Hey Blue!!! What's your Strike Zone???

[Fittske24]

The STRIKE ZONE is defined as that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the kneecap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter’s stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball.

Here is a picture depicting the "Rule book" Strike Zone. Each of the 9 pitches, "by rule" are strikes. How many of these pitches do YOU actually call strikes? For the purpose of this let's say this is shaving age baseball, High school varsity and above. Number your post 1-9 and say "Yes" or "No" for each pitch.

[Thunderheads]

personally,I feel 123 and 789 are a tad too low and a tad too high ....not by much ...but ........

See the blue dots...those are more my strikes ....

however, ...the pre-shave kids, the original locations posted are very feasible

Edited September 28, 2010 by Thunderheads

[JaxRolo]

123 tooo high

I am good with 789. I like them low. Bottom part of the knee.

[jim knight]

2 4 5 6 and 8 / just seems to work for me....

[LMSANS]

:home:They all look like strikes to me.

[kylejt]

What level of ball are we talking about here? It makes a big difference.

Me, I like to round the edges, and expand the middle. I also like using the leading elbow of the hitter as a reference point, and moving my top down with the level of talent on the field. Hitting spots is a bonus, as is having the guts to pitch inside when guys are crowding the plate.

[D62 blue]

What level of ball are we talking about here? It makes a big difference.

Me, I like to round the edges, and expand the middle. I also like using the leading elbow of the hitter as a reference point, and moving my top down with the level of talent on the field. Hitting spots is a bonus, as is having the guts to pitch inside when guys are crowding the plate.

remember if ANY PART of the ball touches/passes through the strike zone it can be called . im good with all the numbers for any descent level of H S , and even for LL seniors and big league level . imho all the numbers are touching the strike zone . strike zone is judgment for sure , here in my area i was known for calling too low, so i worked on my mechanic's . there are a few in my assoc/area known for low strike calls ., and they dont mind . pitcher,catcher,batter's make the adjustments .

D62 marc

Edited September 29, 2010 by D62 blue

[okump96]

all 9 are good strikes for me.

[NovaScotiaBlue]

The STRIKE ZONE is defined as that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the kneecap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter’s stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball.

Here is a picture depicting the "Rule book" Strike Zone. Each of the 9 pitches, "by rule" are strikes. How many of these pitches do YOU actually call strikes? For the purpose of this let's say this is shaving age baseball, High school varsity and above. Number your post 1-9 and say "Yes" or "No" for each pitch.

All strikes in my book for HS and up. Actually I'm going to add more numbers outside of the existing numbers depending on whether its is a RHB or LHB. If the catcher sets up a little outside and the mitt does not move..They get that strike from me.

Edited September 29, 2010 by NovaScotiaBlue

[Mr Umpire]

I'm curious about the question. My answer is "We're not talking about balls and strikes. That's enough." Or, if it is the plate meeting, "When he hits it, I'll let you know."

789 appear a little low but that may be the batter images make them look odd. 123 are higher then I like. I think I like things about where Jeff's blue dots are in his image. But, maybe a little lower for the bottom 3 dots.

[Ump29]

All are strikes for me also .

[Fittske24]

Ok, let's add another element to the picture. Also lets separate the left hand and right hand batters. Now, who would still have 1,3,7,9 as strikes? Who would call 2,4,6,8 strikes? Who would call them all strikes?

[Thunderheads]

Seeing this split ...... I can see what Kyle is talking about when he says ..."rounding the corners" ...

In this view, I'd find it more difficult to call 1 and 3 a strike.....

[noumpere]

I try to get them all as strikes. That said, I have a "hole" in my zone, where it seems that the more the pitch is up-and-out, the more likely I am to get a strike. So, to try to combat that, I need to be aware of this tendency and as a result I might not get as many of the balls labelled 3 and 1 as I should. (That is, I overcompensate for the issue.)

