1st baseman position

[Smckin02]

Can any one tell me if there is a rule that would prohibit F3 from straddling the bag on a pick off play at 1st? F3 heel are on the foul line one foot on the home plate side of first and the other foot on the right field side leaving actually more of the bag exposed fro the R1 to return to the base than if he was in t he traditional position?

Had this in a game this week I didn't see anything wrong with it but the VTHC was not impressed with my decision...

[scrounge]

Can any one tell me if there is a rule that would prohibit F3 from straddling the bag on a pick off play at 1st? F3 heel are on the foul line one foot on the home plate side of first and the other foot on the right field side leaving actually more of the bag exposed fro the R1 to return to the base than if he was in t he traditional position?

Had this in a game this week I didn't see anything wrong with it but the VTHC was not impressed with my decision...

​Perfectly fine if using high school rules, a fielder is defined as being in fair territory if at least one foot is in fair territory. I *think* under OBR/pro rules both feet are required and am not sure on NCAA.

[MadMax]

Why would the VTHC have a problem with the HTF3's positioning?

If you were to ask him, you'll likely get one of two answers...

1. "He's obstructing / not providing access to the bag!" – As you point out, there's more than enough access to the bag, if R1 dives / reaches / crawls / jab steps back... anything lower than standing upright. VT likely has not been coached on how to do any of those things properly, and feel that they're being put at a disadvantage. Now, if F3 is going to play "vulture ball" and loom over the bag, not allowing R1, once touching the bag again, to stand up without leaning on him or pressing a tag on him, you've got yourself a minor game management issue, not a rules violation.

2. "But! But! He's not supposed to do that!" – Ah, the Perpetuated Myth again. He'll likely want a Balk called for it too. In the Rulebook, there is a statement that at the TOP, only 1 player may have his feet in foul territory. Okay, so is a pickoff throw a pitch? No, so where's the problem? F3 can stand in the 1BC box for all we (who enforce the rules) care and receive infinite pickoff throw-overs. It's only at the Time of Pitch that this is an issue, and that player with his feet in foul territory for the pitch is assumed to be the catcher. However, the Rules omit any mention of a penalty for violating this rule. Certainly, there's nothing there saying that "When F3 has a foot in foul territory, and a pitch is thrown, the umpire shall...". All we can do, and some umpires have, is say, "Hey you! Both feet in Fair next time!" And, according to your description, F3 had his heels on the chalk, which is fine anyway.

[noumpere]

"that's a little different, and it's 'against' my team, so it must be illegal."

[Rich Ives]

​Perfectly fine if using high school rules, a fielder is defined as being in fair territory if at least one foot is in fair territory. I *think* under OBR/pro rules both feet are required and am not sure on NCAA.

​The way I read it both feet are fair. It just says heels on the line - one on either side of the base, therefore a legal position all around.

That said, R1 is probably going to knock F3 over when he goes back standing up. Then when the DHC says "Hey what about that?" you can say "Oh yeah, that's obstruction. Runner to 2B". 

[maineump]

Let's see, most of us work a 2-man system. At TOP we both have eyes on the pitcher and ball. Who is supposed to see if the 1B has his feet in the right place? Pick-off is not a pitch, like above, and who cares where his feet are. If he runs into 1B on the pick, then probably obstruction.

Most first basemen move to get into position when the pitcher starts his movement, causing a non-issue.

[Smckin02]

Mad Max you were Spot On regarding answer #2.... I actually laughed ... Maine Ump Those were my thoughts on the situation... I appreciate the responses.. I was curious that I may have missed a hidden rule...

[Mudisfun]

For HS I work solo... No way I am catching this while trying to watch the pitcher, batter and everything else out there.

[Mad Mike]

According to the BRD, Section 255, they summarize the differences between the codes as follows:

FED-- At the time of the pitch, one foot must be in  fair territory. PENALTY: Ball/Balk (1-1-4) Exception: A fielder may go into foul ground to take a throw from the pitcher on the pitcher's plate.

NCAA-- Except the catcher, all fielders must be in fair territory when the ball is put in play. A fielder is in fair ground if he has one foot in fair territory. (2-18 AR; 5-4) PENALTY: A play  is nullified if the defense benefits. (5-4c Pen)

OBR-- Except the catcher, all fielders must be in fair territory when the ball is put in play "at the start of" or "during" a game. (4.03)

OFFICIAL INTERPRETATION 253-255:PBUC: There is no penalty for a first baseman who is not complying with the rule other than to instruct him to do so. Umpires should do that only when the infraction is brought to their attention. If a player, after being so directed by an umpire, blatantly refuses to comply, the player is subject to ejection.

OFFICIAL INTERPRETATION 254-255: WENDLESTEDT: When a fielder is not in fair territory any play is nullified.

OFFICIAL INTERPRETATION 255-255: WENDLESTEDT: Umpires discover a fielder was in foul territory during play: 1) If they can determine when the fielder left fair territory, they nullify all pitches and plays after that time; 2) If they cannot make that determination, they shall nullify just the pitch or the play occurring immediately before the discovery that he was not in fair territory.

Play 117-255: Abel singles to lead off the seventh. Baker doubles. With the two men on, the UIC discovers the right fielder is missing. It is determined F9 was not on the fieldr during the two at-bats. Ruling: In FED, Balk. Bot runners advance. In NCAA, the play stands. In OBR, the inning begins again.

GOOD POINTS ON HERE by guys not looking for this to cause a problem. JohnnyCat's admonition was to use the rules to solve a problem vs. using the rules to create a problem!

[Smckin02]

Thanks Mad Mike however F3's heels were on the foul line therefore ALL players were in fair territory.. I think its a smart move fro a right handed first baseman to align himself that way he is more likely to make the tag providing the stars all align....

[Mad Mike]

Hey, I have no problem with that, if a guys heels are on the line he is in. I worked with a guy 2 years ago that picked this booger on his own when no one was saying anything about it. Needless to say, I don't work with that guy anymore.

[Rich Ives]

Thanks Mad Mike however F3's heels were on the foul line therefore ALL players were in fair territory.. I think its a smart move fro a right handed first baseman to align himself that way he is more likely to make the tag providing the stars all align....

​Why do you think no one does it that way?  If he's straddling the bag he's going to get knocked down.