Douglas - $$ ??

[Thunderheads]

Question:

With Douglas coming up on the equipment forum again (in the thread re: the unequal CP) , and along w/ one of our own selling theirs on here ...

I wonder what kind of value they have now? I'd be willing to say, pretty high....thoughts?

[johnnyg08]

I would say not any more value than what you can buy them for from Douglas...less if they're used.

http://umpire-empire.com/index.php/topic/26133-douglas-gets-back-in-the-game-new-chest-protectors-and-shins/page__fromsearch__1

Enjoy!!

[Thunderheads]

I would say not any more value than what you can buy them for from Douglas...less if they're used.

http://umpire-empire...__fromsearch__1

Enjoy!!

YES ...BUT ..........you can't get black anymore!!

[T-Rav]

They are worn under a shirt anyways so I for one am not going to pay significantly higher for a CP based on color.

[Kevin Finnerty]

Yeah but I've been told that there are dudes who put it on and look at themselves in the mirror, or just hold it up and stare at it. And for them, black is cooler. And they'll pay a price for that coolness.

[Thunderheads]

Yeah but I've been told that there are dudes who put it on and look at themselves in the mirror, or just hold it up and stare at it. And for them, black is cooler. And they'll pay a price for that coolness.

Stand in front of the mirror, ......with gear on ..............that's strange! :notworthy:

[JaxRolo]

Yeah but I've been told that there are dudes who put it on and look at themselves in the mirror, or just hold it up and stare at it. And for them, black is cooler. And they'll pay a price for that coolness.

Stand in front of the mirror, ......with gear on ..............that's strange!

I thought we all did that!

[Thunderheads]

Yeah but I've been told that there are dudes who put it on and look at themselves in the mirror, or just hold it up and stare at it. And for them, black is cooler. And they'll pay a price for that coolness.

Stand in front of the mirror, ......with gear on ..............that's strange!

I thought we all did that!

sarcasm ...come on Rolando, you know me better than that! :D

[Fittske24]

Black will still be at a premium due to the fact that some will want it, but wont be able to get it. Also, lets face it, not every umpire gear junkie in the world is on this site. There are some that it will take months or even years to find out that douglas is making chest protectors again. So I think black will still fetch TOP dollar on ebay for a few months.

[johnnyg08]

Black will still be at a premium due to the fact that some will want it, but wont be able to get it. Also, lets face it, not every umpire gear junkie in the world is on this site. There are some that it will take months or even years to find out that douglas is making chest protectors again. So I think black will still fetch TOP dollar on ebay for a few months.

I agree with this.

[Thunderheads]

Hhmmm...

I was thinking about maybe dumping mine, and getting a new one, but ...I don't think so. I think I'm going to just get the gap-caps done in gray and put an All-Star Delta Flex harness on it ....

Unless of course, ...someone gives me an offer I can't refuse?! :wave:

[johnnyg08]

I think I'm going to get the gap fixed on mine as well. For $20, what the heck right??

[Thunderheads]

I think I'm going to get the gap fixed on mine as well. For $20, what the heck right??

That's how I'm looking at it.

And, ...you have customization options too!

[JaxRolo]

I think I'm going to get the gap fixed on mine as well. For $20, what the heck right??

He may charge you just a bit more to send yours in.

[Cajuncubsfan]

I think I'm going to get the gap fixed on mine as well. For $20, what the heck right??

That's how I'm looking at it.

And, ...you have customization options too!

After talking with Jeff today I got mine ordered with gap protection and a 15" size. I can't wait!!!

[Tony B]

Crawling out of my hole for this one -

I do not own this CP but here's what I get from reading what you all write. Douglas makes quality gear no doubt. HOWEVER, I believe this is a superior price point for an average - below average protector.

It appears to have a known manufacturing/design defect with the gap in the shoulder area. It is enough of a problem that guys are paying extra for an already overpriced product to fix their defect. And they have obviously recognized this defect and have designed a solution for you -- if you request and pay for it.

Gents, I'm at a loss here. I've seen many of you rip apart inferior/ defective products. Look at the treatment the DavisShield got when it came out. Many of you guys cruicified it. (Before U-E began)

This leads me to believe that because it has the Douglas brand on it you like it and not only accept it's fault, but are willing to pay extra for it, reality check time my friends. I bet if this product came from a lesser brand like Champro, Shutt, Champion, POS, or any other number of other brands you would be demanding that our brothers not buy it until they fixed it.

