Lindsay Posted May 21, 2025 Report Posted May 21, 2025 HP Umpire Mike Estabrook ejected Red Sox pitcher Walker Buehler and manager Alex Cora (ball two call to Juan Soto; QOCN) in the top of the 3rd inning of the #Mets-#RedSox game. With one out and one on, Mets batter Soto took a 1-0 cutter from Red Sox pitcher Buehler for a called second ball as Mets baserunner R1 Francisco Lindor stole second base. Replays indicate the pitch was located over the inner half of home plate and at the hollow beneath the knee (px 0.50, pz 1.89 [sz_bot 1.84 / RAD 1.72 / MOE 1.80]), the call was incorrect.* At the time of the ejections, the game was tied, 0-0. The Red Sox ultimately won the contest, 2-0. These are Mike Estabrook (83)'s 1st and 2nd ejections of 2025.*This pitch was located 1.08 vertical inches from being deemed correct.These are the 39th and 40th ejection reports of the 2025 MLB regular season.This is the 10th player & 20th manager ejection of 2025. Ejection Tally: 20 Managers, 10 Coaches, 10 Players.This is Boston's 1/2nd ejection of 2025, 3rd in the AL East (NYY, TOR 3; BAL 3; BOS 2; TB 1).This is Walker Buehler's 1st ejection since August 20, 2021 (Nestor Ceja; QOC = N [Fair/Foul]).This is Alex Cora's 1st ejection since September 22, 2024 (Alan Porter; QOC = Y-c [Obstruction]).This is Mike Estabrook's 1st ejection since August 21, 2024 (Tim Laker; QOC = Y [Balls/Strikes]).Wrap: New York Mets vs Boston Red Sox, 5/20/25 | Video as follows:Alternate Link: Buehler ejected after Mike was blocked out as situation handling went out the windowView the full article Quote
beerguy55 Posted May 21, 2025 Report Posted May 21, 2025 "Get back on the mound" "I'm on the F*#King mound!" "I said get back on the mound!" Estrabrook should be a cop..."Don't resist!" "Officer, I'm literally doing the exact opposite of resisting...please handcuff me" "That's it, resisting arrest!!" Quote
dumbdumb Posted May 22, 2025 Report Posted May 22, 2025 and in their ding system, all calls, situations, and ejections, etc. are evaluated and added up for consideration for post season assignments and could be the difference in a WS, LCS, DS, WC or nothing at all. Quote
Umpire in Chief Posted May 22, 2025 Report Posted May 22, 2025 I've been waiting for Lindsay's analysis of this and got exactly what I was hoping for. This has blown up my social media and I've been asked a few times about it too. Not a great situation on either side. 2 Quote
ArchAngel72 Posted May 22, 2025 Report Posted May 22, 2025 Watching the media stuff woo they want his head on a pike now. IMHO he overstepped a bit and should have not stepped towards the pitcher. You want to tell him to knock off the balls and strikes crap then yeah tell him that and then drop it. If he continues issue the "warning" Then boot his ass. Stepping out onto the grass and moving up towards him is an "aggressive posturing move" something we probably should not be doing my 2 cents... 2 Quote
grayhawk Posted May 22, 2025 Report Posted May 22, 2025 This was Estabrook's view, and the video shows the ball disappear before this. I don't blame him for missing the pitch. The rest was...unfortunate. 1 Quote
ArchAngel72 Posted May 22, 2025 Report Posted May 22, 2025 I agree on he call he missed it due to the catcher popping up a fraction too soon imho. Its the rest once he got out around the catcher.. /sigh. I bet we all been there though I know I wont toss the 1st stone =( 2 Quote
dumbdumb Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 19 hours ago, Umpire in Chief said: I've been waiting for Lindsay's analysis of this and got exactly what I was hoping for. This has blown up my social media and I've been asked a few times about it too. Not a great situation on either side. hey chief (if you google the words 'major league umpire news', you will see that they are calling for some umpires heads right often now days after a controversial play or pitch miss. Quote
grayhawk Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 4 hours ago, dumbdumb said: hey chief (if you google the words 'major league umpire news', you will see that they are calling for some umpires heads right often now days after a controversial play or pitch miss. It's the ubiquitous, "Umpires need to be held accountable!!" which means they want umpires to be called out in a press conference and have a Maoist struggle session. It's to sooth the hurt feewings of fans who feel microaggressed in what is supposed to be their safe space. Quote
Velho Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 9 minutes ago, grayhawk said: It's the ubiquitous, "Umpires need to be held accountable!!" which means they want umpires to be called out in a press conference and have a Maoist struggle session. It's to sooth the hurt feewings of fans who feel microaggressed in what is supposed to be their safe space. Not going to argue that silliness is what they are calling for. Penalizing by losing post-season assignments (that seems to happen) is accountability but I think it's a fair question to ask if there is a process beyond that. When was the last full time MLB umpire to be moved down or out? Quote
grayhawk Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 5 minutes ago, Velho said: Penalizing by losing post-season assignments (that seems to happen) is accountability but I think it's a fair question to ask if there is a process beyond that. When was the last full time MLB umpire to be moved down or out? There's more accountability than any fan knows about, but they want public floggings, not behind-the-scenes loss of post-season, or failing to move up the chain. As far as being moved down (never) or out, wasn't Angel essentially pushed out into early retirement? Quote
