A botched EJ situation - how to help partner

[Mike Prince]

From the start I will say this was a very bad situation, my intent for posting this long story it is to get feedback on how to help your partner in an argument/EJ situation. I am only illustrating my partner's mistakes to set up how this whole mess started, not to solicit feedback on what he did wrong, it's brutally clear. I am trying to get feedback on how I could have helped him better.

OK, 9U game, top 2nd, bases loaded with 2 outs and my partner is PU. VC starts chirping about strike zone. I am thinking here comes a warning - no, PU steps towards the dugout and tries to explain he is trying to avoid a walk-fest (colossal mistake #1). This conversation lasts only seconds - VC ends the conversation asking him if PU/BU can switch (ok, here comes an EJ I am thinking). PU says no and lets play ball (colossal mistake #2).

Next pitch is a spinning popup between the plate and the mound. BR drops his bat and takes off. Ball hits ground, spins straight back in fair ground into the bat (partially in the batter's box) and comes to rest on home plate. PU calls foul ball (colossal mistake #3). HC now out to the plate and PU calls me in to help. Problem is I now have nothing to offer because he called foul ball. HC wants to protest, I tell him there's nothing to protest as it's a fair/foul call that can't be undone or re-ruled on. At this point my partner has removed himself from the situation and I get the HC settled - he's not happy but is on his way to his dugout. During this the VC has now come back out to my partner with his rule book in hand and they are discussing (calmly) the call he kicked. I go straight for them and my partner says, "No problem, I've got this" . I say "No, I do" and escort the coach back to his dugout with a warning and a restriction. We play on without incident (at least nothing approaching this).

OK, before anyone says it I know this is at best horrific umpiring all around. This happened very early in the spring and it stuck with me the rest of the season. I worked both the 9U and 10U championships with our UIC/assignor this past weekend and had the plate for both the 9U and one of the 10U games. Got very positive feedback on my mechanics and game management from my UIC which was nice, but the RAT from above won the 9U championship so the only negative I got was "you guys should have tossed that ass 2 months ago". So it's bugging me again.

So, looking for feedback on this. In a mess such as above, when do you step in and take the EJ away from your partner? I had several opportunities but just when I thought my partner was going to do it he didn't and got play going again. I see at least two clear opportunities:

1. When the BU/PU switch was requested. In hindsight I should have taken over here and given a "No, but we are getting a new coach, you are done today" but I was waiting for my partner to do it. By time I realized he wasn't going to do it he had put the ball back into play.

2. When he was on the field with a rule book. Why I didn't do it then I don't know, I think I was shocked to see him out there.

This particular coach got a talking to by the league commissioner before his next game and while we had some subsequent warnings with him (I got assigned to almost all his games, usually as PU) we never strayed into EJ territory again.

I only got this particular partner 2 more times this season and in both cases he gave me $5 to do his games behind the plate and stressed over any close call he had to make as BU - good news is that after many years of doing this he has conceded that he can't handle it and is quitting.

My partner and I were still on the field an hour after the game discussing this clusterf:censored:k. Both his lack of a trigger and the call he kicked. He told me then he never had any intention to EJ the guy or ask me for help, he thought he could reason with him. Needless to say, had I known this before the game I would have told him to go home.

So when do you know when to step into a situation your partner is in and take care of it?

[buddywilshire]

From the start I will say this was a very bad situation, my intent for posting this long story it is to get feedback on how to help your partner in an argument/EJ situation. I am only illustrating my partner's mistakes to set up how this whole mess started, not to solicit feedback on what he did wrong, it's brutally clear. I am trying to get feedback on how I could have helped him better.

OK, 9U game, top 2nd, bases loaded with 2 outs and my partner is PU. VC starts chirping about strike zone. I am thinking here comes a warning - no, PU steps towards the dugout and tries to explain he is trying to avoid a walk-fest (colossal mistake #1). This conversation lasts only seconds - VC ends the conversation asking him if PU/BU can switch (ok, here comes an EJ I am thinking). PU says no and lets play ball (colossal mistake #2).