I'll be on the market for a new CP in about 2-3 years, and as this one currently is I would not select it.

Please somebody enlighten me?

Also UIC I hope you're at least getting a cut of this. I've read here of the guys who are shelling out their hard earned dollars for this. I bet Umpire-Empire is the leading source of their orders. I hope retaliers like Ump-Attire think long and hard before carrying this product.

[Replacematt]

Crawling out of my hole for this one -

I do not own this CP but here's what I get from reading what you all write. Douglas makes quality gear no doubt. HOWEVER, I believe this is a superior price point for an average - below average protector.

It appears to have a known manufacturing/design defect with the gap in the shoulder area. It is enough of a problem that guys are paying extra for an already overpriced product to fix their defect. And they have obviously recognized this defect and have designed a solution for you -- if you request and pay for it.

Gents, I'm at a loss here. I've seen many of you rip apart inferior/ defective products. Look at the treatment the DavisShield got when it came out. Many of you guys cruicified it. (Before U-E began)

This leads me to believe that because it has the Douglas brand on it you like it and not only accept it's fault, but are willing to pay extra for it, reality check time my friends. I bet if this product came from a lesser brand like Champro, Shutt, Champion, POS, or any other number of other brands you would be demanding that our brothers not buy it until they fixed it.

I'll be on the market for a new CP in about 2-3 years, and as this one currently is I would not select it.

Please somebody enlighten me?

Also UIC I hope you're at least getting a cut of this. I've read here of the guys who are shelling out their hard earned dollars for this. I bet Umpire-Empire is the leading source of their orders. I hope retaliers like Ump-Attire think long and hard before carrying this product.

I think you're overreacting a bit.

This is not an average/below average CP. Protection-wise, it protects as well as any other hard-shell CP out there that I've tried (the only one I haven't yet is the All-Star.) It is, hands down, the most comfortable one I've ever worn. It's also easy to pack.

Some people have had issues with the shoulders, others haven't. I chalk it up to the vagaries of mass production--a fraction of an inch difference, and there you go. I took a foul ball off the gap last week with no problem--my pads are tight to each other. Should they address this discrepancy? Yep, but it's not the fatal flaw some people make it out to be.

[Kevin Finnerty]

It's simple: The pads are thick enough at 90 or lower velocity to keep the shoulder and clavicle plates' edges from caving in so badly that they dig into your shoulder bone. But at high velocity, the right shot will be a bone-crusher.

Everything Matt mentioned are why this rig is so good: comfort, lightness, compactness... and at the right speeds, it protects very well, because the plastic plates are so thick. I took a heart shot today (high-80s foul), and I felt it as little as with the Wilson Gold.

I'm on record as loving the thing (it's so friggin' comfortable), and I am on record as saying that it's dangerous in that shoulder flaw area at high velocity.

But a part of me agrees that its mystique is worth more than a few of those $159. And the fact that its intrinsic flaw has to be fixed at an added cost is very odd.

[Replacematt]

FWIW, the shot I took was a foul straight back off a 90ish pitcher.

I just pulled out my CP to see how it would have been situated in my stance, and the answer becomes clear--the shoulder pads are so close to the collarbone plates that the edge of the collarbone plate is in the same plane with the edge of the shoulder cap when I'm set, with the collarbone padding overlapping the shoulder padding. I don't recall asking Jeff to have them brought in when I ordered it a couple years ago, but this eliminates the gap.

[midmoump]

Crawling out of my hole for this one -

I do not own this <acronym title='Chest protector'>CP </acronym>but here's what I get from reading what you all write. Douglas makes quality gear no doubt. HOWEVER, I believe this is a superior price point for an average - below average protector.

It appears to have a known manufacturing/design defect with the gap in the shoulder area. It is enough of a problem that guys are paying extra for an already overpriced product to fix their defect. And they have obviously recognized this defect and have designed a solution for you -- if you request and pay for it.

