this topic, I called the wrong thing, as I did call, "foul ball." Defensive coach came out asking how / why I made the call, told him I clearly saw it, got him in the leg. He was not thrilled but accepted it and back to the dugout. In post game we discussed the play and PU was appreciative I made the call, he was blocked.

We had not pre-gamed this, so another lesson learned for pre-game talking points.

[plateumpire]

Well that is Good to hear and Very Helpful Reading Material I will check and See if Georgia Does the same as I know the Local Association doesn't..I know I called my Local Little League/Home School Baseball U.I.C this morning and I told him and he said that he wants us to Follow the Pro Method and to Give the Plate Umpire the Chance to catch it but if not for the Base Umpire to Speak Loud and say"Foul,Ball hit batter in the Box" and that his thinking was because we play under time limits calling time on a play like that and my partner and me needing to spend time to get together takes away from Playing time and just for us to make sure we saw it hit the batter in the box and don't worry if the coach yells out that it's not my Call,to approach the coach and explain that it is your call and re-iterate to the coach to not yell out and to call time as instructed at the plate conference and to approach the umpire who made the call and calmly discuss it and that yelling out and acting a fool will not be tolerated...You know I have been calling ball for 13yrs and never had a coach question that it's not a base umpires call and thats what started me investigating this matter in detail and this coach acted a fool and I had to eject him after he refused to go to his bench and he covered Home plate with a bunch of dirt and threw 3rd base into the stands..(Quite Classless if ya ask me)..and the Home School Director approached me and my partner after the game and started yelling at us it wasn't my call and that no base umpire can see that call..but my U.I.C did say that he had a conversation with the Director and the Coach and covered with them it is our call and thats why their is two of us out their..Like I said it was quite something new I had incountered before and I think part of the problem is that as an umpire you won't see that Problem with Public H.S. Coaches because they are made to take the same classes as umpires in GHSA where Home School and Little League will let anyone coach,rather they know the rules or not..Well take care Big Red and good luck out their as well

That was homeschool? That is sad that they would act like that. I actually was homeschooled and I played baseball in a homeschool league. We didn't actually have games, but a lot of the time they are respectful people. That makes me sad they would do that.

[bam]

So I am looking forward to seeing this Duche Bag on Saturday and I will play it cool,but between you and I, he is gonna be on a very,very short leash

 Between you and me, this attitude is the worst to have as an umpire. If you have any aspirations in moving up in officiating, my advice is for you to learn that incidents on the field are water under a bridge. Changing your style toward a coach due to past incidents will only make you look like a fool. The same goes for him, too -- if he wants to hold a grudge from a game in the past, he'll look like the ass on the field. 100% agree. Each game is its own entity. Runs, outs, innings don't carry over. Neither should any sentiment (good or bad). Bygones, myy friend. It's more than professionalism, it's character as well. Can't be a good umpire with a chip on your shoulder and drawing lines in the sand.

That only goes so far. Prior knowledge is a valuable resource. I'm nit saying that you go looking for trouble the next time you see Coach Douchebag, but it's helpful to know going in that the coach is a jerk, or that the last item these two teams met there was a problem, or that a player on team A stole the girlfriend of a player on team B, or that team A drilled team B in basketball three weeks ago, etc.

So while each game should start fresh, I say forewarned is forearmed.

[johnnyg08]

I guess I'm not sure why I wouldn't call "foul" on that play if I'm base umpire.  

 

That's what it is.  

 

It's also consistent with other "foul" calls on the field.  

 

I call "time" on HBP, but not on those plays.  It's a foul ball plain and simple.

[Jocko]

When I see it I call foul and signal time. Why say anything else? if it's foul it's foul.

[mstaylor]

I disagree Jocko, I call time and let the PU decide what it is. If you call foul and he was out of the box it causes problem. Usually it makes no difference but why muddy the waters?

[noumpere]

I disagree Jocko, I call time and let the PU decide what it is. If you call foul and he was out of the box it causes problem. Usually it makes no difference but why muddy the waters?

While that's the reason most often given I'm not sure I buy it.  If PU didn't see it hit the batter at all, then how it PU going to know whether it hit the batter in the box or out of the box?

