Question of the Week #2

[yawetag]

From the Fed rulebook:

TWO BASES (batter and runners)

4. *#Live thrown ball or pitch touched by detached player equipment which is thrown, tossed, kicked or held by fielder

This is also in the FED Book.

ART. 3 . . . Each runner is awarded:

b. three bases if a batted ball (other than in item a) is touched by an illegal

glove or mitt, or by detached player equipment which is thrown, tossed,

kicked or held by a fielder, provided the ball when touched is on or over fair

ground, or is a fair ball while on or over foul ground, or is over foul ground

in a situation such that it might become a fair ball;

There's a difference in these two. One (Mike's) is for a thrown or pitched ball. The other (Jax's) is for a batted ball.

[JaxRolo]

From the Fed rulebook:

TWO BASES (batter and runners)

4. *#Live thrown ball or pitch touched by detached player equipment which is thrown, tossed, kicked or held by fielder

This is also in the FED Book.

ART. 3 . . . Each runner is awarded:

b. three bases if a batted ball (other than in item a) is touched by an illegal

glove or mitt, or by detached player equipment which is thrown, tossed,

kicked or held by a fielder, provided the ball when touched is on or over fair

ground, or is a fair ball while on or over foul ground, or is over foul ground

in a situation such that it might become a fair ball;

There's a difference in these two. One (Mike's) is for a thrown or pitched ball. The other (Jax's) is for a batted ball.

The OP refers to a batted ball

[Umpire in Chief]

I stand corrected.... Thank you.

In FED a pitched ball touched by detached equipment is 2 bases...

Better to make the mistake here than on the field. Now it is ingrained in my head.

This goes back to the thread about why we discuss rules when there are sometimes clearly stated answers in the book if we just look.

BTW - Is this a more recent change that I'm still holding on to some outdated info, or am I just a dolt all the way around? :unsure:

[LMSANS]

I stand corrected.... Thank you.

In FED a pitched ball touched by detached equipment is 2 bases...

Better to make the mistake here than on the field. Now it is ingrained in my head.

This goes back to the thread about why we discuss rules when there are sometimes clearly stated answers in the book if we just look.

BTW - Is this a more recent change that I'm still holding on to some outdated info, or am I just a dolt all the way around?

Dolt :lol:

[mstaylor]

I was answering UIC's statement that stopping a pitched ball was nothing in Fed and it is two bases. Your post included his quote so I thought you were saying that it was three bases and it is not.

[JaxRolo]

I was answering UIC's statement that stopping a pitched ball was nothing in Fed and it is two bases. Your post included his quote so I thought you were saying that it was three bases and it is not.

10-4

[mazzamouth]

c and d.

Doesn't the ball have to be in fair territory when touched by the mas to award the 3 bases?

OBR 7.05b

Three bases, if a fielder deliberately touches a fair ball with his cap, mask or any

part of his uniform detached from its proper place on his person. The ball is in play

and the batter may advance to home base at his peril;

One base - 7.04(e) - ball is in play.

its a 3 base award from the time of touch.. but this only applies if the umpire thought the ball had a reasonable chance of becoming fair..

any one know the correct mechanic on this play or even if the ball is touched in fair territory?...this is fun as we are still going over some of this stuff in school..LOL

[UmpTTS43]

its a 3 base award from the time of touch.. but this only applies if the umpire thought the ball had a reasonable chance of becoming fair..

any one know the correct mechanic on this play or even if the ball is touched in fair territory?...this is fun as we are still going over some of this stuff in school..LOL

Simply point it fair then point with right hand and declare "that's detached equipment"

[mstaylor]

I believe you announce the three base award but let play go to see if there are advances beyond the three. This is highly unlikely on a ball hit in the outfield, obviously nothing in the OP. I don't think I have ever had a thrown glove or any detached equipment actually come into play. I have seen guys try, but I can't say I've ever seen them connect.