Next pitch is a spinning popup between the plate and the mound. BR drops his bat and takes off. Ball hits ground, spins straight back in fair ground into the bat (partially in the batter's box) and comes to rest on home plate. PU calls foul ball (colossal mistake #3). HC now out to the plate and PU calls me in to help. Problem is I now have nothing to offer because he called foul ball. HC wants to protest, I tell him there's nothing to protest as it's a fair/foul call that can't be undone or re-ruled on. At this point my partner has removed himself from the situation and I get the HC settled - he's not happy but is on his way to his dugout. During this the VC has now come back out to my partner with his rule book in hand and they are discussing (calmly) the call he kicked. I go straight for them and my partner says, "No problem, I've got this" . I say "No, I do" and escort the coach back to his dugout with a warning and a restriction. We play on without incident (at least nothing approaching this).

OK, before anyone says it I know this is at best horrific umpiring all around. This happened very early in the spring and it stuck with me the rest of the season. I worked both the 9U and 10U championships with our UIC/assignor this past weekend and had the plate for both the 9U and one of the 10U games. Got very positive feedback on my mechanics and game management from my UIC which was nice, but the RAT from above won the 9U championship so the only negative I got was "you guys should have tossed that ass 2 months ago". So it's bugging me again.

So, looking for feedback on this. In a mess such as above, when do you step in and take the EJ away from your partner? I had several opportunities but just when I thought my partner was going to do it he didn't and got play going again. I see at least two clear opportunities:

1. When the BU/PU switch was requested. In hindsight I should have taken over here and given a "No, but we are getting a new coach, you are done today" but I was waiting for my partner to do it. By time I realized he wasn't going to do it he had put the ball back into play.

2. When he was on the field with a rule book. Why I didn't do it then I don't know, I think I was shocked to see him out there.

This particular coach got a talking to by the league commissioner before his next game and while we had some subsequent warnings with him (I got assigned to almost all his games, usually as PU) we never strayed into EJ territory again.

I only got this particular partner 2 more times this season and in both cases he gave me $5 to do his games behind the plate and stressed over any close call he had to make as BU - good news is that after many years of doing this he has conceded that he can't handle it and is quitting.

My partner and I were still on the field an hour after the game discussing this clusterf:censored:k. Both his lack of a trigger and the call he kicked. He told me then he never had any intention to EJ the guy or ask me for help, he thought he could reason with him. Needless to say, had I known this before the game I would have told him to go home.

So when do you know when to step into a situation your partner is in and take care of it?

I don't know when you could have stepped it. 1. He handled it(I guess) What do you do? He asked and then the PU some no, and then you jumped and say your gone! That wouldn't have made any sense. I think it was the PU job to do and he didn't so not much else.

2. I would have tossed him as soon as I see the book,but as he is talking to the PU, again it would have looked odd if after they were talking you then butted in and said "oh coach I know you have been talking to him and I missed but when you came out, but you are gone!" Wouldn't have made sense. Your PU left you no shot at tossing the coach.

[T-Rav]

You guys eject for a coach coming out with a rulebook? I have had this happen to me several times as a young little league volunteer umpire in the juniors division, all of the coaches who have done it were all ejection worthy for other comments. I don't know about your leagues but in my league there are so many rulebooks brought on the field and to the umpires, that they should just be glued to the umps face and every player should have one in their back pocket. :D

[SRP]

You guys eject for a coach coming out with a rulebook?

It's an automatic ejection in our league. :D

[yawetag]

When do you get to take his girlfriend/wife on a date? That's when you get to eject his problem.

[JaxRolo]

You guys eject for a coach coming out with a rulebook? I have had this happen to me several times as a young little league volunteer umpire in the juniors division, all of the coaches who have done it were all ejection worthy for other comments. I don't know about your leagues but in my league there are so many rulebooks brought on the field and to the umpires, that they should just be glued to the umps face and every player should have one in their back pocket.