dumbdumb Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 man, i am looking all over. how many owners are being held accountable by being fired/sacked/terminated/pushed out into early retirement due to performance. must be a nice gig if you can get it. when was the last time an owner got sent down to AAA for performance issues. 2 Quote
Velho Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 11 minutes ago, dumbdumb said: how many owners are being held accountable by being fired/sacked/terminated/pushed out into early retirement due to performance Who says owners are failing to meet their or MLBs goals? (hint: winning is not the foundational goal 😉) 1 Quote
Velho Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 1 hour ago, grayhawk said: As far as being moved down (never) or out, wasn't Angel essentially pushed out into early retirement? Don't know the intimate details (not sure anyone besides the direct parties do) but I see that as a mutual agreement: "The 62-year-old Hernández, who in a statement confirmed earlier reports he would be retiring, reached a settlement to leave Major League Baseball, according to a source, and will leave after umpiring thousands of games since his debut in 1991." https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/40231476/mlb-umpire-angel-hernandez-retiring Quote
beerguy55 Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 1 hour ago, grayhawk said: There's more accountability than any fan knows about, but they want public floggings, not behind-the-scenes loss of post-season, or failing to move up the chain. As far as being moved down (never) or out, wasn't Angel essentially pushed out into early retirement? I wouldn't say I want a public flogging, but I think transparency is not unreasonable. Players get moved down the lineup, benched, sent down, DFA'd. Coaches and GM's get fired. Umpires...keep umping...and umping...and umping. Yes, people who are observant will see that Hunter, CB, Laz and others haven't done a postseason game in a few years...which begs the question of how umpires are handled in demonstrating prolonged periods of not performing well enough to get post-season assignments. Yes, everyone can have a bad month or even year. But when you consider that half of all umpires end up in the post-season, you start to wonder when someone can't crack the top 50% 3-5 consecutive years...and those are the umpires that frustrate the fanbase from April to September. And many of these fans have enough brain cells to rub together to know that there is a whole line of qualified MiLB umpires just waiting for their crack. You can't tell me with a straight face that there aren't umpires in MLB right now who should not be there. I won't claim they never deserved to be there and that they never properly paid their dues and earned their place among the elite. They were pro's. But to claim they're all currently performing at the standards required would be a stretch (whether that's actual judgment performance, or game management/professionalism)...and for some of them, to believe they could re-elevate their performance to appropriate standards would be a leap of faith. No one's complaining about Alan Porter, even if he does have a bad game (which I don't think I've seen)...sure I'm sure there's some bad raps out there, but the same names keep creeping up because it's mostly justified. But there is a group that is far more protected than umpires...how some of these color commentators keep their jobs is mind-boggling. Quote
Velho Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 4 minutes ago, beerguy55 said: how some of these color commentators keep their jobs is mind-boggling. Now that's someone with no KPIs besides shooting themselves in the foot (or maybe very strong public opinion?). Quote
dumbdumb Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 did i hear the name homer mentioned for a certain group. once again, if management had implemented the ABS system used in spring training that was very successful, the pitcher could have given the signal, end of problem and pitch overturned. so E management again with not wanting to get the call correct to start with and implement ABS.. get the umpires to the big leagues quicker and pay them the player minimum in case they wipe out and send them on home earlier and then they would have something to show for their time in the minors of eating peanuts and get on with life. then all of us could go apply to the training camps. Quote
grayhawk Posted May 23, 2025 Report Posted May 23, 2025 2 hours ago, beerguy55 said: I wouldn't say I want a public flogging, but I think transparency is not unreasonable. Players get moved down the lineup, benched, sent down, DFA'd. Coaches and GM's get fired. Umpires...keep umping...and umping...and umping. Yes, people who are observant will see that Hunter, CB, Laz and others haven't done a postseason game in a few years...which begs the question of how umpires are handled in demonstrating prolonged periods of not performing well enough to get post-season assignments. Yes, everyone can have a bad month or even year. But when you consider that half of all umpires end up in the post-season, you start to wonder when someone can't crack the top 50% 3-5 consecutive years...and those are the umpires that frustrate the fanbase from April to September. And many of these fans have enough brain cells to rub together to know that there is a whole line of qualified MiLB umpires just waiting for their crack. You can't tell me with a straight face that there aren't umpires in MLB right now who should