Infield Fly Rule Confusion

[Mr Umpire]

Well the next time I have do one of these games again I'll remember your cocky posts about making up rules! B)

Cocky? Are you kidding?

I am one of those trying to get things right like many others who are part of this site. And, you think I am cocky? The cocky one is the one who gets it wrong, will not learn they are getting it wrong, and will not do things correctly. I wonder who this is describing RIGHT NOW. You openly admitted you did it wrong and will continue to do it wrong.

Being instructional DOES NOT mean to do things wrong. It means to do it right and then inform them of why it was done this way. You have NOT been instructional. You have been DETRIMENTAL to the umpiring profession. Now, those who will do it right for this league have to undo what you have done. That is being COCKY.

I am working to do my part. Learn to do it right and ACTUALLY do it right. You are undermining my efforts and the efforts of all the others trying to do this very thing. And, you are calling me cocky?

I have openly admitted when I was wrong on this site. You are doing it wrong and insist to keep doing it wrong. So, I ask again, who is being the cocky, arrogant one?

Learn the rules. Call the rules. Explain the rules. But, don't make up the rules(this part is being cocky and arrogant and WRONG).

[Nate]

I'm done with this.

[noumpere]

Basically this is a below-rec league for kids. There's no pitching, the coaches know nothing, but the umpire fee is $35.

I assume you post this because $35 is a lot for your area / level. If so, then that's one example of an umpire who does this (just / primarily) for the money.

FWIW, I agree with Mr Umpire on this thread. Your explanation of the rule was good, but you should then enforce the rule, not put the runners back.

[Nate]

I assume you post this because $35 is a lot for your area / level. If so, then that's one example of an umpire who does this (just / primarily) for the money.

FWIW, I agree with Mr Umpire on this thread. Your explanation of the rule was good, but you should then enforce the rule, not put the runners back.

This is my only job. I love baseball, but with this econmeny, I've lost my job and the only way of income is baseball, so this year I'm taking whatever I can get. Call me what you'd like but I have no other source of income right now.

[BT_Blue]

This is my only job. I love baseball, but with this econmeny, I've lost my job and the only way of income is baseball, so this year I'm taking whatever I can get. Call me what you'd like but I have no other source of income right now.

Join the crowd. I lost my job as a poker dealer shortly after the start of the HS season so I couldnt get any of those games and all the JuCo games had been assigned beyond the ones I got so there went that.

If you dont want to work a league I personally recommend that you dont. It will do nothing but make you jaded about that league and those ball players and, honestly, it does neither you nor them any good.

Now on to the situation at hand. I understand why you did what you did. You thought that by backing things up that you would make things even. However a problem arises. Than that is what Mr. Umpire is getting at. You enforced only half the rule. You still called the batter out for the IFF but you let the second half go which was that the runners, by rule, can advance at their own risk and must be tagged to be put out.

As you said, this is an instructional league. I put it to you to think how the players would learn better. By seeing the complete rule being used and enforced or enforcing half the rule and explaining the rest.

Sit back and think about it and I think you might see what Mr. Umpire was saying. Enforce the whole rule and then if asked explain what happened and why. They will learn better. Also these kids are old enough to understand what happened.

Just my humble opinion.

[Nate]

Join the crowd. I lost my job as a poker dealer shortly after the start of the HS season so I couldnt get any of those games and all the JuCo games had been assigned beyond the ones I got so there went that.

If you dont want to work a league I personally recommend that you dont. It will do nothing but make you jaded about that league and those ball players and, honestly, it does neither you nor them any good.

Now on to the situation at hand. I understand why you did what you did. You thought that by backing things up that you would make things even. However a problem arises. Than that is what Mr. Umpire is getting at. You enforced only half the rule. You still called the batter out for the IFF but you let the second half go which was that the runners, by rule, can advance at their own risk and must be tagged to be put out.

As you said, this is an instructional league. I put it to you to think how the players would learn better. By seeing the complete rule being used and enforced or enforcing half the rule and explaining the rest.