Rulebooks on the field are a BIG NO-NO!

I bet they will stop doing it once ejections start happening.

[Mr Umpire]

You guys eject for a coach coming out with a rulebook?

Yup. I haven't had one brought out yet. Maybe b/c others do it when it is needed and has put a stop to it. Or, I haven't had a situation where they thought it was necessary (I doubt that though).

When ejections start happening, behavior is corrected real quick once the word gets around. I don't go into their place of work, not knowing anything about what they do, and start telling them what the rules/instructions are and how they should be doing it. They are not going to do that to me either.

[Mr Umpire]

As for the OP, you had no where to step in. Also, if it isn't directed at you, you have to let your partner handle his business. If it is a new umpire, then maybe. But, not one who has been around for a while. They have their method so don't go stepping on their toes.

If the coach brings you into the conversation somehow other than the "switch places" comment b/c that was still directed at the PU, then you can eject him. But, if all comments and statements are directed at your partner, he has to handle his business. If he doesn't, then that is on him. If you do, then you still make him look bad and you do too b/c now you look like a red a$$ umpire.

You have to let your partner handle his own business.

[buddywilshire]

As for the OP, you had no where to step in. Also, if it isn't directed at you, you have to let your partner handle his business. If it is a new umpire, then maybe. But, not one who has been around for a while. They have their method so don't go stepping on their toes.

If the coach brings you into the conversation somehow other than the "switch places" comment b/c that was still directed at the PU, then you can eject him. But, if all comments and statements are directed at your partner, he has to handle his business. If he doesn't, then that is on him. If you do, then you still make him look bad and you do too b/c now you look like a red a$$ umpire.

You have to let your partner handle his own business.

I agree 100% with this post. You have to either be in the talk from the start, or be brought into to. If he had said"YOu guys need to do this..." Or "You guys suck" Then you are brought in, then it is your place.

I had this happen a few weeks ago. Coach wouldn't stop arguing about a call(you was probably right, but it wasn't my call). AFter we walked back to our spots he said "You guys need to take your glasses off" I tossed him. He brought me into it.

[Umpire in Chief]

When do you get to take his girlfriend/wife on a date? That's when you get to eject his problem.

It sucks, but you have to let your partner handle his own situation.

I had 2 times this year I wanted to toss somebody for my partner, but couldn't.

The first time I was with a rookie in his very first game ever. He had the dish and a certain former umpire turene RAT was eating his lunch. My partner was struggling made a couple of mistakes, but it's his first eff'n game. I came so close to pulling the trigger, but it would have looked really bad.

The next time I had a veteran umpire and the catcher let my partner get hit a few times, was mouthy, held pitches for 5+ seconds even after being told to send it back. After 1 particular pitch where the catcher was upset he called time to go talk to the pitcher. As usual I vacated the C position and went to the back of the infield cut out. I could still hear that he was bitching about the pitch. The catcher then yells to me, "You saw where that pitch was!"

This opened the door for me a bit but I didn't do it and just yelled back, "Don't even go there with me."

After the game I talked to my partner and told him I had atleast 5 times I would have ejected the catcher. And as wise and smooth as this veteran is replied to me, "That catcher sucked and I didn't want to find out who his back up was for my own sake." All I could do was smile.

[BrianC14]

When do you get to take his girlfriend/wife on a date? That's when you get to eject his problem.

Sonofa...

ROFLMAO

[buddywilshire]

After the game I talked to my partner and told him I had atleast 5 times I would have ejected the catcher. And as wise and smooth as this veteran is replied to me, "That catcher sucked and I didn't want to find out who his back up was for my own sake." All I could do was smile.

Now that is funny

[Dragon29]

You guys eject for a coach coming out with a rulebook?

This has happened to me three times in the past five seasons.

The first time, I was too green & naive to know to toss the guy. Besides, he asked permission to bring it out and it was between innings. He was wrong, I was right but I still shouldn't have let him. My veteran partner corrected me after the game. Now, I know better.

