Coach handling player's protective gear

[ThomHinton]

As a minor league Official Scorer for 20+ years I will admit that I have not seen this happen, YET!  I was asked about the ramifications, if any, in the following scenario.

First batter of the inning hits a triple and when he arrives at third base sheds his protective gear, handing it the third base coach. Of course in this scenario the team's dugout is along the first base line. The next batter hits the first pitch high and deep to right center field so everyone assumes a sacrifice fly. Is there a penalty/violation if after the ball is caught, the coach hands the runner his protective gear to carry into the dugout?

I do not believe 6.01(a)(8) is in play here, but my recommendation to the coach was just don't do it.

[Velho]

19 minutes ago, ThomHinton said:

The next batter hits the first pitch high and deep to right center field so everyone assumes a sacrifice fly. Is there a penalty/violation if after the ball is caught, the coach hands the runner his protective gear to carry into the dugout?

Can you clarify the scenario? 3rd base coach hands the runner on 3rd (R3) the gear to carry while the ball is live and the runner carries the gear with him as he tags up and runs home to score?

[ThomHinton]

That was exactly it. Everyone knows the runner at third base is going to score via the sacrifice fly. He wore the protective gear all the way around to third base. Is there a penalty/violation if the third base coach were to hand it back to him as he trots home after the ball is caught and he has tagged up?

In more than 1300 minor league games I have never seen it happen, but as I often say, "If you think you've seen it all, come to a minor league baseball game."

[BrainFreeze]

Not gonna lie.

Saw the topic:

Coach handling player's protective gear

Read this:

6 hours ago, ThomHinton said:

As a minor league Official Scorer for 20+ years I will admit that I have not seen this happen, YET!  I was asked about the ramifications, if any, in the following scenario.

Had NO idea what I was gonna read next.

[Velho]

1 hour ago, ThomHinton said:

That was exactly it. Everyone knows the runner at third base is going to score via the sacrifice fly. He wore the protective gear all the way around to third base. Is there a penalty/violation if the third base coach were to hand it back to him as he trots home after the ball is caught and he has tagged up?

That is wild. I agree there is no assistance being provided.

I can't think of what rule (besides common sense) would be used to penalize the offense, nor what that penalty would be.

 

1 hour ago, ThomHinton said:

In more than 1300 minor league games I have never seen it happen, but as I often say, "If you think you've seen it all, come to a minor league baseball game."

Funny. I say the same thing for Little League Minors (which is 10U). 😁

[Coach Carl]

6.01 (a)(8) is in regards to assisting.  I can't see how handing something to a runner would qualify.  I think of assisting as taking physical action to help the runner move in a particular direction (such as pushing or holding back).

The concern is how the equipment he is holding might affect the play.  If there is no play made on the runner then the equipment didn't interfere so there is nothing for the umpires to do.  

Before the advent of "oven mitts" players used to hold their batting gloves in their hands to protect their hands.  That didn't cause any problems, though the batting armor is much more obtrusive.

[beerguy55]

I have two answers - one as a coach and one as a half-assed interpreter of rules.

From a rules basis, I would say it's nothing until it's something.  If the player successfully crosses home plate and there is indeed no play, then it's nothing.   If something happens with the gear he's carrying to impact the play, especially if he drops something, it might be something.

 

As a coach, this is one of the most patently stupid things a coach could do.  Not only to distract his own player, in the middle of a live play...to open the potential of something like the kid dropping the elbow bad, and then tripping on it...but what kind of message do you think you're setting for your players?

If you're too F*#King lazy to trot this over to the dugout after the play, or hold onto it for a few more minutes, then call the batter who just got out over...or another player...or just wait until the inning is over you asshole.

 

[ThomHinton]

1 hour ago, beerguy55 said:

I have two answers - one as a coach and one as a half-assed interpreter of rules.

From a rules basis, I would say it's nothing until it's something.  If the player successfully crosses home plate and there is indeed no play, then it's nothing.   If something happens with the gear he's carrying to impact the play, especially if he drops something, it might be something.

 

As a coach, this is one of the most patently stupid things a coach could do.  Not only to distract his own player, in the middle of a live play...to open the potential of something like the kid dropping the elbow bad, and then tripping on it...but what kind of message do you think you're setting for your players?

If you're too F*#King lazy to trot this over to the dugout after the play, or hold onto it for a few more minutes, then call the batter who just got out over...or another player...or just wait until the inning is over you asshole.

 

 

[ThomHinton]

It is not necessarily laziness. Remember there are position restrictions for coaches plus new timing restrictions. There are only 30 seconds from the end of the play to the next pitch. Time is not called when a batter sheds his protective gear nor when the 'bat boy' retreives it from him or the first base coach, the clock is running. If the third base coach were to ask for time to deliver it the dugout that 'could' be considered against the batter negating his only one request for time during his plate appearance. As for waiting, that also brings some baggage. The coach can't lay it down creating an obstacle to fielding a batted ball. If he holds on to it, I'm not sure how that would affect any signs or signals the coach might attempt to give to a subsequent batter or base runner. How do you go through a complicated hit and run signal while holding onto protective gear from the previous runner?

[beerguy55]

1 minute ago, ThomHinton said:

There are only 30 seconds from the end of the play to the next pitch. Time is not called when a batter sheds his protective gear nor when the 'bat boy' retreives it from him or the first base coach, the clock is running.

30 seconds is an eternity for a bat boy to come over, even from the opposite dugout, to get the gear - either when the triple ended, or the very next play after the run scores.

You think 30 seconds is fast?  Stand outside in -40 for 30 seconds.   Hold onto a one-goal lead in hockey for 30 seconds.  Or the next time you're driving when the light turns green, wait for 30 seconds before you leave.  You'll see how long 30 seconds really is.  Football teams call plays, have huddles and substitute players in under 40 seconds, sometimes even running out a punting or placekicking unit.  It's forever.

 

3 minutes ago, ThomHinton said:

As for waiting, that also brings some baggage.

Pockets, under back of shirt, use your other hand, etc. 

These are very minor obstacles and problems that anyone with two brain cells to rub together can solve.  I simply go back to the lifetime you have for the bat boy to come get the gear from you.

 

As far as signals to the batter/runners - I can do the most complicated signals with one arm tied behind my back.  If their signals are so complex that they can't have an amputee coaching, the problem is the coach, not the lack of an arm.

If a coach can't figure this out he's either short on cognition, or awfully lazy.

[Vegas_Ump]

At that even of play there should be a bat boy who is allowed to run and retrieve the gear.

Otherwise, as an umpire, use cardinal rule #3: Don't look for trouble.

Mike

Las Vegas

[BLWizzRanger]

I just wished that NFHS rule makers would have taken another five minutes in the meeting and passed a rule that if the batter enters the box with armor on, they must run all of the bases with it. Problem solved with the timeouts to undress.

Sent from my SM-F721U1 using Tapatalk

[The Man in Blue]

Yesterday: kid hits a double, raises his hands, I start to call time.  He goes into the latest iteration of the jitterbug and handjive to celebrate his non-RBI hit with one out.  

I turn to home plate and throw the game back to my partner who puts us back in play.

After the first pitch, his coach is yelling at me for time to get the kid’s armor.  “Coach, I gave him time.  He used it to dance.  Take care of business first, Tik Tok dance second.  We’re playing.”

They took that surprisingly well.