Placing Runners

[Mudder]

R2, # of outs irrelevant, batter gets a base hit to the outfield and trys to stretch a single into a double, throw comes into F4 at 2B for a close play, BR is ruled safe at 2B, F4 sees R2 rounding 3B and breaking for home he throws home but the throw goes OOP. 

 

R3 gets the plate, but does BR get 3B or does he score?  Is it 2 bases from TOP or TOT?  Is the overthrow from F4 considered 1st play by an infielder or 2nd play by an infielder, or does it matter in this case?

[maineump]

TOT - BR gets home

Where the play originated in the outfield - first play from infield is not an option

[kylehutson]

What maineump said. TOP is only for the first play from infield. Since BR had already clearly gained 2B from TOT, he gets 2 more, sending him home.

[johnnyg08]

This is from PBUC.  

[maven]

TOT - BR gets home

Where the play originated in the outfield - first play from infield is not an option

 

That's not right. The rule references a throw, not "where the play originated."

 

The applicable provision is the one johnny cites: if the BR and all runners have reached their advance base, the award is TOT. Don't care who threw it or what number play it is.

 

OBR and FED are the same (FED 8-3-5, second to last sentence).

[Mudder]

So if there are a total of 3 runners (2 existing + BR) and only 2 of them advance to the next base at the time of throw, then its from TOP?

[maven]

So if there are a total of 3 runners (2 existing + BR) and only 2 of them advance to the next base at the time of throw, then its from TOP?

 

No. In the OP, F4's throw is not his first play.

 

Are you envisioning the BR involved in a close play at 2B, and R2 still hasn't touched 3B by then?  Sounds TWP.

[Mudder]

Sorry my "Quote" feature is not working......Maven, so the tag by F4 on BR at 2B is his first play, and his subsequent throw OOP is his second play, correct?

 

I thought I recall reading that a tag is not considered "a play" for the purpose of placing runners.

[noumpere]

Sorry my "Quote" feature is not working......Maven, so the tag by F4 on BR at 2B is his first play, and his subsequent throw OOP is his second play, correct?

 

I thought I recall reading that a tag is not considered "a play" for the purpose of placing runners.

I can't say what you read, of course, but it's a CATCH that's not a play, not a tag that's not a play.

[johnnyg08]

PBUC:  Definition of a play:

 

 

[grayhawk]

@johnnyg08 likes his new toy.

[johnnyg08]

Terminology is such an important part of what we do. 

 

I don't feel enough officials spend time learning the proper definitions of things that happened on the field.  It really helps your game once one begins to understand some of this stuff.

[Haid D' Salaami]

Wow this is way to hard to read and understnad... it's very simple.. 1st play in the infield TOP.. everything else TOT

[Mudder]

Wow this is way to hard to read and understnad... it's very simple.. 1st play in the infield TOP.. everything else TOT

 

Ya first play by an infielder is TOP, except if all runners have already reached the next base at the time of the first play by the infielder, then its TOT, what am I missing?