The next two times it happened (incl. earlier this season) I didn't eject. As soon as I saw them leave the dugout with book in hand I told them they had best put it away, and quickly. Both coaches did (neither got more than a step or two out of their rat-holes) and there was no further conversation so I saw no need to eject.

Now, if one comes out w/a book after I've told him to put it away, I'd have no hesitation in hoisting his a$$.

[mstaylor]

I had a coach tell his dugout to bring him his rulebook while we were discussing a call. I told he didn't want to do that. He looked shocked and asked why not. I told him it would end well for him. He felt there was nothing wrong with it. I told him if he did he was leaving. Unfortunately he was a thirty year coach that had moved into our area. I'm told he was a big dog where he came from but eveything I've seen, he is simply an idiot.

[sdix00]

I am working my way back through the posts and read this one and it reminded me of a question that has been bothering me.

"When DO you allow the rule book to come out?"

OR

"When DO you get it from your bag?"

Do you wait until the HC protests?

I am a new Umpire (2 years, about 50 games). I have managed for 6 years. In those 6 years, I have protested 3 times (all during critical games) and had all 3 protests upheld.

A simple reference of the rulebook would have avoided all three protests.

In the three cases, the umpire said something to the effect of:

1. I'm right, you're wrong. Go back to your dugout.
   
2. Is that a rulebook sticking out of your bag? Don't even reach for it.
   
3. You want me to check to make absolutely sure I applied the rule correctly? Nope, we won't be doing that today.
   
4. And my favorite: 9.01© coach. Read it and weep.
   

I DO NOT want to be that guy. I am not sure how reasonable it is to hope that NONE of my games are ever protested, let alone upheld, but this is my goal. Telling the coach to leave the rulebook alone gives me the impression that the Umpire does not want to see when they made a mistake. It tells me that getting the call right is not the first priority. Sorry for such a rookie question, but, really, what is the harm?

(BTW, I get that I am probably wrong here. I just want to know why.) Fire away.

[Mr Umpire]

I am working my way back through the posts and read this one and it reminded me of a question that has been bothering me.

"When DO you allow the rule book to come out?"

OR

"When DO you get it from your bag?"

Do you wait until the HC protests?

I am a new Umpire (2 years, about 50 games). I have managed for 6 years. In those 6 years, I have protested 3 times (all during critical games) and had all 3 protests upheld.

A simple reference of the rulebook would have avoided all three protests.

In the three cases, the umpire said something to the effect of:

1. I'm right, you're wrong. Go back to your dugout.
   
2. Is that a rulebook sticking out of your bag? Don't even reach for it.
   
3. You want me to check to make absolutely sure I applied the rule correctly? Nope, we won't be doing that today.
   
4. And my favorite: 9.01© coach. Read it and weep.
   

I DO NOT want to be that guy. I am not sure how reasonable it is to hope that NONE of my games are ever protested, let alone upheld, but this is my goal. Telling the coach to leave the rulebook alone gives me the impression that the Umpire does not want to see when they made a mistake. It tells me that getting the call right is not the first priority. Sorry for such a rookie question, but, really, what is the harm?

(BTW, I get that I am probably wrong here. I just want to know why.) Fire away.

The main reason has NOTHING to do with "I am right and I don't want you to prove me wrong". It is not a pride thing for most. Some, it is.

Let's say the book comes out and the umpire is right. But, the coach doesn't agree and still protests. Then what? Umpire's credibility is still shot for the rest of the game. Now, he looks like a stubborn fool who wouldn't listen to reason (Coach's version of what the call should have been). No win situation there and it is a 50/50 shot that the coach understands. And, if it satisfies one coach, the other may still call for a protest and the umpire is still undermined. What has been gained by the umpire with the book being there?

Also, not everything comes from the rule book. There are many manuals and interpretations needed to fully understand a ruling. What good is the book if additional material is needed as well? Now, things are real bad for the umpire even though he may be perfectly correct but doesn't have the proper documentation at that time to prove it. B/c it is in another manual or interpretation which will be presented at the time of the protest hearing if necessary.

