2 Questions

[Stk004]

I have two questions for you guys. 

1. When do you give the count, in terms of when the batter is in/getting in the box? Do you wait until you're in your stance, or until the batter is in the box? Does it matter?

2. Let's say bases empty no outs. Batter walks, ball is still live. As the next batter is getting in the box he holds his hand up asking for time to get into the box. PU holds up stop sign to keep F1 from delivering a pitch. If F1 makes a pick off move to 1B, can R1 be called out or is the ball dead? 

[LittleBlue]

1- When the batter is in the box and the ball is live, I give the count before as the pitcher is coming onto the rubber because he is not yet taking signs, but he is still looking at me. If it was a foul or time was called and the batter is stepping back into the box, I usually hold up the stop sign, say the count, them put the ball in play. I do that, so I control the playing action and something doesn't happen unless I/my partner are ready.

2- I don't take the ball out of play when the batter is getting ready. If he isn't ready and the pitcher tries to quick pitch him, I kill it, but the ball is live and the runner can be picked off. A good rule of thumb is to keep the ball live and in play as much as possible. Why deny the defense a chance to get an out if R1 isn't paying attention?

[maven]

1. I give the count at 2/1 and 3/2, plus whenever needed (stolen base, 3 foul balls, delay of some sort). The batter should usually be in the box; if he belongs in, I'll tell him to get in. If he's legitimately out (generally after a swing), then sometimes giving the count can move him along.
2. I don't put my hand up. By rule, the pitcher must wait till he's set. If he doesn't, then I'll call time and tell him to do so. If he does, then there's no reason for my hand. But to answer your question: putting your hand up is calling time. The ball is dead, and no runner may be put out. (This is, of course, the primary reason not to do it, and #2 on my list of ways to speed the game.)

[scrounge]

Honestly, I can't say that I've ever given it this much thought.

1. When play is relaxed and we're about to move on to the next batter, give the count, proceed with life. It doesn't much matter, the batter will hear you.

2. By rule, it is indeed the same as calling time, so the ball is dead. That's one reason this is a REALLY bad habit to get into. There's very marginal to no upside, and a bunch of downside trying to explain it. Just don't let the pitcher quick pitch as PU, no need for The Hand.

[Stk004]

How do you guys handle a batter that is taking forever to get set once he's in the box? Does the pitcher still have to wait or does the batter get a 'reasonable' amount of time to get set? 

[maven]

1 minute ago, Stk004 said:

How do you guys handle a batter that is taking forever to get set once he's in the box? Does the pitcher still have to wait or does the batter get a 'reasonable' amount of time to get set? 

I guess it would depend on why he's taking so long. If he's hurt, address that. If it's gamesmanship, tell him to knock it off. If he thinks he's the Human Rain Delay, tell him to knock it off. (The video is worth it for the quick cut: "...goes to the nose/he wears on his left thumb...")

 

[kstrunk]

I'm holding the 'stop sign' up too often, going to address that tonight! Thanks! 

[udbrky]

39 minutes ago, maven said:

I guess it would depend on why he's taking so long. If he's hurt, address that. If it's gamesmanship, tell him to knock it off. If he thinks he's the Human Rain Delay, tell him to knock it off. (The video is worth it for the quick cut: "...goes to the nose/he wears on his left thumb...")

 

He goes to his nose a ton. Did he get some blow from Tim Raines' back pocket?

[LittleBlue]

1 hour ago, Stk004 said:

How do you guys handle a batter that is taking forever to get set once he's in the box? Does the pitcher still have to wait or does the batter get a 'reasonable' amount of time to get set? 

"Forever" is pretty subjective. Too long for me may be fine for you. If there's and issue, address it, but if he's trying to get in the pitchers head, tell him to get in the box so we can play baseball.

[grayhawk]

23 hours ago, Stk004 said:

How do you guys handle a batter that is taking forever to get set once he's in the box? Does the pitcher still have to wait or does the batter get a 'reasonable' amount of time to get set? 

EDIT:  I read it wrong.  If he's in the box and taking forever, I will tell him that he needs to be ready to hit when he steps in.

[Stk004]

53 minutes ago, grayhawk said:

"Batter, step in please."

Once he's in the box, does that give the pitcher the green light to pitch, no matter what the batter does while IN the box? 

[RichMSN]

7 minutes ago, Stk004 said:

Once he's in the box, does that give the pitcher the green light to pitch, no matter what the batter does while IN the box? 

No.

Never allow a pitcher to pitch when the batter is not ready.  You might get some grief from idiot parents / fans, but at least you won't have a batter take one in the face cause he was looking down.

[Stk004]

19 minutes ago, RichMSN said:

No.

Never allow a pitcher to pitch when the batter is not ready.  You might get some grief from idiot parents / fans, but at least you won't have a batter take one in the face cause he was looking down.