Sit back and think about it and I think you might see what Mr. Umpire was saying. Enforce the whole rule and then if asked explain what happened and why. They will learn better. Also these kids are old enough to understand what happened.

Just my humble opinion.

I realize what you said and what Mr Umpire said. I was quick to get upset with someone being rather rude with the explanation. This was the first time I have ever done something like this, and I don't plan on working this league next year. I said last year I wasn't going to do it again, but with me losing my job, I took about 5 games just to fill the days I had off.

Hopefully next year (when I have a job) I will just do high school, and competitive baseball.

Nate

[Umpire in Chief]

Hopefully next year (when I have a job) I will just do high school, and competitive baseball.

Nate

Dont assume that just b/c it's HS that it will be competitive ball. I get some games which make me wonder... :shakehead:

[treedog24]

When in instructional leagues the best way for you to instruct and kids, coaches to learn is by enforcing the rules as they are written and interpertated (sp). When a player or coach gets burned by a rule they won't get burned a second time (unless they are a moron, in which case you can't teach moron).

BTW, why is the IFR so difficult to understand it has to happen at least once a week in the youth leagues?

[mstaylor]

A couple of years ago I covered some 9/10 LL games for my boss and a coworker, both coached in the same league. I called a couple of IP which I had to explain. The coaches do most o the umpiring in that league and my boss gave me grief because the coach that I called the IP against learned the rule well. He bacame an IP monster. My boss laughingly gave me a fit for creating the monster.

[Nate]

Dont assume that just b/c it's HS that it will be competitive ball. I get some games which make me wonder...

I know.. I've had a JV game go 3.5 hours this year.. I'm just not going to take this league next year.. there are two competitive leagues here and this instructional one..

[BT_Blue]

Dont assume that just b/c it's HS that it will be competitive ball. I get some games which make me wonder...

Heck, there are some "varsity" games that are worse then an instructional league game.

By the way, Michael, what is an IP?

[mstaylor]

60ft LL doesn't have balks, anything that would be a balk in 90ft is an illegal pitch in 60ft.

[Nate]

60ft LL doesn't have balks, anything that would be a balk in 90ft is an illegal pitch in 60ft.

In this area there's balks on the 60ft diamonds.

[BT_Blue]

we have balks in the mustang and bronco divisions of pony baseball here in the Long Beach area. However in those levels it is a warning for the first time and then balks for the rest of the game... and this is per pitcher.

[mstaylor]

we have balks in the mustang and bronco divisions of pony baseball here in the Long Beach area. However in those levels it is a warning for the first time and then balks for the rest of the game... and this is per pitcher.

I understand that you are doing what the league asks but what purpose does it serve to warn them. My point was always there at least 21 types of balks, do you warn each one or just the first one? If just the first one, what good does it do? You warn a pitcher not to step to first and not throw, then he drops the ball while on the rubber. What does one have in common to the other? Just my personal pet peave!

[LMSANS]

I understand that you are doing what the league asks but what purpose does it serve to warn them. My point was always there at least 21 types of balks, do you warn each one or just the first one? If just the first one, what good does it do? You warn a pitcher not to step to first and not throw, then he drops the ball while on the rubber. What does one have in common to the other? Just my personal pet peave!

I agree, but I don't make the rules, I just administer them. I have had that happen a couple of times. They commit one type of balk...warn...do something else and it counts. They remember the one that counts much better.

[mstaylor]

I understand that many times we have no control, the league makes the rule. When I managed Pony the last two years, they tried to pass the same rule. I objected and told them that was a deal breaker. They asked what that meant. I explained that if they pass that rule, they find a new manager, I wouldn't continue in such a league.

[BT_Blue]

Im not a fan of it either. Especially if its a big time balk such as turning the shoulders after coming set or not disengaging the rubber correctly. You know, something everyone can see.

But thats what the league wants so thats what they get. Just like your buddy Larry said, we dont make the rules, we just enforce them.

[Ump Rube]

Wow IFF to balks, interesting thread make-up.