Fan on Field

[Guest Matt]

14U USSSA

 

Two questions:

1. Has anyone ever had a fan come onto the field and argue about a call?

2. How do you handle a coach who will not let a call go? When would you eject / restrict to the dugout? 

      Here is the situation: The RHP has picked off 2 baserunners at 1B. (a) The coach calls time to politely ask the BU if the pitcher is balking (which he wasn't). (b) The HC comes out after an attempted pick off at 1B and said it was a balk and the BU doesn't know what a balk is. (c) F1 picks the next runner off at 1B. Before the BU can even make the call, HC is already on his way out to argue that it is a balk. (d) BU ejects the fan who came onto the field, the PU tells the coach that the fan must leave the ballpark, and the HC tells the PU "ok, but you don't know what a balk is."

 

It is difficult for us to eject any coaches because neither the UIC nor the tournament director will ever have our back.

[ElkOil]

1.  I haven't had a fan come onto the field.  To handle it, I'd stop the game and order the fan to leave.  If he doesn't, the game would not resume until he did.  In the meantime, I'd ask the coach to call the police.

2.  Don't tolerate a coach arguing balks.  They can ask for an explanation, and I'm happy to oblige, but balks are judgement calls and your judgement is final.  Warn, restrict, eject in that order.  If they argue, eject right away if it's profane, prolonged or personal.  Even a very short argument can be considered prolonged if it's not an appropriate subject to argue.

[guyinaredhat]

 

"( you )...don't know what a balk is . "

 

Personal enough for me . .. boom 

[Guest Matt]

That seems a bit harsh. Shouldn't I just start it out like a brand new ballgame?

[Tksjewelry]

Find a new UIC immediately. Don't work for any jacka** that won't have your back. Screw the spineless tourney director, but it's UIC's J-O-B to have your back. I blew some major calls last year, but my UIC backed me to the hilt. He may have ripped me a new one later, but he always always covered my rear end to coaches and directors. 

1)Toss the fan. 

2)Toss the coach. 

3)Join this site and start reading the back threads about tossing, I got a lot of perspective from those threads. 

[noumpere]

(a) okay

(b) "Coach, I've explained it before.  Neither my partner nor I have a balk. I need you to go back to your dugout (or coaching box) so we can continue the game."  I f he says (almost anything) about the call -- toss him

(c) "Don't come out."  If he continues, toss him. 

(d) The HC won't be around for this. 

[ricka56]

It is difficult for us to eject any coaches because neither the UIC nor the tournament director will ever have our back.

Only 3 options I can see.

​Option 1: EJ when appropriate and see if you get invited back.
Option 2: Do not wait to be uninvited again. Find another umpiring opportunity.
Option 3: Continue to eat $#!+, if you really need the money.

If option 3 is your choice, be grateful for the work, stop bitching about the conditions that you agreed to.

[ElkOil]

Only 3 options I can see.

​Option 1: EJ when appropriate and see if you get invited back.
Option 2: Do not wait to be uninvited again. Find another umpiring opportunity.
Option 3: Continue to eat $#!+, if you really need the money.

If option 3 is your choice, be grateful for the work, stop bitching about the conditions that you agreed to.

​If these were the ones I was faced with, I'd choose 2 in a heartbeat.  I love the fact that my organization gets a lot of respect from the leagues we ump.  We should all endeavor to earn respect, and when we do and we're not treated appropriately, don't expose yourself to that mistreatment.

[Guest Matt]

I think I forgot to add the part about the fan. He thought it was a good idea to come onto the field to tell us he's an umpire and it is a balk. Needless to say, he was immediately ejected. 

I hope he was lying, because I don't know an umpire that would come onto the field like that. Everyone around here seems to assume that if a pitcher has a good pickoff move, then it must be a balk. 

[maven]

I think I forgot to add the part about the fan. He thought it was a good idea to come onto the field to tell us he's an umpire and it is a balk. Needless to say, he was immediately ejected. 

I hope he was lying, because I don't know an umpire that would come onto the field like that. Everyone around here seems to assume that if a pitcher has a good pickoff move, then it must be a balk. 

​You can't eject a fan. He's coach's problem, make coach deal with him.

Did the coach say why he thought it was a balk? What was the pitcher doing? Maybe it was a balk.

[Majordave]

The "fan" who says he is an "umpire" probably umpired one game, once upon a time, for free, while wearing flip-flops, jorts, a Budweiser t-shirt and a Si from Duck Dynasty hat and a 3 Day beard.  (Yep, I've seen someone like this umpiring)

Just sayin' 

[Guest Matt]

It wasn't a balk. My partner and I watched closely as to what he was describing. He was trying to say he was lifting his free foot while he was spinning to throw. 

To me, that is not a balk because his back foot broke the rubber. I didn't see him lift his foot, and I didn't see a knee buckle before he spun. 

[noumpere]

It wasn't a balk. My partner and I watched closely as to what he was describing. He was trying to say he was lifting his free foot while he was spinning to throw. 

To me, that is not a balk because his back foot broke the rubber. I didn't see him lift his foot, and I didn't see a knee buckle before he spun. 

​I'm very confused by that.  You have to lift your free foot to step to a base.

 

Then you talk about his back foot, and it "breaks the rubber" but "doesn't lift" and I don't see how you can have both.

[Guest Matt]

​I'm very confused by that.  You have to lift your free foot to step to a base.

 

Then you talk about his back foot, and it "breaks the rubber" but "doesn't lift" and I don't see how you can have both.

​I can see the confusion. He was trying to say the pitcher was lifting his leg knee just as he would to pitch or pick off to 3B, but he tried to say he did it while he spun and threw to first. (RHP)

 

I meant if he did lift his leg as if he was pitching he did it after he broke the rubber. He did not lift his foot as the coach was claiming. The only other thing I thought he could have been talking about was the knee buckle, which he didn't do either.

[maven]

​I can see the confusion. He was trying to say the pitcher was lifting his leg knee just as he would to pitch or pick off to 3B, but he tried to say he did it while he spun and threw to first. (RHP)

 

I meant if he did lift his leg as if he was pitching he did it after he broke the rubber. He did not lift his foot as the coach was claiming. The only other thing I thought he could have been talking about was the knee buckle, which he didn't do either.

​If a RHP lifts his free foot to the balance point, then he is committed to pitch to the batter. If he subsequently picks to 1B, that is a balk for failing to step directly to the base.

If a RHP does not do a jump turn or jab step, the free foot must start toward 1B immediately if he plans to pick there. If this F1's "turn" began simultaneously with lifting his free foot, then he's probably OK. If he lifted the free foot and only then turned, that's probably a balk.

[noumpere]

To Maven's answer, I will add that that if F1 steps off, then raised the leg to (or toward) the balance, point, that's also a balk (for simulating a pitching motion)

[Rich Ives]

To Maven's answer, I will add that that if F1 steps off, then raised the leg to (or toward) the balance, point, that's also a balk (for simulating a pitching motion)

​Anyone that falls for that deserves whatever happens to them.

[Guest Matt]

He did not raise his foot to simulate a pitch. The coach was just an idiot, because his players kept getting picked off. The RHP was just doing a normal spin move.

[Guest Kevin]

if you come across the later in the tourney, toss them at the plate meeting.