[Mr Umpire]

My hole is 36 on LHB. On a RHB, I have no problem but lefties, well that is a different issue. And, when I have an F2 that catches the ball at his side rather than in front of him, that makes it more difficult. Which is why a good F2 helps and gets more calls than a bad F2. They help or exploit a problem area for the PU. Good F2's just make the PU look that much better and doesn't leave him to guessing or overcompensating.

[Mr Umpire]

Ok, let's add another element to the picture. Also lets separate the left hand and right hand batters. Now, who would still have 1,3,7,9 as strikes? Who would call 2,4,6,8 strikes? Who would call them all strikes?

Is that an ambidextrous F2? Well, that PU is not calling 147 on RHB and not calling 369 on LHB. He can't see them. He needs to raise his head above F2's to see the outside corner better.

I still have no issues with calling the corners of the zone rather than rounding the corners. However, my zone is not as high as that image illustrates.

[NovaScotiaBlue]

To the guys who don't like calling 1,2,3 strikes...You must like long games:HS

Call it early, call it often and no one complains

[kylejt]

The rule book strike zone chart is a nice reference point to start with. But there's so much more to determining strikes once you've been umpiring for a while. And the variables, and combinations of those varibles, are endless.

[PeteBooth]

The STRIKE ZONE is defined as that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the kneecap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter’s stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball.

Here is a picture depicting the "Rule book" Strike Zone. Each of the 9 pitches, "by rule" are strikes. How many of these pitches do YOU actually call strikes? For the purpose of this let's say this is shaving age baseball, High school varsity and above. Number your post 1-9 and say "Yes" or "No" for each pitch.

Forget about the rule book definition of the strike zone.

As Kyle said it is simply a Reference point.

The REAL definition of the strike zone is that zone which is accepted for the leagues we service.

No one other then MLB hitters likes a postage stamp. The zone varies depending upon the age of the players.

You said HS varsity and above. At that level numbers 1 thru 3 are a bit high vs. the Modified JV levels.

RE: The definition of the zone is NOT age driven. You cannot expect a 7th / 8th grader F1 to have the same control and command of the zone as a HS varsity or College player.

For the most part you are almost always going to hear some moans / groans as that is inevitable BUT if you are hearing them all game long for the most part means you are NOT calling the zone the way the particpants expect.

Example:

In my first 2 / 3 years in HS ball I did mainly modified (7th / 8th graders) and JV ball. After my thrid year I was promoted to a varsity official. During that summer my assignor also moved me up and I started umpiring Legion and CBL (Collegiate Wood bat league). I had the dish (it was my first time at that level) for a CBL league. I called a batter out on a called third strike and in a nice way simply said "Blue this is NOT JV"

When I had the bases I started watching the zone that was called by veteran umpires at this level and also on my own attended some games so that I could improove. By my 3rd / 4th dish assignment I got better. As previously mentioned I still heard some moans and groans but NOTHING like my first couple of times meaning I was now calling the zone EXPECTED at this level.

Pete Booth

[BrianC14]

Presenting a 2-D graphic and asking "which of these are strikes?" is just foolishness.

My only response to the question posed would be, "Well that depends...."

Or don't you guys bother to read the catcher's mitt? :HS

[Fittske24]

I think these two quotes are spot on:

Me, I like to round the edges, and expand the middle.

The REAL definition of the strike zone is that zone which is accepted for the leagues we service.

See the image below that represents Kylejt's point:

I have been taught that as a pitched ball enters the top or the bottom of the strike zone, a pitch should cover more of the plate to be considered a strike. Thus pitches 2, 8 (covering the heart of the plate) I will call a strike. Now, for pitches that are in or out, or on the "black" I require that pitch to be at or near the "mid-point" of the batters "strike-zone". So in this example pitches 4, 6 I will call strikes.

Now... Allot of umpires think of the strike zone in terms of the pitcher's ability to consistently hit the same "spots". Some umpires may even expand their zone slightly if a pitcher can continuously hit the mitt in the same spot. As umpire's we are trained to be impartial judges. So why reward the pitcher in a manner that penalizes the batter?