How do I accomplish this without the stop sign? Simply kill it if he quick pitches? That seems worse to me (in reference to the entirety of the thread). 

[RichMSN]

4 minutes ago, Stk004 said:

How do I accomplish this without the stop sign? Simply kill it if he quick pitches? That seems worse to me (in reference to the entirety of the thread). 

Yes, call time and step away from the plate area.  This may happen once in a great while, but if you put a hand up you'll start doing it on almost every pitch.

[LittleBlue]

1 hour ago, RichMSN said:

Yes, call time and step away from the plate area.  This may happen once in a great while, but if you put a hand up you'll start doing it on almost every pitch.

Happened to me today in my frosh game. Batter stepped in and tapped the plate with his bat. Pitcher tried to quick pitch him and I jumped out and away and killed it. No need to hold the game up with a stop sign, just make sure the batter knows what's going on.

[ZebraStripes]

6 hours ago, Stk004 said:

I have two questions for you guys. 

1. When do you give the count, in terms of when the batter is in/getting in the box? Do you wait until you're in your stance, or until the batter is in the box? Does it matter?

2. Let's say bases empty no outs. Batter walks, ball is still live. As the next batter is getting in the box he holds his hand up asking for time to get into the box. PU holds up stop sign to keep F1 from delivering a pitch. If F1 makes a pick off move to 1B, can R1 be called out or is the ball dead? 

1.  When the pitcher and batter are "in the game" as far as knowing what I am saying.

2.  I RARELY hold my hand up to stop the pitcher.  The last time I did was a tourney game and a pitcher was getting ready to deliver and I had a batter still trying to get his footing in the valley that is the right handed batter's box late in a game.  I can't really have a pitch coming with a batter with his head down. 

[ZebraStripes]

6 hours ago, scrounge said:

Honestly, I can't say that I've ever given it this much thought.

1. When play is relaxed and we're about to move on to the next batter, give the count, proceed with life. It doesn't much matter, the batter will hear you.

2. By rule, it is indeed the same as calling time, so the ball is dead. That's one reason this is a REALLY bad habit to get into. There's very marginal to no upside, and a bunch of downside trying to explain it. Just don't let the pitcher quick pitch as PU, no need for The Hand.

You give a 0-0 count?  No way man?

Only upside is batter not seeing a pitch is coming while they are in the box.

[noumpere]

3 hours ago, Stk004 said:

How do I accomplish this without the stop sign? Simply kill it if he quick pitches? That seems worse to me (in reference to the entirety of the thread). 

Tell the catcher not to give the signs until the batter is (reasonably) set.

[scrounge]

3 hours ago, ZebraStripes said:

You give a 0-0 count?  No way man?

Only upside is batter not seeing a pitch is coming while they are in the box.

See, that's what I get for typing too fast as I'm leaving. No, not a 0-0. I meant when everything is relaxed and the play is over....I don't know what got into my head about next batter.

[maineump]

13 hours ago, noumpere said:

Tell the catcher not to give the signs until the batter is (reasonably) set.

This is great advice, the higher the level, the more the catcher is watching the batter getting ready. Work a little with the catcher. Just ask him to wait until the hitter is ready before calling the sign.

When a kid holds his hand up to me, I don't give him time or put a hand up. He has to ask for time verbally as well. If the kid is taking a long time getting in and ready, then enforce the time rule on him.

[noumpere]

7 minutes ago, maineump said:

When a kid holds his hand up to me, I don't give him time or put a hand up. He has to ask for time verbally as well. If the kid is taking a long time getting in and ready, then enforce the time rule on him.

I'm not sure where the justification is for requiring an oral request as well.  Either the request is "valid" and should be granted or it's not and should be denied.

Most of the time, I just tell the player that I won't let the pitcher pitch, but I keep the ball live.

[maineump]

Just now, noumpere said:

I'm not sure where the justification is for requiring an oral request as well.  Either the request is "valid" and should be granted or it's not and should be denied.

Most of the time, I just tell the player that I won't let the pitcher pitch, but I keep the ball live.

I justify it when he thinks he needs to fill all the holes in the box, wipe out all the white lines etc. To me, if he needs to be a grounds keeper then he needs to ask for time for it. He has a responsibility to keeping the game moving as well.

[noumpere]

I don't think you (generally) need to have a dead ball in that case, and asking for time does NOT make his actions any more palatable.

[maven]

7 minutes ago, noumpere said:

I'm not sure where the justification is for requiring an oral request as well.  Either the request is "valid" and should be granted or it's not and should be denied.

Most of the time, I just tell the player that I won't let the pitcher pitch, but I keep the ball live.

I ignore the hand. If he requests time, I tell him, "Go ahead and get set, they have to wait for you."

F2 hears that and (almost always) waits for him.

[noumpere]

Different words; same goal; same meaning; same result.