Drop Deads need to Die

[grayhawk]

Pony tournament this weekend and I'm solo for a 14U pool play game on Saturday night. Tournament rules state:

No new inning shall start after one hour and fifty minutes.

Drop dead at two hours. If the game is called at 2 hours, the score will revert back to the previous inning.

We just finished the fifth inning and we are 1:43 into the game. I notify both head coaches that the 6th might be the last inning. Visitors are up 4-2. It takes those 7 minutes to get through the top of the 6th. I notify both head coaches that this will, in fact, be the final inning. Home team still down 4-2, but after a walk and some base hits, they tie it at 4-4 and have bases loaded with no outs. VC calls time for a pitching change (legit - his F1 just got rocked) and as this is happening, I look at my watch and there are 15 seconds to drop dead. After those 15 seconds tick off, I inform both coaches that the game is over.

TD was there and had to sort it all out. Drop deads - UGH!

[semper_fi_72]

Although in this case the game would have ended with one more run, I have seen plenty that without the Drop Dead time that last half inning could have lasted a lot longer.

As always and usually in tournaments, there are games scheduled immediately after so something has to be done to stay some what on schedule.

As you said, call it by the rules and let the TD take the complaining.

[mjr_2013]

Play pretend - there are a couple minutes left and this happens... VC goes to make a pitching change and HC realizes what is about to happen... Theoretically, could HC yell to his runners to come to the dugout, where you would call them out for abandonment, ending the game at a tie?

[Umpire in Chief]

I see what you are saying, but I much prefer drop deads in youth rec ball. Around here one district uses drop deads for their JV games which is a blessing because that is the only thing to look forward to with their games.

[JaxRolo]

Play pretend - there are a couple minutes left and this happens... VC goes to make a pitching change and HC realizes what is about to happen... Theoretically, could HC yell to his runners to come to the dugout, where you would call them out for abandonment, ending the game at a tie?

In a weird kinda way that makes sense!

[AZump78]

Wow-I never thought I would hear an umpire speak against the drop dead rule.

Personally, I love it. But, as you can probably guess, I am not one of those "I'm here for the kids" umpires...

[NFUA_44]

Play pretend - there are a couple minutes left and this happens... VC goes to make a pitching change and HC realizes what is about to happen... Theoretically, could HC yell to his runners to come to the dugout, where you would call them out for abandonment, ending the game at a tie?

In this case it doesn't matter what VC does his team is toast. From the OP:

No new inning shall start after one hour and fifty minutes.

Drop dead at two hours. If the game is called at 2 hours, the score will revert back to the previous inning.

Visitors needed to get up by one, then retire the side before the 2 hr. mark in order to pull it out. Drop Dead times can create their own issues as with this one, the other side of the coin is to make them finish whatever inning they are in, at which point like SemperFi pointed out your gonna have game time issues throughout the day. Pick your poison ultimately, but however it's done, just call it the way then want it, get outta dodge and let the TD's sort out the body parts.

[mjr_2013]

Play pretend - there are a couple minutes left and this happens... VC goes to make a pitching change and HC realizes what is about to happen... Theoretically, could HC yell to his runners to come to the dugout, where you would call them out for abandonment, ending the game at a tie?

In this case it doesn't matter what VC does his team is toast. From the OP:

No new inning shall start after one hour and fifty minutes.

Drop dead at two hours. If the game is called at 2 hours, the score will revert back to the previous inning.

Visitors needed to get up by one, then retire the side before the 2 hr. mark in order to pull it out. Drop Dead times can create their own issues as with this one, the other side of the coin is to make them finish whatever inning they are in, at which point like SemperFi pointed out your gonna have game time issues throughout the day. Pick your poison ultimately, but however it's done, just call it the way then want it, get outta dodge and let the TD's sort out the body parts.

Wasn't it the home team who had tied it up? Meaning if the three outs are recorded before the two hour mark, the new, 7th inning begins immediately, and the score "reverting back" is just going to the beginning of the 7th, which is 4-4? Or am I missing something?