[Guest]

In either situation, the ball remains in play with all runners protected to home and the BR protected to 3B.

Fair balls are easy: point, "that's detached equipment" and carry on.

The foul ball is more interesting. I've yet to punch the ticket to pro school so I've got no clue what they're teaching, but I imagine it would be acceptable to sell a repeat of the normal mechanic (point, "that's detached equipment") but I'd follow that with a very strong sell job for a fair ball.

[UmpTTS43]

In either situation, the ball remains in play with all runners protected to home and the BR protected to 3B.

Fair balls are easy: point, "that's detached equipment" and carry on.

The foul ball is more interesting. I've yet to punch the ticket to pro school so I've got no clue what they're teaching, but I imagine it would be acceptable to sell a repeat of the normal mechanic (point, "that's detached equipment") but I'd follow that with a very strong sell job for a fair ball.

If the ball is on foul territory and you judge it fair due to the inappropriate actions of the defense, you have to sell the sh*t out of it. I would be pumping my arm enough so that most would know what my decision is.

ms,

you don't announce the award until action has stopped. Just point and announce the infraction.

[mstaylor]

Good catch, I should have said infraction.

[yawetag]

I don't think I have ever had a thrown glove or any detached equipment actually come into play. I have seen guys try, but I can't say I've ever seen them connect.

I was the plate in a Guiness World Record game, when the F6 threw his glove down on a batted ball between him and F5. I screwed up the call -- I called it dead immediately.

[mazzamouth]

c and d.

Doesn't the ball have to be in fair territory when touched by the mas to award the 3 bases?

OBR 7.05b

Three bases, if a fielder deliberately touches a fair ball with his cap, mask or any

part of his uniform detached from its proper place on his person. The ball is in play

and the batter may advance to home base at his peril;

One base - 7.04(e) - ball is in play.

its a 3 base award from the time of touch.. but this only applies if the umpire thought the ball had a reasonable chance of becoming fair..

any one know the correct mechanic on this play or even if the ball is touched in fair territory?...this is fun as we are still going over some of this stuff in school..LOL

Simply point the ball fair, and then when it is touched just say "3 Bases" while holding up 3 fingers.

[UmpTTS43]

Simply point the ball fair, and then when it is touched just say "3 Bases" while holding up 3 fingers.

So I suppose if there is a detached equipment infraction on a thrown ball, you point and say "2 bases" while holding up 2 fingers.

I would LOOOOOOOOVE to see that as an authorized mechanic.

As in every other base award for an infraction, you point and announce the infraction. When the ball is dead you award bases or apply the appropriate penalty.

[detailshp]

Ok, before I read all the posts, I would have said based on the original question, that only C is an immediate dead ball. If I was working a FED game and D happened, I would have had a DDB. Is this correct?

[Guest]

Simply point the ball fair, and then when it is touched just say "3 Bases" while holding up 3 fingers.

I really do not understand some of the Wendelstedt mechanics and rulings.

[mstaylor]

Ok, before I read all the posts, I would have said based on the original question, that only C is an immediate dead ball. If I was working a FED game and D happened, I would have had a DDB. Is this correct?

D is going to be a three base award but the ball stays live.

[UmpTTS43]

Simply point the ball fair, and then when it is touched just say "3 Bases" while holding up 3 fingers.

I really do not understand some of the Wendelstedt mechanics and rulings.

I know Mazz is at school and I hope he gets an invite to PBUC. That being said, if he was to use that mechanic at PBUC, there would be plenty of WTF looks and a lot of eye rolling.

[detailshp]

Ok, before I read all the posts, I would have said based on the original question, that only C is an immediate dead ball. If I was working a FED game and D happened, I would have had a DDB. Is this correct?

D is going to be a three base award but the ball stays live.

Ok, that was what I was wondering. DDB on D and the base award comes at the end of the play. Hey, I got one right!

[mstaylor]

Actually there is no reason to kill the ball on D, just award the bases while the ball is live.