Gents, I'm at a loss here. I've seen many of you rip apart inferior/ defective products. Look at the treatment the DavisShield got when it came out. Many of you guys cruicified it. (Before <acronym title='Umpire-Empire'><acronym title='Umpire-Empire'><acronym title='Umpire-Empire'>U-E</acronym></acronym></acronym> began)

This leads me to believe that because it has the Douglas brand on it you like it and not only accept it's fault, but are willing to pay extra for it, reality check time my friends. I bet if this product came from a lesser brand like Champro, Shutt, Champion, POS, or any other number of other brands you would be demanding that our brothers not buy it until they fixed it.

I'll be on the market for a new <acronym title='Chest protector'>CP </acronym>in about 2-3 years, and as this one currently is I would not select it.

Please somebody enlighten me?

Also <acronym title='Umpire-in-Chief'><acronym title='Umpire-in-Chief'><acronym title='Umpire-in-Chief'>UIC</acronym></acronym></acronym> I hope you're at least getting a cut of this. I've read here of the guys who are shelling out their hard earned dollars for this. I bet Umpire-Empire is the leading source of their orders. I hope retaliers like Ump-Attire think long and hard before carrying this product.

Tony, GREAT POST!!!

As K-Finn points out, the Douglas is a fine protector for many (lower) levels of baseball. Probably better than most on the market. Yes, it is pricey, but its light weight and comfort should not be overlooked.

The shoulder gap issue is worrisome at upper levels, but is it dangerous? If it is, then Douglas is playing a risky game with a known defective product. The right impact at the right location at the right speed. . . who knows? There is legal precedent for suing umpire equipment manufacturers for defective products. As for the readers of this board, caveat emptor! I think the discussion about the Douglas, pro and con, has been frank and educational. We are all big boys, so we all make our own informed buying decisions.

As for <acronym title='Umpire-in-Chief'>UIC</acronym>, how is he promoting this product? It appears that the reintroduced Douglas is the flavour of the month at a time when there have been few new umpire products. Next month, something else to get excited about.

Pete

[zm1283]

FWIW, the shot I took was a foul straight back off a 90ish pitcher.

I just pulled out my CP to see how it would have been situated in my stance, and the answer becomes clear--the shoulder pads are so close to the collarbone plates that the edge of the collarbone plate is in the same plane with the edge of the shoulder cap when I'm set, with the collarbone padding overlapping the shoulder padding. I don't recall asking Jeff to have them brought in when I ordered it a couple years ago, but this eliminates the gap.

I checked mine last night when I had it on, and the gap is almost nonexistent. Personally, I think the people worrying about the dreaded "gap shot" are overreacting quite a bit. I would trust the Douglas up to and over 90 mph pitching with no worries.

KevinFinnerty, do you have research data to back up your "Under 90" claim about the Douglas?

And to compare the Douglas in a bad way to the Davishield, Champro, or any of the other protectors is just silly. It is far and away better than any of those.

[johnnyg08]

zm, have you been hit in the gap?

[midmoump]

The "gap" is not an unprotected area! The "problem" is where the curved shoulder plate and padding ends at your shoulder near the collar bone. A ball impact will push the plate into your shoulder. The harder the impact, the more its gonna hurt. Protectors like the Wilson Platinum use a thick padding to prevent the impact from pushing the plate into your shoulder. The Douglas has very thin padding in this area, so hard impacts are going to cause you some pain. The extra shoulder plate on the Douglas-Douglas fixes this, um. . . "omission."

Pete

[Fittske24]

Crawling out of my hole for this one -

I do not own this CP but here's what I get from reading what you all write. Douglas makes quality gear no doubt. HOWEVER, I believe this is a superior price point for an average - below average protector.

It appears to have a known manufacturing/design defect with the gap in the shoulder area. It is enough of a problem that guys are paying extra for an already overpriced product to fix their defect. And they have obviously recognized this defect and have designed a solution for you -- if you request and pay for it.

Gents, I'm at a loss here. I've seen many of you rip apart inferior/ defective products. Look at the treatment the DavisShield got when it came out. Many of you guys cruicified it. (Before U-E began)

This leads me to believe that because it has the Douglas brand on it you like it and not only accept it's fault, but are willing to pay extra for it, reality check time my friends. I bet if this product came from a lesser brand like Champro, Shutt, Champion, POS, or any other number of other brands you would be demanding that our brothers not buy it until they fixed it.