[NFUA_44]

Mrj, you are dead on. I misread the post, skipped right over the part where they went thru the top of the inning!

[BRUMP]

I hate the stalling that comes with the drop dead time. The mound visits, and the shoe tying.

[grayhawk]

Play pretend - there are a couple minutes left and this happens... VC goes to make a pitching change and HC realizes what is about to happen... Theoretically, could HC yell to his runners to come to the dugout, where you would call them out for abandonment, ending the game at a tie?

In this case it doesn't matter what VC does his team is toast. From the OP:

No new inning shall start after one hour and fifty minutes.

Drop dead at two hours. If the game is called at 2 hours, the score will revert back to the previous inning.

Visitors needed to get up by one, then retire the side before the 2 hr. mark in order to pull it out. Drop Dead times can create their own issues as with this one, the other side of the coin is to make them finish whatever inning they are in, at which point like SemperFi pointed out your gonna have game time issues throughout the day. Pick your poison ultimately, but however it's done, just call it the way then want it, get outta dodge and let the TD's sort out the body parts.

Wasn't it the home team who had tied it up? Meaning if the three outs are recorded before the two hour mark, the new, 7th inning begins immediately, and the score "reverting back" is just going to the beginning of the 7th, which is 4-4? Or am I missing something?

That's not really how it works, but the result is the same. The 7th inning cannot ever begin because of the no new inning rule, so the score would be 4-4, but the game only lasts 6 innings.

A properly written drop dead rule would say that if the home team ties it before the drop dead time, then the game ends in a tie. There is no reason to take those runs away from the home team. The TD said that this is the case, even though the rule does not state it. Eventually, the game was ruled a tie.

Also, I have worked many USSSA tournaments without drop deads and these tournies tend to stay on schedule. When you mix in mercies and getting some games started early, there is really no need for a drop dead. In general, drop dead rules give incentives for coaches to artificially shorten/lengthen an inning, which is contrary to the rules and the spirit of fair play.

[Jocko]

I too call many tournament games each season. I'm all for drop deads. We stay pretty much on schedule, but all it takes is 1 ITB to screw everything up. Time's up. Ball game. I'm out. Works for me!

[mstaylor]

I disagree, I don't work as many tournaments as I used to but I TD many. With a 3-4-5 mercy rule and time limits, the games tend to stay on time. The onjly time it gets ugly is if a field has to wait for a field that did get behind. However, the teams know ahead of time the rules so they can't complain. If they do, send them to the TD, that's his job.

[NFUA_44]

Finishing the inning they are in aleviates a lot of the problems. Coaches don't have to play as many games with the clock and the end feels more like how a baseball game should end IMHO. Drop dead just gives people reasons to try and manipulate a win that you might not have been able to earn.

[RC@54OUTS]

I think that all of us appreciate mercy rules but time limits can cause coach's to manipulate the game. I wanted to ask if anyone feels that they or their partner ended a game because of a bad call. I'm talking a clean game. Great pitching and great defense. Score like 1-0. I have to admit for myself I've lost sleep over a booted call. But we are human.

[semper_fi_72]

I think that all of us appreciate mercy rules but time limits can cause coach's to manipulate the game. I wanted to ask if anyone feels that they or their partner ended a game because of a bad call. I'm talking a clean game. Great pitching and great defense. Score like 1-0. I have to admit for myself I've lost sleep over a booted call. But we are human.

We are not human. We are Umpires.

You make the call and live with it.

If you feel you did something wrong, learn from it and move on.

Don't ever lose sleep about something that happened on the field.

Once the game is over, it is over.

Go home have a cold one.

The world is not going to end on one bad call.

Of course we are all waiting to see what happens tomorrow

....

[RC@54OUTS]

Oorah

[kylejt]

If you want to get rid of coaches stalling, or working the clock. go to "one more inning after x minutes". It works. Far better than "no new inning"