Fair / Foul

[Thunderheads]

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=20456551&c_id=mlb

[semper_fi_72]

Time for a eye exam.

[cyclonehokiece]

Not the best point of view from the camera, but boy, looks very close and looks fair. I am trusting the umpire that was right on TOP of it, but I could see an argument and surprised it wasn't more heated.

However, if the thrid base coach had that sort of reaction in one of my games, he is gone. Especially if it is an assistant (since we got a directive not to take any crap).

[Kevin Finnerty]

Any reaction and he's gone?

Man. I don't take much crap, and as a result, I don't get much crap. But coaching is emotional at times, and there are going to be actions and reactions that we can and must tolerate---even from assistants. I'm not saying let it go. It's a fine line, but if you toss a guy just for reacting, you're going to have more problems than you should have.

That being said, there's a pretty good chance that after I told the guy to stop pointing at the ground and stomping around, and he does it again, I toss him.

And, that ball looked like it landed foul, but may have gone over the bag. But to make a definitive judgment from that angle is absurd.

[cyclonehokiece]

Ok, that thought was a lot better in my head. Crap like that pointing. I guess some guys in my association are letting assistants argue, so if we let them do anything and it gets back to the assignor, we are going to have a very thin schedule the rest of the way.

[Kevin Finnerty]

I think we totally agree.

If you take too much crap from assistants: thin schedule; if you toss too readily: thin schedule.

Assignors' ways are sometimes so fickle and unpredictable and irrational, they're almost womanly.

[grayhawk]

Agreed Kevin. Better to not toss on his first reaction. Instruct him to go back to the coaches box. If he voluntarily complies, he stays. If he keeps pushing it and ignores you, then an ejection is warranted.

That said, it also depends on what he is saying and who can hear him.

[carolinablue]

I don't know how he stayed in the game. The umpire clearly told him not to point twice and he continued to do so. Then the manager comes out and he keeps sticking his face in there and they are both having a point fest. I guess the weather hasn't heated up enough yet.

[BT_Blue]

Looked like a great call... and surprised someone didnt get 3 points for an EJ in the UEFL.

[dumbdumb]

Come on Thunder

Go find that old Bob Davidson F/F that had about 10 extra camera angles and got the I love Bob Davidson fans going.

So, we only get some distorted angle that is behind the line rather than a straight on shot.

Sometimes, some people are living with the angels if this is the best angle, which doesn't prove a thing. Other guys get a Stadium where the cameras are right dead on the line where everyone can see.

It's like there are lucky stadiums for a close call and the unlucky stadiums for a close call based on camera placement.

Just think how many coaches at every level are going to go on a pointing rage from now on because they saw it done on this play.

I would have thought the umpire might let the coach (say anything) he wanted which none of us are privy too, but maybe it was the bending way over and almost touching the ground with the pointed finger, rather than pointing with an open hand towards the ground while standing straight above the spot that got the warning. Of course this is MLB and many of the things allowed at this level are not and should not be allowed or condoned at the amateur level, case closed IMHO.

With an angle like that, I defer to the umpire, no matter who, or the level.

[Thunderheads]

Come on Thunder

Go find that old Bob Davidson F/F that had about 10 extra camera angles and got the I love Bob Davidson fans going.

dumbdumb,

I posted it once before .....now it's your turn to find it ;)

[Welpe]

I am surprised that third base coach stayed in the game after continuously pointing like that.

[Rich Ives]

The pro game is different. Don't use their actions/reactions as guidance for amateur games. And don't expect the pros to follow the amateur standards. You can use this as a "how not to behave in HS" lesson but do not expect the pros to follow along.

[HokieUmp]

The pro game is different. Don't use their actions/reactions as guidance for amateur games. And don't expect the pros to follow the amateur standards. You can use this as a "how not to behave in HS" lesson but do not expect the pros to follow along.

I dunno - at JEAPU in '08, they certainly discussed the "don't let coaches point and gesture" just like that. So while I agree the pro game is different than what we do, they were also certainly laying the groundwork to future MiLB umpires to not let that happen. So I'd say the 3B coach got lucky.

[Rich Ives]

The pro game is different. Don't use their actions/reactions as guidance for amateur games. And don't expect the pros to follow the amateur standards. You can use this as a "how not to behave in HS" lesson but do not expect the pros to follow along.

I dunno - at JEAPU in '08, they certainly discussed the "don't let coaches point and gesture" just like that. So while I agree the pro game is different than what we do, they were also certainly laying the groundwork to future MiLB umpires to not let that happen. So I'd say the 3B coach got lucky.

JEA does basic training for everyone. IF you get selected by the PBUC they take you to their place and tell you how things really are in the pros.

[Mr Umpire]

I'm surprised about him staying in the game as well. I've seen some EJ with a lot less pointing but pointing all the same. Welke has more patience than I would have.