[grayhawk]

I disagree Jocko, I call time and let the PU decide what it is. If you call foul and he was out of the box it causes problem. Usually it makes no difference but why muddy the waters?

While that's the reason most often given I'm not sure I buy it.  If PU didn't see it hit the batter at all, then how it PU going to know whether it hit the batter in the box or out of the box?

I agree. Plus, how does it cause a problem to call "foul" even if the batter was out of the box? If he's out of the box when he hits it, it's an illegally batted ball whether it was fair or foul. If the coach complains that BU called foul and PU called an illegally batted ball, both umpires called what they saw and these calls do not conflict. Here's the Fed rule (my caps):

ART. 2 . . . Hit the ball fair or FOUL while either foot or knee is touching the ground completely outside the lines of the batter's box or touching home plate.

I would think calling "time" in the 99% of the cases where it is just foul would cause more people to scratch their heads more often.

[johnnyg08]

I disagree Jocko, I call time and let the PU decide what it is. If you call foul and he was out of the box it causes problem. Usually it makes no difference but why muddy the waters?

 

I think that's irrelevant.  Out of the box and contact is an out either way.  Not buying that as a good reason to say "time" instead of "foul"

[noumpere]

I disagree Jocko, I call time and let the PU decide what it is. If you call foul and he was out of the box it causes problem. Usually it makes no difference but why muddy the waters?

 

I think that's irrelevant.  Out of the box and contact is an out either way.  Not buying that as a good reason to say "time" instead of "foul"

 

 

I agree. Plus, how does it cause a problem to call "foul" even if the batter was out of the box? If he's out of the box when he hits it, it's an illegally batted ball whether it was fair or foul. If the coach complains that BU called foul and PU called an illegally batted ball, both umpires called what they saw and these calls do not conflict. Here's the Fed rule (my caps):

ART. 2 . . . Hit the ball fair or FOUL while either foot or knee is touching the ground completely outside the lines of the batter's box or touching home plate.

I would think calling "time" in the 99% of the cases where it is just foul would cause more people to scratch their heads more often.

 

I thin whoever it was wasn't talking about hitting the ball while out of the box (aka "illegal batting") but was talking about being hit by the batted ball after leaving the box.

[johnnyg08]

Well, if you have "foul" it's a foul ball.  BU only says it when he's 100% sure.  

 

You guys can do as you wish.  For me, when I'm BU, I'm saying "foul"

[UmpJM]

johnny,

 

What will you call, as BU, when you see the batted ball hit the batter when he has started to leave the batter's box but, from your vantage point, you are not sure whether he was out of the batter's box when it hit him?

 

JM

[Mike Prince]

johnny,

 

What will you call, as BU, when you see the batted ball hit the batter when he has started to leave the batter's box but, from your vantage point, you are not sure whether he was out of the batter's box when it hit him?

 

JM

 

If I'm not sure I'm not saying anything.

[johnnyg08]

johnny,

 

What will you call, as BU, when you see the batted ball hit the batter when he has started to leave the batter's box but, from your vantage point, you are not sure whether he was out of the batter's box when it hit him?

 

JM

 

 

I will call nothing. 

[UmpJM]

johnny,

 

What you SHOULD call is "TIME!".

 

JM

[johnnyg08]

johnny,

 

What you SHOULD call is "TIME!".

 

JM

 

Call "Time" if I'm not sure?  What if I'm wrong?  

 

No thanks.

[UmpJM]

johnny,

 

You're sure it hit him, you're just not sure whether he was out of the box when it him.

 

JM

[johnnyg08]

johnny,

 

You're sure it hit him, you're just not sure whether he was out of the box when it him.

 

JM

 

 

If I'm not sure, then it's foul.  What's there to talk about if I'm not sure.  If he's out of the box, it's most likely the plate umpire's call.  

 

I suppose from "A" I might be able to see the batted ball hitting him out of the box.

[mstaylor]

John is correct, if you aren't sure absolutely say time. I think you should always say time but if you are 100% sure he was in the box then foul is ok. I don't do that and I don't teach foul.