Again, not a pride thing. It is a perception and credibility thing. The umpire has to maintain both. A coach doesn't. Totally different standards and the umpire is held to a higher one.

You cannot prevent a protest. If one is going to happen, then it happens. To prevent it from being upheld, you have no control over that either. Boards are not made up of official rule interpreters. If presented well, they will side with the one who makes their case the best. All you can do is know the rules and interpretations and where to get them when called upon. Do not worry about what may happen in a protest. It is a 50/50 shot of it being upheld or not depending on how well they know the rules, are willing to listen to both sides, and if any politics are involved concerning the coaches and members involved. And, if one is appropriately upheld, take it as a learning point and don't make that mistake again.

Protests are not necessarily a bad thing. They help to keep the umpires who care in check. They are a great learning tool as well. Use them if one occurs. Thankfully, I haven't had to use one like that but I will if it happens to me.

Edited November 17, 2010 by Mr Umpire

[mrumpiresir]

I am working my way back through the posts and read this one and it reminded me of a question that has been bothering me.

"When DO you allow the rule book to come out?"

OR

"When DO you get it from your bag?"

Do you wait until the HC protests?

I am a new Umpire (2 years, about 50 games). I have managed for 6 years. In those 6 years, I have protested 3 times (all during critical games) and had all 3 protests upheld.

A simple reference of the rulebook would have avoided all three protests.

In the three cases, the umpire said something to the effect of:

1. I'm right, you're wrong. Go back to your dugout.
   
2. Is that a rulebook sticking out of your bag? Don't even reach for it.
   
3. You want me to check to make absolutely sure I applied the rule correctly? Nope, we won't be doing that today.
   
4. And my favorite: 9.01© coach. Read it and weep.
   

I DO NOT want to be that guy. I am not sure how reasonable it is to hope that NONE of my games are ever protested, let alone upheld, but this is my goal. Telling the coach to leave the rulebook alone gives me the impression that the Umpire does not want to see when they made a mistake. It tells me that getting the call right is not the first priority. Sorry for such a rookie question, but, really, what is the harm?

(BTW, I get that I am probably wrong here. I just want to know why.) Fire away.

As an umpire, I will never let a coach bring out a rule book and I will never consult one on the field. What I need to rely on is my knowledge of the rules and I get this knowledge by reading the rule book.

I have had situations where I wasn't 100% sure of a rule but made a ruling which I thought was correct at the time. In almost all cases I was correct because deep in the recesses of my brain was stored a rule I had read at some time in the past. And of course I would look it up after the game to verify that I made the correct call.

So read the rule book religously, and never leave a game unsure of your ruling without looking it up when you get home. Never miss a rule twice.

[mstaylor]

I am working my way back through the posts and read this one and it reminded me of a question that has been bothering me.

"When DO you allow the rule book to come out?"

OR

"When DO you get it from your bag?"

Do you wait until the HC protests?

I am a new Umpire (2 years, about 50 games). I have managed for 6 years. In those 6 years, I have protested 3 times (all during critical games) and had all 3 protests upheld.

A simple reference of the rulebook would have avoided all three protests.

In the three cases, the umpire said something to the effect of:

1. I'm right, you're wrong. Go back to your dugout.
   
2. Is that a rulebook sticking out of your bag? Don't even reach for it.
   
3. You want me to check to make absolutely sure I applied the rule correctly? Nope, we won't be doing that today.
   
4. And my favorite: 9.01© coach. Read it and weep.
   

I DO NOT want to be that guy. I am not sure how reasonable it is to hope that NONE of my games are ever protested, let alone upheld, but this is my goal. Telling the coach to leave the rulebook alone gives me the impression that the Umpire does not want to see when they made a mistake. It tells me that getting the call right is not the first priority. Sorry for such a rookie question, but, really, what is the harm?

(BTW, I get that I am probably wrong here. I just want to know why.) Fire away.