I'll be on the market for a new CP in about 2-3 years, and as this one currently is I would not select it.

Please somebody enlighten me?

Also UIC I hope you're at least getting a cut of this. I've read here of the guys who are shelling out their hard earned dollars for this. I bet Umpire-Empire is the leading source of their orders. I hope retaliers like Ump-Attire think long and hard before carrying this product.

Douglas has been making this chest protector for quiet sometime and I will be the first to tell you that it is indeed a quality product. In my opinion this chest protector ranks 2nd on the "holy grail" list of chest protectors right behind the Riddell power. This protector is in use by many higher level umpires including many at the NCAA (Div-I), MiLB and MLB ranks. I would be willing to bet that the majority of these umpires have taken shots and have felt nothing when using this protector. One thing that we have to remember is that no chest protector or person’s body is created equal. Our equipment is there to save us from catastrophic injury. Not all injury. There are times even with equipment on, we still will suffer the occasional bruise or feeling of discomfort. That's the occupational hazard we all face stepping behind the plate. Like I said in another thread, "what works for me might not work for you." Do I think, the gap in the Douglas is a defect....no. I would say it is more like a spot of vulnerability. I see and have seen 90+ MPH pitches on a regular with my Douglas (pre- customization), I can say that I have not experienced any issues with discomfort when being hit in the gap area. Like most on the site, I heard the comments about the gap being an issue for some. Even though I never had the problem, I didn’t want to take a chance so I decided to “fool proof†my Douglas. So in order to make a great chest protector flawless, I made a few changes that would suit my needs. I added gap coverage, and T-hooks to strengthen the strap connection points. I now had something that no one else had….. a custom Douglas-Douglas! (Thanks for the name KF)

The real beauty in all of this is that Douglas made every change that I requested. No offense to Wilson, All-star, Champion, Honig's or anyone else that makes chest protectors, none of these manufactures will give anything close to that type of personal customer attention. I would say All-star is a close second, with how they take customer input during the development phase of a product, but once a product is released no more changes will be done. As my chest protector continues to age, Douglas will recondition it and send it back to me at the fraction of the cost of a new protector. I don't know anyone else that will do that.

As far as the price increase, the original black Douglas was about $120, the TOP of the line protectors today are running around $160. So I have no issues with the price adjustment with the re-launch.

As far as ump-attire is concerned, they won't think to long about carrying it because just last year, they purchased all of Douglas' remaining "black" chest protector stock and charged a "exclusive" $200+ price tag and they were sold out in a few weeks. I'm sure It will be only a matter of time before these new Douglas' show up on their site.

[GerryB]

The "gap" is not an unprotected area! The "problem" is where the curved shoulder plate and padding ends at your shoulder near the collar bone. A ball impact will push the plate into your shoulder. The harder the impact, the more its gonna hurt. Protectors like the Wilson Platinum use a thick padding to prevent the impact from pushing the plate into your shoulder. The Douglas has very thin padding in this area, so hard impacts are going to cause you some pain. The extra shoulder plate on the Douglas-Douglas fixes this, um. . . "omission."

Pete

I own an original Douglas WV. Absolutely love it...but the gap IS a no-padding gap. I took a Big Boy shot right between shoulder "cap" and the curved over the shoulder piece. It was bad, ball on shoulder but could have been worse. I got a WV Gold the next day. Now, given the discussion here I am considering the possibility that on my Douglas the cap may have been manufactured too far away from the clavicle piece. I always thought it dangled funny and seemed to slide down. Maybe Jeff would tighten it, but once burned...

Having said this the Douglas was/is awesome to wear. Light, easy to move in, low-profile. I wore it in all NCAA divisions and all impacts on it were fine. More comfortable than the Gold. But my Gold is starting to unravel...and I am considering a Douglas-Douglas but I'm a t-hook guy and how expensive would that make the rig? I did send my CP and LGs back to Douglas for yearly reconditioning and that is a nice bonus to have the actual manufacturer "make it new"!

Wednesday I worked a DII tilt. My partner, the plate guy, wore an off-the-shelf black Douglas. Looked good under a plate coat and he's never had a problem.