not be there. I won't claim they never deserved to be there and that they never properly paid their dues and earned their place among the elite. They were pro's. But to claim they're all currently performing at the standards required would be a stretch (whether that's actual judgment performance, or game management/professionalism)...and for some of them, to believe they could re-elevate their performance to appropriate standards would be a leap of faith. No one's complaining about Alan Porter, even if he does have a bad game (which I don't think I've seen)...sure I'm sure there's some bad raps out there, but the same names keep creeping up because it's mostly justified. But there is a group that is far more protected than umpires...how some of these color commentators keep their jobs is mind-boggling. I think it's the nature of the beast, so to speak. MLB umpires need protection because if they can be demoted or fired, then there will be posses out for blood every time their team is on the wrong end of an incorrect call. Sure, replay has mitigated some of this, but calls still get missed, and sometimes these calls affect the outcome of the game. Are there umpires in the pipeline that are better than some of the current MLB staff? Could be. But people are calling for Estabrook's head and when was the last time his name came up in the news? Just this one incident is enough for people screaming for him to be "held accountable" which means publicly shaming him, at best, and to be fired at worst. Quote
beerguy55 Posted May 26, 2025 Report Posted May 26, 2025 On 5/23/2025 at 3:06 PM, grayhawk said: I think it's the nature of the beast, so to speak. MLB umpires need protection because if they can be demoted or fired, then there will be posses out for blood every time their team is on the wrong end of an incorrect call. Sure, replay has mitigated some of this, but calls still get missed, and sometimes these calls affect the outcome of the game. Are there umpires in the pipeline that are better than some of the current MLB staff? Could be. But people are calling for Estabrook's head and when was the last time his name came up in the news? Just this one incident is enough for people screaming for him to be "held accountable" which means publicly shaming him, at best, and to be fired at worst. I see everything you're saying...I do wonder, if Estabrook did have seven ejections last year, without commenting on anything regarding those ejections, it's possible he is in the realm of awareness, and that this just isn't "one time" and suddenly everyone knows who he is. I can't comment on posses, or the inevitable "homers" who will be first to blame umpires for their team's ineptitude...all I can comment on is me...and when there's a pattern of bad judgment, bad performance or bad people/game management, it needs to be addressed - eventually fiercely. And sometimes, the egregious one-of's should be addressed in some fashion, to at least acknowledge a line was crossed - whether it's this one, where Estabrook really acted as an instigator and antagonist...or the Hunter one last year with Boone being ejected for a fan's words (even if Boone is a horse's ass), they're bad looks, and it's a worse look when it APPEARS that the guy didn't even get a slap on the wrist. On the other side, I have no objection to more stringent punishment, fines, suspensions for continued verbal abuse of umpires. This whole notion of "getting their money's worth" is for the birds...you don't see that nonsense in NBA, NHL, NFL. 1 Quote
dumbdumb Posted May 26, 2025 Report Posted May 26, 2025 so why haven't all these umpires been fired from an honest AAA ballplayers research https://honestbaseball.com/worst-umpires-in-mlb/ and here is another article on why each of these umpires should be fired https://sportsdaynow.com/worst-baseball-umpires/ basically, and everyone knows it, is that umpire appointments are like supreme court justices appointments, which are for life. nobody is saying that both the courts or mlb is right or wrong, but that is the system, so that they cannot be removed just because someone dislikes their decision, and one was just fired at the beginning of the year and what does everyone think is worse, estabrooks or the fired but eligible for rehire after one year situation. so, back to E management. not one person who has the final say, had to pick any umpire going back years and years. they now have even more time to scout their ability and observe the call ups for years and years with their call games in person so, knowing that the appointment is fore ever, don't hire the umpire to start with or you just have to live with your decisions and take the blame for hiring them to start with. why was that umpire from years ago with the nickname ruff guess, no telling what the real name is, hired or not unhired. that cannot be a good nickname. and, just like with anything, there have probably been situations handled privately/quietly, that there are only 2 people in the world who were in on that situation/conversation and someone asked to leave and they did. and if they go to the situation where umpires hear the call with earplugs and then call it and only intervene if the ball bounces like in the atlantic league ABS trial, rather than umpire call it first and then let players ask for review, so everything is reviewable, what happens then with hiring and firing, with all calls, situations etc being reviewable. courtesy of sabr https://sabr.org/journal/article/a-tale-of-two-umpires-when-al-salerno-and-bill-valentine-got-thrown-out-of-the-game/ Quote
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