Let's look at the strike zone in the eyes of the batter. Most "shaving age kids" (Varsity and above) have played enough baseball to understand what the strike zone is. Most discipline hitters WILL NOT Swing at pitches on the corners of the "Rule Book" strike zone (Darker baseballs in the image). The reason being, these pitches are virtually "unhittable". Not unhittable in the sense "can never be hit", but more in terms of there is a low probability of getting a base hit. From either side of the plate, a batter that puts a bat on these balls will either miss, hit it foul, or ground out. So in my opinion, calling these pitches strikes will put the hitter at a disadvantage, thus giving the pitcher an advantage. Calling these pitches strikes, will tell the batter that he needs to be swinging at balls in these locations. Advantage Pitcher! A good Varsity or college pitcher will pick up on this and begin to LIVE in these locations. Now, on pitches that are low and in or away and high and in or away, this is where the concept of "rounding the corners" comes into play. Take note of the updated locations for balls 1,3,7, 9. These are "hittable" pitches. Calling pitches in these locations does not put the hitter at a disadvantage.

To Quote Pete: "The REAL definition of the strike zone is that zone which is accepted for the leagues we service." I couldn't agree more. My 12 yr old zone is not the same as my Varsity zone which is not the same as my College zone. Although the zones are not the same, the concepts I use to enforce them are. I do not expand the zone such that it puts the pitcher or batter at an advantage or disadvantage. The key is consistency. I work hard to stay consistant on pitches up, down, out and in. I do this by concentrating on working the slot, keeping proper head height, tricking the ball into the mit and slowing my timing down to make sure I "see" the pitch again and then..... I call it!

[Fittske24]

Presenting a 2-D graphic and asking "which of these are strikes?" is just foolishness.

My only response to the question posed would be, "Well that depends...."

Or don't you guys bother to read the catcher's mitt?

The 2-D graphic is only being used to help understand strike zone concepts. It is not a TRUE representation of what an umpire see's when working the dish. I would like to hear what you mean when you say "Well that depends..." Also what do you mean when you say "read the catcher's mitt"? are you refering to tracking the ball into the mitt or using the location of the mitt after the catch of the pitch to determine if the pitch is a strike? Please elaborate.

[D62 blue]

The 2-D graphic is only being used to help understand strike zone concepts. It is not a TRUE representation of what an umpire see's when working the dish. I would like to hear what you mean when you say "Well that depends..." Also what do you mean when you say "read the catcher's mitt"? are you refering to tracking the ball into the mitt or using the location of the mitt after the catch of the pitch to determine if the pitch is a strike? Please elaborate.

7 and 9 (darkened) not moved, im good with , moving 1 and 3 in, im also good for both Lh and Rh . in are local area , the analogy of using an "tear drop" shaped zone , is often used . or an "egg" shape as well . i also will use the catcher's action(mitt) , for some reference point .

d62 marc

[BrianC14]

The 2-D graphic is only being used to help understand strike zone concepts. It is not a TRUE representation of what an umpire see's when working the dish. I would like to hear what you mean when you say "Well that depends..." Also what do you mean when you say "read the catcher's mitt"? are you refering to tracking the ball into the mitt or using the location of the mitt after the catch of the pitch to determine if the pitch is a strike? Please elaborate.

The answer here (bold) is "Yes."

Not trying to be a smartypants, but both are needed. The problem with the 2-D representation is that the strike zone is in 3-D. All of those locations might be strikes (certainly #5 is) - but as I say, "It depends..." - - on how the ball got to that single point. Does that make sense? IOW, I've got to see the whole pitch before I'd just say, "Yes on all" or "No on these ones...".

[JaxRolo]

In a different thread it was mentioned that the strike zone changes depending on the type of bat used.

So can someone explain how that applies to the the diagrams?