Tag play mechanics

[SeeingEyeDog]

So, while at 2man camp last weekend, we were working on rundowns. I have always liked the mechanic that when we have an unusual and or irregular tag, the umpire should point with the left and then hammer with the right hand, "Tag! Tag! Out!" So, this was the mechanic I used during this drill because I had a tag that I didn't think would have been obvious to everyone in the ballpark were this a live game. The lead instructor pulled me aside and said, "You don't need to point and say tag on this kind of play. How else can the runner be putout in this scenario? He can only be putout on a tag so, just use a hammer and call him out. Now, if you have a force play situation and for whatever reason the fielder makes the out with a tag, then you could consider indicating that you have a tag and then hammering the runner out."

What do you have here, brothers?

~Dawg

[urout17]

I'm in agreement with you S.E.D.  I would think just hammering an out might bring out a coach to say "You didn't see him miss my player, can you get help?"  We were taught to say "I have a tag on the (wherever), HE'S OUT!   You're telling everyone what you saw exactly.  Same as a throw to first that pulls the 1B off the bag only to get it back on before the runner. "I have a foot on the bag, HE'S OUT!  Takes all the guess work out and let's everyone know what you saw. Just my two cents.

[The Man in Blue]

I think this is one of the areas that highlights a discussion that we don't have enough ...

While the basic mechanics may be the same, we need to use different "levels" of those mechanics based on the level of the game we are calling.  It doesn't make the mechanic wrong, it makes it appropriate to the game.

Calling a "grownup" game in a stadium full of people with "professional" coaches?  No, probably not much to be gained by pointing and verbalizing unusual calls.

Calling a youth game in front of a dozen parents and a volunteer daddy-coach?  Point and verbalize FREQUENTLY. 

 

I had a really crappy middle school game to open the season up this week.  I had two different plays at first base where I would not have been nearly as animated with my call if it was a HS varsity game.  Both plays I called the runner safe despite the throw easily beating them.  On one the ball hit F3's glove and was rolling up their arm as the runner hit the bag.  The defense was in the 1B dugout, so they wouldn't have seen it, nor would their fans.  I was very animated with the "juggling" mechanic and verbalized "The ball was not secure!"  On the other, F3 was in the air when the ball was caught, but missed the base coming down.  Again, an almost overly animated "lift and wave to to side" (I did not verbalize that one, though).

I would not usually make those calls "that big," but the lower level of the game, the more people need the information.

[834k3r]

10 minutes ago, The Man in Blue said:

I think this is one of the areas that highlights a discussion that we don't have enough ...

I would not usually make those calls "that big," but the lower level of the game, the more people need the information.

I've come to this same conclusion and worked to change things accordingly. When doing games 12U and below, I'll actually go so far as to say "2 balls, 1 strike" rather than "2 and 1."

As far as the tag mechanic, for me that remains constant:  I'll point to the general area where the tag was made and pull out the whacker and verbalize the out.

[The Man in Blue]

54 minutes ago, 834k3r said:

As far as the tag mechanic, for me that remains constant:  I'll point to the general area where the tag was made and pull out the whacker and verbalize the out.

 

[SeeingEyeDog]

Just for the sake of conversation, I'll give you guys another one...

Close play at the plate, NOT a force. The ball comes in on a low double hop and is up the line, the runner slides headfirst (not Babe Ruth...), we have a cloud of dust, there's no obstruction...you know the deal. I have a tag on the runner's heel with secure possession before the runner touches the plate. I will take 2 steps towards the spot of the tag, take a deep knee bend, focus on that spot in the air where the tag was made, point with my left hand, pointer finger extended and say, "Tag! Tag!"...pause and hammer with the right hand and add, "Out!"

Nobody, I mean NOBODY sees that tag except me and F2. Maybe...maybe the runner felt the tag. So, maybe it's overly dramatic, maybe it's over-communicative. I like this mechanic on this play. I started using it last year after seeing an MLB umpire do it and ever since I haven't heard anything but, "Wow! That's too bad he made an out there...close play.", etc...

~Dawg

[834k3r]

9 hours ago, SeeingEyeDog said:

Just for the sake of conversation, I'll give you guys another one...

Close play at the plate, NOT a force. The ball comes in on a low double hop and is up the line, the runner slides headfirst (not Babe Ruth...), we have a cloud of dust, there's no obstruction...you know the deal. I have a tag on the runner's heel with secure possession before the runner touches the plate. I will take 2 steps towards the spot of the tag, take a deep knee bend, focus on that spot in the air where the tag was made, point with my left hand, pointer finger extended and say, "Tag! Tag!"...pause and hammer with the right hand and add, "Out!"

Nobody, I mean NOBODY sees that tag except me and F2. Maybe...maybe the runner felt the tag. So, maybe it's overly dramatic, maybe it's over-communicative. I like this mechanic on this play. I started using it last year after seeing an MLB umpire do it and ever since I haven't heard anything but, "Wow! That's too bad he made an out there...close play.", etc...

~Dawg

That's what I was trying to say until @The Man in Blue called me out for my...unfortunate...phrasing.

[Velho]

On 8/4/2023 at 10:57 AM, The Man in Blue said:

Calling a "grownup" game in a stadium full of people with "professional" coaches?  No, probably not much to be gained by pointing and verbalizing unusual calls.

Au contraire mon frère

 

[BigBlue4u]

On 8/4/2023 at 8:57 AM, SeeingEyeDog said:

The lead instructor pulled me aside and said, "You don't need to point and say tag on this kind of play. How else can the runner be put out in this scenario? 

What I have here is this:  While you are at camp, do what the instructor says.  When you are done with camp, do whatever you think is necessary.  As the saying goes, there is not one way to umpire.  This is a perfect example.