An excellent question and since it was my post I will respond with what I have been taught by professional umpires and I teach to my group. Not allowing a rulebook to be brought out is twofold. First it shows up the umpire and hurts his credibility, whether he is right or wrong. Second, many times finding the answer is not always easy. Sometimes you have to piece several rules together for a ruling. Other times you need the interp manuals mentioned above to understand the correct ruling.

Next, a protest is not a bad thing. If you search my name and protests I have posted about them in many threads. If a manager questions your ruling, let him tell you what he thinks happened and how it shoould be called. Then tell him what you have and why. You can then have a brief discussion, when it is apparent that will not be a meeting of the minds tell him to return to the dugout unless he wants to protest. If he wants to protest then let him. At that point get together with your partner and make sure you both agree and that you have the correct ruling. If this is yes, then take the protest, mark the book and continue the game. The only that happens from a protest is the manager learns something or you will learn something. How is this a bad thing?

Welcome to the board and to the advocation. We need new guys that are interested in umpiring and learning the proper way to do it.

I almost forgot the 9.01c reference. This is a mark of an umpire with too little rules knowledge. 9.01c is for situations where there is no rule to cover it. This should be an once or twice in a career occurance. There are few things that will happen that isn't covered, it's just a matter of knowing the proper rule. Too many guys that don't really know as much as they think do will envoke 9.01c to cover their lack of knowledge. The other thing they do is refuse protests on the grounds that it is a judgment call. While you can't protest judgment many things can be.

For instance, a balk, some are judgment, others are rules violations. If an umpire balks a pitcher for not stopping, it is his opinion that the pitcher didn't stop. Now if he says he stepped to second but didn't throw then that is an incorrect rules interp and can be protested. The flip side, the pitcher steps to second, doesn't throw and the manager thinks it is a balk he can protest if he wants. Don't get bent out of shape, take the protest, discuss with your partner and finish the game.

Edited November 18, 2010 by mstaylor

[kylejt]

I actually look forward to protests, and encourage them from the managers at our park. It shows that they're thinking, instead of yelling. I train a lot of Junior umpires, who may not get the rules right all the time. I also train the managers on the proper procedures for protesting calls. Everyone has part to perform in this little dance, and it's nice when the choreography goes right.

[jjb]

I wish the coaches would protest more often: a protest ends the conversation then and there, without the muttering and chirping from the dugout.

As my brother from Atlanta said, one of the reasons we don't allow rules books to be brought out onto the field is because it delays the game. The answer my be in several sections of the book, and we don't want everyone standing around while we flip through page after page. And, as he said, the answer may be in J/R or elsewhere: nobody's going to have those book in the dugout. Rules Interps are for afterward, (generally with a pitcher and basket of wings). I make my ruling: he doesn't agree, he protests, and we move on.

[mstaylor]

I actually look forward to protests, and encourage them from the managers at our park. It shows that they're thinking, instead of yelling. I train a lot of Junior umpires, who may not get the rules right all the time. I also train the managers on the proper procedures for protesting calls. Everyone has part to perform in this little dance, and it's nice when the choreography goes right.

Excellent post Kyle. I also encourage managers to protest, I tell them this in clinics and on the field. Many are afraid to protest because they are fearful that the umpire will take it out on their team. I expalin that an umpire that does this is lacking confidence or is out there for the wrong reason. We do not take sides, we don't care who wins. To take a manager's shortcomings and try to change calls is BS. I don't care if I get protested, I will even suggest it, but if a manager is being a problem then I just get rid of him. Either send him to the dugout or the parking lot as needed.

[Rich Ives]

Countretpoints - mostly applicable in youth ball where both coaches and umpires are probably not as experienced.:

Refusing to consult the book can make the umpire look (pick one or more)

pigheaded, arrogant, cocky in the eyes of the coaches and fans. Take a couple of minutes and look it up. You're probably right, but at least you've made an effort. If you're on the league staff and not from outside you'll really benefit reputation-wise.

Forcing a protest and a return-some-other-time can be disruptive to team and park schedules. Sometimes it can be solved on the spot. Being able to show a coach in the book that a base award is two bases from the runner's position at the time and not "one-plus-one" saves time for everyone. Being able to show an umpire that an IFF doesn't have to come down within the infield saves time and a reschedule. So take the time - even if you have a hot date after the game.

Don't forget that in the "add a run" game in MLB, the umpires found their error by looking at the book between innings.

(Kyle: What is the manager's success percentage in your league?)

[mstaylor]

I don't disagree that at the point of protest, especially in youth sports, if you want to check the book, UMPIRES ONLY, then go for it. It does require you to do everything you can to avoid a protest so discussing with your partner is a must and looking at the book is an option. The problem is sometimes finding an answer is not obvious and can make you look more inept because you couldn't find it.

An example: In 5 minutes or less find the quote in the book that says a bounced pitch can't be a strike.

Rich and Stan are exempt, let the others guys do it.

[PeteBooth]

During this the VC has now come back out to my partner with his rule book in hand and they are discussing (calmly) the call he kicked. I go straight for them and my partner says, "No problem, I've got this" . I say "No, I do" and escort the coach back to his dugout with a warning and a restriction. We play on without incident (at least nothing approaching this).

The VC came to YOUR partner and you go straight for them

Why?

It's NOT your place. Also, why are YOU giving a warning and a restriction? Did the VC approach YOU with the rule-book?

1. When the BU/PU switch was requested. In hindsight I should have taken over here and given a "No, but we are getting a new coach, you are done today" but I was waiting for my partner to do it. By time I realized he wasn't going to do it he had put the ball back into play.

No you should NOT have taken over. It's NOT your place.

2. When he was on the field with a rule book. Why I didn't do it then I don't know, I think I was shocked to see him out there.

Again NOT your place.

You get involved when the following happens

1. Your partner gets into a HEATED argument with a coach. You then come in to protect your partner and calm things down.

2. During a heated exchange your partner tosses an angry coach. YOU escort the coach away from the premises.

3. Someone utters an F bomb where EVERYONE hears it.

There are probably some others but the point is this.

Your partner has to "speak for himself"

Now I recommend being NEAR the conversation just in case a report has to be filed and you can attest to the situation.

My partner and I were still on the field an hour after the game discussing this clusterf:censored:k.

What in "GOD's earth" are you and your partner hanging around the field for? GET OUT OF DODGE. If you want to discuss the game do it at your car AWAY from everybody NOT at the field.

Pete Booth

[Mr Umpire]

Countretpoints - mostly applicable in youth ball where both coaches and umpires are probably not as experienced.:

Refusing to consult the book can make the umpire look (pick one or more)

pigheaded, arrogant, cocky in the eyes of the coaches and fans. Take a couple of minutes and look it up. You're probably right, but at least you've made an effort. If you're on the league staff and not from outside you'll really benefit reputation-wise.

Forcing a protest and a return-some-other-time can be disruptive to team and park schedules. Sometimes it can be solved on the spot. Being able to show a coach in the book that a base award is two bases from the runner's position at the time and not "one-plus-one" saves time for everyone. Being able to show an umpire that an IFF doesn't have to come down within the infield saves time and a reschedule. So take the time - even if you have a hot date after the game.

Park's schedule, not of concern to the coaches or umpires. Don't really care. And, this is something that a coach and an umpire are not going to see eye to eye on. The umpire has to keep the game moving. A coach doesn't just to try and get 1 extra run right then.

Don't forget that in the "add a run" game in MLB, the umpires found their error by looking at the book between innings.

That may be. But, no one brought it to them on the field. And, no one knew what they were doing at the time, did they? And, that was only to confer if they were still correct. The protest was filed anyway and I think it became a moot point b/c the same team won, I think. Plus, b/c the protest became moot, no one knows what the official ruling would have been. Thus, no case about it to prove the umpires were correct or not.